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Royce White 2012-2013 Season Outlook


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#1 krupocin

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Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:17 PM

I was thinking maybe this guy would be a good last round flier because of how across the board it could potentially be but now I'm worried whether or not he can make it through a full season. Check out this article just posted on FoxSports Houston, apparently the reason he's not in camp is anxiety related, & he's not sure when he'll arrive.

I've been rooting for him hard because of what he's up against (I went through PTSD as a kid after almost dying) so I know how incredibly intense these issues can be, but I'm kind of worried about how the grind of a full NBA season away from his Mid-Western comfort zone could go. People with anxiety disorders always do worse in warm weather cities because of several reasons, most of all that serotonin production is drastically reduced in consistent heat. What do you all think about him??
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#2 ilikebasketball

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Posted 02 October 2012 - 02:50 PM

Leave him on the waivers until the whole situation is sorted out in Houston. If he's put at the 3, he'll be competing with Chandler Parsons and possibly Terrence Jones and Marcus Morris. If he's put at the 4, he'll be competing with Patrick Patterson and possibly Donatas Motiejunas, Terrence Jones, and Marcus Morris.

#3 ballsohard

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Posted 02 October 2012 - 03:53 PM

Even if he didn't suffer from anxiety, the Rockets depth would make it really hard for him to carve out a role to begin with. Sad to hear, though.

#4 Travis_Fryman#17

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Posted 03 October 2012 - 08:04 PM

I appreciate that article. Royce is local from where I come from, and it's pretty cool where's he ended up. Emotions aside, he has a Boris Diaw like skill set. Diaw got lucky getting Bobcat run early in his career, whereas with McHale. and a pretty crowded front court in Houston, I would pass on him. He should really only get looks in deep keepers. And I'm in deep keepers and have passed on him every time.
Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead.
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#5 krupocin

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Posted 05 October 2012 - 06:03 PM

Travis, Diaw did get run with the Cats, but he made his name with the Suns playing along Nash for those years. I appreciate what you are saying, but I think you are downplaying the fact that Diaw really made a name for himself on a team full of stars (Suns), vs. just getting lucky on the Bobcats. The reason I'm bringing that up is a player with this skill-set is rare & extremely valuable in a league where a big body often just means a big body.

I totally agree with all of you on his prospects in Houston though, & I'm really happy to see it seems this situation is kind of working itself out now that he will travel by private bus, but I'll definitely be keeping my eye on him this pre-season. My big $$ league doesn't draft until the Sunday before play starts (Oct 28) & a guy like Royce in the last round, if he gets PT in the pre-season, could be huge. McHale loves bigs that can pass, and besides Patterson I really don't think any of these guys are a threat to him at the 4 (I see Montiejunas as more of a stretch 4/5 like Bargnani/Dirk). One thing is for sure though, Houston is one of the most exciting young teams in the NBA.
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#6 mavsfan23

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:08 PM

any news on royce? he was a stud in college, and is very skilled for his size. even if he doesn't become fantasy worthy it'd be nice to see him do well.

look up his draft day documentary on youtube. it's hard not to feel bad for the guy.
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#7 Cmilne23

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:06 AM

http://blog.chron.co...king-on-return/

You have to feel bad for him to a certain extent, but sounds like he has a severe mental issues and pro sports may not be the best environment for him. If he can't overcome his fear of flying to get paid millions then he should probably just retire. Why stress yourself out and why force a team to bend over backwards just to get you to 41 different destinations a year? Not fair to the player, or the team. Either get medicated and buck up, or retire and do something else.

#8 mavsfan23

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:37 PM

i don't know a whole lot about him, but from watching that short video on youtube it looked like he had a really good support system at iowa state.

he's not getting that type of support in houston, and probably won't ever get it. he's getting paid now, and from the team's pov i can see where they're coming from, to a degree.

as talented as he is I would imagine there's a team out there that would go out of their way to accommodate him. san antonio comes to mind. would have to be an open minded, player's coach type. most likely a veteran team that wouldn't get pissy about him getting "special treatment".
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#9 krupocin

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:52 PM

i don't know a whole lot about him, but from watching that short video on youtube it looked like he had a really good support system at iowa state.
he's not getting that type of support in houston, and probably won't ever get it. he's getting paid now, and from the team's pov i can see where they're coming from, to a degree.
as talented as he is I would imagine there's a team out there that would go out of their way to accommodate him. san antonio comes to mind. would have to be an open minded, player's coach type. most likely a veteran team that wouldn't get pissy about him getting "special treatment".


I don't know, I read in one of Y! Sports articles (I think Wojnarowski) that HOU was literally the only team who was interested in drafting him, they kind of touch on this by accident in the draft documentary when they are going over teams who would consider drafting him and it's basically like "if you don't go here (#16) you're not going at all". Honestly though, I work in psych now (my background is in med) but throughout my clinicals I met some guys like this, where they felt bc they had a special skill the world should stop for them, but the reality is that if you have a disability (be it mental or physical) it's up to you to prove that you're that much more resilient than the pack, basically give the team NO reason NOT to accommodate each and all of your requests. White is falling into a trap that is hard to dig out of, which is, you saw I have skills (in college), now it's up to you (the Rockets) to accommodate me and my disease. What it seems he's failing to realize though, is that until he shows on the court with other NBA players that he is worthy of the extra investment of time and resources to the Rockets he's just another rookie prospect who didn't work out. I like to think about it this way - imagine if he was like Jim Abbott and only had 1 arm but was a promising PF prospect. Would it be realistic for him to make all these demands just bc he was drafted, without playing a single game to prove he could hang with the best of the best?? No way, people would say prove it first. I think HOU has done what really no other team would up until this point as White has not shown anything really (Moitejunas played better in summer, showed up for all of camp, and still got shipped to NBADL) yet he's still demanding the world. I really will be surprised if this doesn't end up a loss for all parties involved which is a real shame since White loses his platform to teach about mental illness and the Rockets lose a 1st rounder.
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#10 dlov

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:15 AM

Hate this guy, he is like a child, a diva. Sucks the Rockets wasted a first round draft pick on him. Someone dun goofed in management. Rockets are a flourishing young team, White is the last thing they need.
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#11 ballsohard

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:17 AM

I don't know, I read in one of Y! Sports articles (I think Wojnarowski) that HOU was literally the only team who was interested in drafting him, they kind of touch on this by accident in the draft documentary when they are going over teams who would consider drafting him and it's basically like "if you don't go here (#16) you're not going at all". Honestly though, I work in psych now (my background is in med) but throughout my clinicals I met some guys like this, where they felt bc they had a special skill the world should stop for them, but the reality is that if you have a disability (be it mental or physical) it's up to you to prove that you're that much more resilient than the pack, basically give the team NO reason NOT to accommodate each and all of your requests. White is falling into a trap that is hard to dig out of, which is, you saw I have skills (in college), now it's up to you (the Rockets) to accommodate me and my disease. What it seems he's failing to realize though, is that until he shows on the court with other NBA players that he is worthy of the extra investment of time and resources to the Rockets he's just another rookie prospect who didn't work out. I like to think about it this way - imagine if he was like Jim Abbott and only had 1 arm but was a promising PF prospect. Would it be realistic for him to make all these demands just bc he was drafted, without playing a single game to prove he could hang with the best of the best?? No way, people would say prove it first. I think HOU has done what really no other team would up until this point as White has not shown anything really (Moitejunas played better in summer, showed up for all of camp, and still got shipped to NBADL) yet he's still demanding the world. I really will be surprised if this doesn't end up a loss for all parties involved which is a real shame since White loses his platform to teach about mental illness and the Rockets lose a 1st rounder.


Excellent post. I'd like it a hundred times if I could.

#12 mmahandicapper

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:44 AM


i don't know a whole lot about him, but from watching that short video on youtube it looked like he had a really good support system at iowa state.
he's not getting that type of support in houston, and probably won't ever get it. he's getting paid now, and from the team's pov i can see where they're coming from, to a degree.
as talented as he is I would imagine there's a team out there that would go out of their way to accommodate him. san antonio comes to mind. would have to be an open minded, player's coach type. most likely a veteran team that wouldn't get pissy about him getting "special treatment".


I don't know, I read in one of Y! Sports articles (I think Wojnarowski) that HOU was literally the only team who was interested in drafting him, they kind of touch on this by accident in the draft documentary when they are going over teams who would consider drafting him and it's basically like "if you don't go here (#16) you're not going at all". Honestly though, I work in psych now (my background is in med) but throughout my clinicals I met some guys like this, where they felt bc they had a special skill the world should stop for them, but the reality is that if you have a disability (be it mental or physical) it's up to you to prove that you're that much more resilient than the pack, basically give the team NO reason NOT to accommodate each and all of your requests. White is falling into a trap that is hard to dig out of, which is, you saw I have skills (in college), now it's up to you (the Rockets) to accommodate me and my disease. What it seems he's failing to realize though, is that until he shows on the court with other NBA players that he is worthy of the extra investment of time and resources to the Rockets he's just another rookie prospect who didn't work out. I like to think about it this way - imagine if he was like Jim Abbott and only had 1 arm but was a promising PF prospect. Would it be realistic for him to make all these demands just bc he was drafted, without playing a single game to prove he could hang with the best of the best?? No way, people would say prove it first. I think HOU has done what really no other team would up until this point as White has not shown anything really (Moitejunas played better in summer, showed up for all of camp, and still got shipped to NBADL) yet he's still demanding the world. I really will be surprised if this doesn't end up a loss for all parties involved which is a real shame since White loses his platform to teach about mental illness and the Rockets lose a 1st rounder.


I disagree.

Here's what I think about the situation:
Royce White MAY or MAY not be good enough to be on the Houston Rockets. At this point, it's unproven.

But....when he signs on the dotted lines, just as you do in regular course of employment, there's certain standards employers must meet.


Obviously, I'm not going to name them all, but I will list a few:

During the hiring process, you can't discriminate based off sex, religion, medical condition etc. Did Houston do that?? No. They acted professionally.

The second is...typically companies provide some way to support sufferers from mental conditions. Examples??? Flexible working schedules. Let's say a guy works in sales and he gets really bad anxiety because he witnesses a traumatic car accident. You ease the guy in slowly, maybe start him off part time, maybe switch him over to another role in the office where he's not dealing with people etc.

Should this standard be any different with Houston and Royce White? Of course it should.
Did Houston meet that standard? I'd venture to say they didn't.

We don't know the in's and out's of what REALLY happened. For all we know, Royce could of made certain demands that were just terrible for the Rockets as an organization to handle. For all we know, the Rockets acted out of line.

All we do know is, I really do feel for the guy, because there's no way this s--- is made up. Coming from a guy who in the past dealt with some depression issues, I find what he's doing to be pretty commendable. It takes some giant sized nuts. Maybe he's showing a lack of a brain by trying to fight this, but you gotta respect that passion.

#13 mmahandicapper

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 12:52 AM

Just a final point that I forgot to add:

I can pretty much guarantee there is some sort of mental health policy in the NBA. Let's face it, the average NBA player is probably below average intelligence. That's not a slight against them, and I know I am going to have some haters pop up saying this is a blanket statement, but it's true. These guys are paid to put the ball in the hoop. Most of them neglect their studies growing up, grew up in the "hood", and got an easy pass through HS/College because of their ability. For the most part, this is fact and what happens nowadays.

Based on that, you can bet your a** the NBA (or the union) has policies in check. they have rehab programs, they have drug addiction programs, they have financial planning programs built in place. If the Rockets signed him, it doesn't matter what he proves on the court. He is now property of the Houston Rockets, unless they decide to go their separate ways (ie. put him on waivers, release him, etc.) That said, they knew his condition, and should of taken steps to rectify and mitigate this risk. They haven't done so.

#14 mavsfan23

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 01:33 AM


i don't know a whole lot about him, but from watching that short video on youtube it looked like he had a really good support system at iowa state.
he's not getting that type of support in houston, and probably won't ever get it. he's getting paid now, and from the team's pov i can see where they're coming from, to a degree.
as talented as he is I would imagine there's a team out there that would go out of their way to accommodate him. san antonio comes to mind. would have to be an open minded, player's coach type. most likely a veteran team that wouldn't get pissy about him getting "special treatment".


I don't know, I read in one of Y! Sports articles (I think Wojnarowski) that HOU was literally the only team who was interested in drafting him, they kind of touch on this by accident in the draft documentary when they are going over teams who would consider drafting him and it's basically like "if you don't go here (#16) you're not going at all". Honestly though, I work in psych now (my background is in med) but throughout my clinicals I met some guys like this, where they felt bc they had a special skill the world should stop for them, but the reality is that if you have a disability (be it mental or physical) it's up to you to prove that you're that much more resilient than the pack, basically give the team NO reason NOT to accommodate each and all of your requests. White is falling into a trap that is hard to dig out of, which is, you saw I have skills (in college), now it's up to you (the Rockets) to accommodate me and my disease. What it seems he's failing to realize though, is that until he shows on the court with other NBA players that he is worthy of the extra investment of time and resources to the Rockets he's just another rookie prospect who didn't work out. I like to think about it this way - imagine if he was like Jim Abbott and only had 1 arm but was a promising PF prospect. Would it be realistic for him to make all these demands just bc he was drafted, without playing a single game to prove he could hang with the best of the best?? No way, people would say prove it first. I think HOU has done what really no other team would up until this point as White has not shown anything really (Moitejunas played better in summer, showed up for all of camp, and still got shipped to NBADL) yet he's still demanding the world. I really will be surprised if this doesn't end up a loss for all parties involved which is a real shame since White loses his platform to teach about mental illness and the Rockets lose a 1st rounder.


great post, and i agree with most of it.

although i see where you're coming from, abbott is a bad analogy. i can physically emulate the things abbott did, and very easily appreciate what an amazing feat it was. there's nothing i can ever do to completely understand what royce, or anyone else in his shoes, goes through everyday. on what should have been one of the happiest days of his life he couldn't even be in the same room as all of the people that showed up to enjoy that day with him.

while i agree that he chose a poor career given his condition, i don't think he's been put in the best situation. houston has done a half a** job of supporting him(especially given their investment), and i hope he doesn't give up before the right team gets him. maybe he is expecting too much, maybe he isn't, who knows. it seems he was very lucky to get a great group of coaches at iowa state that were very supportive of him.

if teams are willing to give a million chances to players that are lazy, injury prone, criminals, drug addicts, etc it would shock me to see him given up on so easily.
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#15 vinz

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 04:01 AM

Any faults the Rockets may have had handling this guy all goes down the drain when Royce openly says that if he were to get playing time in the rotation, he would attend the games.

That's downright disrespectful.
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#16 krupocin

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:09 AM

I disagree.
Here's what I think about the situation:
Royce White MAY or MAY not be good enough to be on the Houston Rockets. At this point, it's unproven.
But....when he signs on the dotted lines, just as you do in regular course of employment, there's certain standards employers must meet.
Obviously, I'm not going to name them all, but I will list a few:
During the hiring process, you can't discriminate based off sex, religion, medical condition etc. Did Houston do that?? No. They acted professionally.
We don't know the in's and out's of what REALLY happened. For all we know, Royce could of made certain demands that were just terrible for the Rockets as an organization to handle. For all we know, the Rockets acted out of line.
All we do know is, I really do feel for the guy, because there's no way this s--- is made up. Coming from a guy who in the past dealt with some depression issues, I find what he's doing to be pretty commendable. It takes some giant sized nuts. Maybe he's showing a lack of a brain by trying to fight this, but you gotta respect that passion.


First off, thanks mmahandicapper & mavsfan23 for the great responses :) Just a warning this thread is gonna be long so dive in at your own peril lol.

I know this thread is going to get away from fantasy basketball but since the guy currently isn't playing I don't think the mods will care. As someone who grew up an athlete (although not at White's level but played a sport on the national level & was invited to the USA-ODP), absolutely loves the NBA, has suffered from severe anxiety and depression issues in the past, and now have my doc in medicine & doing my psych training (something I don't really ever mention on these boards, bc why would I haha) this is an issue that is more interesting to me than any has been in the recent years which is why I was hoping to get a discussion going and see what others though.

I did wanna bring a few things up though. First, the whole part mmahandi- brought up (btw, I don't think you and I disagree as much as you think) about discrimination made me think of something. Fair hiring practices (or drafting) is something that really is great on paper. It's something that is in a unique situation in the NBA though and is something that, in my experience, doesn't go on in real life either alot of the time. If a company knows you committed a crime, have a mental illness, are extremely religious, etc most companies won't hire you (my ex gf was an HR manager at Bain Capitlal, trust me they discriminate more than a plantation owner in rural Georgia - they just don't tell you). The thing is most companies don't know enough about you to make that distinction. In the NBA though when a player enters the draft scouts pretty much know everything about him - when he goes to bed, if he's smart, what his work ethic is like, any past medical conditions, etc - things a normal employer would only dream about knowing. In the past a "head case" which is basically just slang for untreated psychiatric patient would slip and often not get drafted at all. Fans accept that their favorite teams should draft the best prospect available, regardless of discrimination, actually fans encourage this discrimination in fact. The reason I'm going on about this is that the Rockets did something great this year w/ their pick and said "screw discrimination - this kid is something special & we'll work with him to get better" - that was awesome.

The 2nd thing I wanted to respond to was what mmhandi- said about we don't know - which is 100% right we don't know at all what goes on behind closed doors and honestly I think that's better for everyone involved. But going on what we do know, that is why my stance has gone from being behind White 100% the few months after the draft to now being 50/50 on who's actually right here. I say that, bc what we DO know is that White refused to show up to camp until he was accommodated for travel, which is not the way I would've handled it even during my worst anxiety (I could only imagine applying to med school 8 yrs ago making demands like this haha) but I don't pretend to understand how White's case felt so when that happened I thought "wow this fear of flying is more severe than we thought but hey, at least he got that out of the way". Only bc White was so public about his condition was he able to get this accommodation, if your average player asked for it (w/o coming clean about anxiety disorders) they'd probably be suspended for misconduct haha. After that though, is when things started to change (at least in my mind). White refused to have any dealings with the Rockets bc they asked him to see an appointed psychiatrist as well in the HOU area. A totally reasonable request and kind of standard practice in a distance situation (most companies will do this for traveling employees who had a psychotic break or MDD on the job) yet White flipped - took to twitter bashing the team, and refused to leave his personal bus. The same thing happened when he was asked to report to the NBA-DL along with Moitejunas & Machado - guys who had solid pre-seasons and training camps. He blamed the Rockets publicly for discrimination when in reality it was bc (this is 1 thing we do know) the guy didn't go to camp and had no experience really playing with the team. He needed development but to him this was a personal affront (which I'll get to next). Finally, we're where we are now - White is still refusing to talk to his team, STILL blasting this whole thing over twitter which is just a horrible way of handling things, and there's no time-table for his return.

So here we are, with White refusing to report to the NBA-DL, no time-table for his return to the team, and blasting the Rockets via twitter. We don't know really anymore than that, but things aren't looking good from the outsider perspective. Honestly though, I'm starting to wonder what psychiatric co-morbidity White has as I've dealt with 100's of patients with GAD (general anxiety) & panic over the last few years and he is not acting like they do. Typically, from my experience, patients with anxiety almost seem hungry to get help and move on with their lives - professional and personal. I never see these sort of ideas of reference and paranoid thoughts in GAD/panic-only patients which I'm not gonna get into it here but I wouldn't be surprised if we find out White has something alot more serious going on (that could prevent him from playing) or some serious personality spectrum disorders to boot. I doubt this is interesting to you NBA fans but to me this is the most fascinating part, but I'll stop here.

Anyway, I'll wrap this up and respond to mavsfan23 & mmhandicapper's 2nd message later, but this is a really interesting topic, bc we all would love to live in a fair world where people with mental or physical disability are treated no different than any other. However, White has chose a profession which is about as bad as can be for someone with GAD/panic, and I think it's an interesting discussion of when do accommodations stop and when do we tell the patient (White in this case) you're doing more harm than good with this career choice. To put the seriousness of what White has to overcome in perspective - this is like someone with a serious flying phobia wanting to fly commercial or someone with panic induced vertigo wanting to drive in the indy 500 - it's possible but close to impossible.
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#17 krupocin

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:36 AM

I can pretty much guarantee there is some sort of mental health policy in the NBA. Let's face it, the average NBA player is probably below average intelligence. That's not a slight against them, and I know I am going to have some haters pop up saying this is a blanket statement, but it's true. These guys are paid to put the ball in the hoop. Most of them neglect their studies growing up, grew up in the "hood", and got an easy pass through HS/College because of their ability. For the most part, this is fact and what happens nowadays.

Based on that, you can bet your a** the NBA (or the union) has policies in check. they have rehab programs, they have drug addiction programs, they have financial planning programs built in place. If the Rockets signed him, it doesn't matter what he proves on the court. He is now property of the Houston Rockets, unless they decide to go their separate ways (ie. put him on waivers, release him, etc.) That said, they knew his condition, and should of taken steps to rectify and mitigate this risk. They haven't done so.


You know what's funny, I used to have a prof in an undergrad sports psychology class years ago who used to call this "the tragedy of sports" meaning that 99/100 the type of mind it takes to succeed at the highest level of pro sports (esp super fast paced NBA, NFL, & F1, etc) is one that is almost kind of simple to the point that they're often the only ones who don't realize how amazing whatever athletic feat just happened was. For example, you hear the guy who sank the 3 in OT of the finals or the receiver who caught the winning touch down in the Super Bowl and they'll flatly say "well coach told me to run the play out and I gave 110% and it went in/I caught it" while the rest of us fans would not only piss our pants before hand but stand there in awe of what happened for the next 2 days. It's the tragedy of sports - most of the guys doing these heroic-type acts never fully appreciate how amazing they are.

Getting back to White, I don't want to beat a dead horse, but with the psychiatrist in HOU, the private personalized bus to away games, letting him arrive at camp on his own schedule - doesn't it sound like they have used sound judgement and risk mitigation up until this point??

although i see where you're coming from, abbott is a bad analogy. i can physically emulate the things abbott did, and very easily appreciate what an amazing feat it was. there's nothing i can ever do to completely understand what royce, or anyone else in his shoes, goes through everyday. on what should have been one of the happiest days of his life he couldn't even be in the same room as all of the people that showed up to enjoy that day with him.

while i agree that he chose a poor career given his condition, i don't think he's been put in the best situation. houston has done a half a** job of supporting him(especially given their investment), and i hope he doesn't give up before the right team gets him. maybe he is expecting too much, maybe he isn't, who knows. it seems he was very lucky to get a great group of coaches at iowa state that were very supportive of him. If teams are willing to give a million chances to players that are lazy, injury prone, criminals, drug addicts, etc it would shock me to see him given up on so easily.


Mavsfan23, you are probably right, I mean I have gone through bad anxiety/depression right before I started med school (to the point that I needed treatment) but unlike a missing limb, every case of mood or psych disorder can be quite different so it might not have been the best analogy. I was just trying to shed some light on the fact that we consider psych/mood disorders "mental" and all other injuries "physical" when in reality the brain is a part of the body that is injured meaning it is no less (I'd argue it's more) serious than many physical disabilities, not something you can "just push through and be tough". If anything that mentality makes the disorder worse.

Also, you touched on the "right team" getting White, but imo HOU has done more than anyone else is going to be willing to do for a player. Not that they hate psych patients lol, but this is where the Abbot analogy comes in - his disability is just not worth the trouble at this point. If HOU didn't draft him, the guy probably wouldn't have gone until the 2nd round (per his draft doc) and if that were the case things would be VERY different as he wouldn't have a guaranteed contract. So I think he should be thanking his lucky stars the Rockets were the team to get him, even if they're treatment leaves a little to be desired I still think it's the best in the NBA at this point. The only thing they don't have is a team of vets to help him, but honestly I'm not sure how open to that White would be after his recent twitter blasts.

Finally, I just wanted to respond to the "players that are lazy, injury prone, criminals, drug addicts, etc". Don't take what I'm about to say personally bc it's not directed at you just in general - but I hate this attitude that certain psychiatric problems are "ok" and others are "bad". What I mean by this is that we still treat drug addicts in this country as criminals, when in fact we KNOW addiction is no different than anxiety or depression. Find me ONE addict who doesn't have a history of trauma, a genetic pre-disposition to addiction, or 1 who WANTS to be an addict and I'll give you a million dollars. I just hate that attitude, it causes so many problems in our country it's just ridiculous. The way the USA looks at addiction & mental health in general is light-years behind Europe & Japan it's just disgusting. Even places like Brazil & New Zealand are more progressive. Anyway, getting off my soap box now haha.
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#18 mmahandicapper

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 06:42 PM


I can pretty much guarantee there is some sort of mental health policy in the NBA. Let's face it, the average NBA player is probably below average intelligence. That's not a slight against them, and I know I am going to have some haters pop up saying this is a blanket statement, but it's true. These guys are paid to put the ball in the hoop. Most of them neglect their studies growing up, grew up in the "hood", and got an easy pass through HS/College because of their ability. For the most part, this is fact and what happens nowadays.

Based on that, you can bet your a** the NBA (or the union) has policies in check. they have rehab programs, they have drug addiction programs, they have financial planning programs built in place. If the Rockets signed him, it doesn't matter what he proves on the court. He is now property of the Houston Rockets, unless they decide to go their separate ways (ie. put him on waivers, release him, etc.) That said, they knew his condition, and should of taken steps to rectify and mitigate this risk. They haven't done so.


You know what's funny, I used to have a prof in an undergrad sports psychology class years ago who used to call this "the tragedy of sports" meaning that 99/100 the type of mind it takes to succeed at the highest level of pro sports (esp super fast paced NBA, NFL, & F1, etc) is one that is almost kind of simple to the point that they're often the only ones who don't realize how amazing whatever athletic feat just happened was. For example, you hear the guy who sank the 3 in OT of the finals or the receiver who caught the winning touch down in the Super Bowl and they'll flatly say "well coach told me to run the play out and I gave 110% and it went in/I caught it" while the rest of us fans would not only piss our pants before hand but stand there in awe of what happened for the next 2 days. It's the tragedy of sports - most of the guys doing these heroic-type acts never fully appreciate how amazing they are.

Getting back to White, I don't want to beat a dead horse, but with the psychiatrist in HOU, the private personalized bus to away games, letting him arrive at camp on his own schedule - doesn't it sound like they have used sound judgement and risk mitigation up until this point??

although i see where you're coming from, abbott is a bad analogy. i can physically emulate the things abbott did, and very easily appreciate what an amazing feat it was. there's nothing i can ever do to completely understand what royce, or anyone else in his shoes, goes through everyday. on what should have been one of the happiest days of his life he couldn't even be in the same room as all of the people that showed up to enjoy that day with him.

while i agree that he chose a poor career given his condition, i don't think he's been put in the best situation. houston has done a half a** job of supporting him(especially given their investment), and i hope he doesn't give up before the right team gets him. maybe he is expecting too much, maybe he isn't, who knows. it seems he was very lucky to get a great group of coaches at iowa state that were very supportive of him. If teams are willing to give a million chances to players that are lazy, injury prone, criminals, drug addicts, etc it would shock me to see him given up on so easily.


Mavsfan23, you are probably right, I mean I have gone through bad anxiety/depression right before I started med school (to the point that I needed treatment) but unlike a missing limb, every case of mood or psych disorder can be quite different so it might not have been the best analogy. I was just trying to shed some light on the fact that we consider psych/mood disorders "mental" and all other injuries "physical" when in reality the brain is a part of the body that is injured meaning it is no less (I'd argue it's more) serious than many physical disabilities, not something you can "just push through and be tough". If anything that mentality makes the disorder worse.

Also, you touched on the "right team" getting White, but imo HOU has done more than anyone else is going to be willing to do for a player. Not that they hate psych patients lol, but this is where the Abbot analogy comes in - his disability is just not worth the trouble at this point. If HOU didn't draft him, the guy probably wouldn't have gone until the 2nd round (per his draft doc) and if that were the case things would be VERY different as he wouldn't have a guaranteed contract. So I think he should be thanking his lucky stars the Rockets were the team to get him, even if they're treatment leaves a little to be desired I still think it's the best in the NBA at this point. The only thing they don't have is a team of vets to help him, but honestly I'm not sure how open to that White would be after his recent twitter blasts.

Finally, I just wanted to respond to the "players that are lazy, injury prone, criminals, drug addicts, etc". Don't take what I'm about to say personally bc it's not directed at you just in general - but I hate this attitude that certain psychiatric problems are "ok" and others are "bad". What I mean by this is that we still treat drug addicts in this country as criminals, when in fact we KNOW addiction is no different than anxiety or depression. Find me ONE addict who doesn't have a history of trauma, a genetic pre-disposition to addiction, or 1 who WANTS to be an addict and I'll give you a million dollars. I just hate that attitude, it causes so many problems in our country it's just ridiculous. The way the USA looks at addiction & mental health in general is light-years behind Europe & Japan it's just disgusting. Even places like Brazil & New Zealand are more progressive. Anyway, getting off my soap box now haha.


Funny enough, I'm actually also very similar. I was a soccer player growing up in Canada, played for NTC (national training center, similar to odp in the states) teams, provincial teams, been to nationals etc. I have my degree in Finance, and just like you, I struggled for years with anxiety and depression. It's maybe why I can empathize with Roy because I've had anxiety in my personal life, professional life (moreso in my studies), and even playing sports.


I read over your post a couple times, but as I'm typing this, I probably won't be referring to it, so I apologize in advance if I miss a couple points.

I remember what you said about HR and how this is obvious. I've seen it first hand, read about it. The policies they come up with are pretty incredible in terms of knowing how to weed out employees. They do their due diligence moreso then they think, especially in the world of social media today.

But does that mean it should happen? Heck no. Instead of debating what happens, I think we should be debating how Houston SHOULD of responded.

I can empathize with Roy, because I've dealt with some of the same type of debilitating anxiety.

Don't you think his case is a bit unique since he was a first round pick? He is NOT some player who is expected to be a role player. He was pretty much expected to carve out a nice career in the NBA, at least on paper.

so do I think they should of handled him much better? Yes. I am all for equality in sports, but lets be honest....sports are not equal. Darius Morris does not get treated the same way Kobe Bryant does. Someone like Dooling does not get the type of perks in an organization that someone like Garnett does.

This is professional sports where money is on the line. More then anything, they knew his condition, yet picked him anyway. That speaks volumes. They believe in this kid. They cannot just treat him like a sunk cost and be done with him.

I feel like at this point, he should take the year off, play some basketball and have Houston work with him to try and cure his anxiety. people think this guy isa headcase, but if you look at his twitter, hear him speak, he is actually surprisingly (seemingly) pretty well read and intelligent. Not exactly metta like who has the IQ of a peanut (I still love the guy though).

But yeah....when I think about it now, I pretty much do agree with you. I just think if Houston took the risks, after a couple months they shouldn't just leave the guy hanging out to dry. I also think Roy maybe needs ot be more proactive and possibly a little bit more understanding. He doesn't really deserve anything in life, and maybe he should prove his worth.

It is very tough for him, coming from the Midwest where all teams are pretty much dispersed near each other, to the NBA where you fly every night, all the time. Gotta be tough.

#19 crazy47larry

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 09:23 PM

This might be an overly simplistic solution but why don't they just let him play in only home games? Either in the NBA or the D-League. I guess the roster spots are more vital in the NBA but he could get his feet wet in the D-League and when he gets more comfortable with his surroundings he could step up his travel routine and see if it is actually realistic (which we all know it isn't). I guess he doesn't want to report to the D-League right? For someone with an anxiety disorder he seems very entitled. I get that he needs special treatment and support to make it to and from the NBA games but once he is in the arena he needs to recognize that he is still in fact a rookie and has not earned anything. At this point he doesn't even appear to want to take that step. It's too bad he doesn't realize how lucky he has it right now because the Rockets appear to be catering to him for the most part.

The thing that is the most frustrating is that he is trying to be a face for mental illness but in doing so he is giving that face a black eye. He is trully doing more damage at this point then good. People do not see a young man trying to overcome adversity and fight through these issues to be the best he can. Instead people see an entitled and spoiled brat complaining that things are not going his way. If he wasn't diagnosed with a Mental Illness he would easily be the most hated player in the league, but because of his diagnosis it is almost like he is using it as an excuse to make demands. Also because of his diagnosis people cannot treat him like they normally would and that almost always spells disaster for any relationship. The second you stop acting like yourself to cater to someone else's supposed feelings is the same second that you lose respect for that person. Not only are you assuming you know whats good for your joint relationship but you also assume you know whats better for both parties involved. Then again its not like they could just treat him like some normal rookie.


I am not fully engrossed in this like some others so I might miss some details but these are just my 2 cents. I trully want to root for him but my god he does not make it easy.
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#20 keep it ONE hunnid

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 09:26 PM

im a high school drop out, can someone in simple words explain to me what is this guy going thru?? what is a anxiety disorder? ive tried googling it and everything but still don't get it.....thankyou.