47 replies to this topic

[2ndCitySox]

SP Tiers for H2H. Rankings were made using W’s, ERA, WHIP, K/Start. I think K/Start is a nice stat to use for H2H. The tiers are labeled based on Metallica albums. Note: I do not drive a Camaro with T-tops.

A + indicates a guy who will likely start the year on the DL. A ?  is typically a young SP who may or may not crack the rotation. Ranking is based on the assumption that he will.

   MASTER OF PUPPETS

Clayton Kershaw
Justin Verlander
Stephen Strasburg

…AND JUSTICE FOR ALL

Cole Hamels
David Price
Felix Hernandez
Cliff Lee
Matt Cain

RIDE THE LIGHTNING

Chris Sale
R.A. Dickey
Jered Weaver
CC Sabathia
Gio Gonzalez
Madison Bumgarner
Adam Wainwright
Yu Darvish

GARAGE DAYS

Johnny Cueto
Ardolis Chapman
Zack Greinke
James Shields
Mat Latos

KILL EM ALL

Matt Moore
Josh Johnson
Roy Halladay
Jordan Zimmermann
Max Scherzer
Kris Medlen
Jake Peavy
Brandon Morrow

THE BLACK ALBUM

A.J. Griffin
Mike Fiers
Jeff Samardzija
Carpenter
Doug Fister
Matt Harvey
Brett Anderson
Yovani Gallardo

LOAD

Dan Haren
Jon Lester
Ian Kennedy
Shaun Marcum
Corey Luebke +
Lance Lynn
Mike Minor
Hiroki Kuroda
Kyle Lohse
Wade Miley

S & M

Ryan Vogelsong
Jeremy Hellickson
Anibal Sanchez
Jarrod Parker
Tim Lincecum
Brandon McCarthy
Brandon Beachy +
Jon Niese
A.J. Burnett
Marco Estrada
Colby Lewis +
Johan Santana
Jason Hammel
Shelby Miller ?
Ryan Dempster

DEATH MAGNETIC

C.J. Wilson
Matt Garza
Homer Bailey
Dillon Gee
Miguel Gonzalez
Pineda +
Dan Hudson +
Felix Doubront
Chris Tillman
Jaime Garcia
Tim Hudson
Hisashi Iwakuma

RELOAD

Dan Straily
Derek Holland
Edwin Jackson
Hyun-Jin Ryu
Patrick Corbin
Ross Detwiler
Trevor Cahill
Wei-Yin Chen
Josh Beckett
Andy Pettite

ST. ANGER

Julio Teheran ?
Scott Baker
Phil Hughes
Alex Cobb
Scott Diamond
Paul Maholm
Tommy Milone
Chris Capuano
Carlos Villanueva

THE LOU REED DEBACLE

James McDonald
Tommy Hanson
Vance Worley
Chad Billingsley
Matt Harrison
Bartolo Colon
Bud Norris
Justin Masterson
Wily Peralta

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If there's any bigger names I forgot, please let me know!

Flame on!

Edited by The Harsh, 02 February 2013 - 07:52 AM.
Updated.

[2ndCitySox]

Note: if a well recognized name that is a marginal SP  isn't on there (i.e Floyd/ danks) it is because I think they are WW material.

I didn't project Bauer yet, though I assume he will make the rotation.

One name I realized that could make this cut : J Chacin (but probably not)

Edited by 2ndCitySox, 17 January 2013 - 11:45 PM.

[2ndCitySox]

Chapman in the Bomb Man tier.
Projections:  10 W, 3.40 ERA, 1.15 WHIP, 6.5K/start.

He's a major wild card

Dodgers Ryu: need to dig deeper....

Pettite, Carpenter, doubrount, detwiler, vargas also overlooked. Not sure how carp happened.

So I owe you guys five more

Edited by 2ndCitySox, 18 January 2013 - 12:01 AM.

[RespectMyAuthority]

Sale too high, Zimmerman/M.Moore too low, Luebke won't be ready.  Really like the value in the Crash Man group.

[2ndCitySox]

RespectMyAuthority, on 18 January 2013 - 12:00 AM, said:

Sale too high, Zimmerman/M.Moore too low, Luebke won't be ready.  Really like the value in the Crash Man group.

Yeah I was surprised with Sale, I probably wouldnt take him that high either. Zimmermann needs to get the K's up a bit, and Moore of course could be an ace this year.

Thanks for the feedback!

[ballfan4141]

gavin flloyd and danks are waiver wire material. dont draft them unless you are in a 16+ league. forgot about daniel hudson. thanks. usually dont draft stats you can get from the waiver wire unless the guys have the potential not to be.

Edited by ballfan4141, 18 January 2013 - 06:16 AM.

[Whoopie!]

Holland is too low also,  guy has great stuff and his whip has been declining every year.

IMO, he's probably a #4 type SP in fantasy.   Assuming his K's are solid,  whip ~ 1.20,  4 era and pitching for a good team to boot.

And Weaver has to be a #1 in every league pretty much.

[Whoopie!]

RespectMyAuthority, on 18 January 2013 - 12:00 AM, said:

Sale too high, Zimmerman/M.Moore too low, Luebke won't be ready.  Really like the value in the Crash Man group.

Zimmerman i think makes sense there.  Moore i disagree, i think he's too high, not too low.    I wouldnt trust him as my #2...no way.

#3 even , im a little leary of him there but would be ok with that.

[PRoSPx]

Luebke is in a Teir above Gallardo?  And Morrow?

I personally wouldn't touch Luebke until rounds after those guys were gone.

[malta69]

Nice work 2CS, but just glancing at the tiers, the very first thing that sticks out to me is that Gallardo is WAAAY too low.  Now I get that the WHIP/occasional blowup will always keep him out of the elite tier/ceiling, but its REALLY time the guy starts getting his props.  After a fantastic 2011,for him post the counting stats he did last year with that team/defense behind him, and then rank him slightly above Marcum is a little careless.  

Whether you like him or not, I really don't see any way you can quanitfy him as anything LESS than a top 25 SP.

[TheFranchiseAce]

I know it's splitting hairs but...

I would have put Price and Hamels in the Metal Man tier.  

Weaver in the elec man.

Edited by TheFranchiseAce, 18 January 2013 - 10:56 AM.

[RespectMyAuthority]

Couple days ago, my friend and I came up with this list of the top 24 SP (guys we wanted to make sure to get 2 of in a 15-teamer, and try to get 3 of in 12-teamers)...



Verlander, Justin
Kershaw, Clayton
Strasburg, Stephen
Price, David
Lee, Cliff
Hamels, Cole
Weaver, Jered
Cain, Matt
Hernandez, Felix
Gonzalez, Gio
Bumgarner, Madison
Greinke, Zack
Sabathia, CC
Halladay, Roy
Darvish, Yu
Wainwright, Adam
Scherzer, Max
Shields, James
Latos, Mat
Cueto, Johnny
Sale, Chris
Zimmermann, Jordan
Gallardo, Yovani
Moore, Matt

Guys that just missed:

Samardzija, Jeff
Morrow, Brandon
Medlen, Kris
Harvey, Matt
Dickey, R.A.
Lincecum, Tim
Kennedy, Ian
Minor, Mike
Anderson, Brett
Parker, Jarrod
Fister, Doug
Wilson, C.J.
Johnson, Josh
Garza, Matt
Haren, Dan

[2ndCitySox]

PRoSPx, on 18 January 2013 - 09:58 AM, said:

Luebke is in a Teir above Gallardo?  And Morrow?

I personally wouldn't touch Luebke until rounds after those guys were gone.

Yep, I agree. Because these were ran with k/start, the value is more skewed to a value per game basis, rather than overall. Also, I wasn't sure when luebke was going to be back. But, when he is ready to go, I think he could provide sneaky value.

Tiers don't = where I would draft a guy, per se

[David Light]

WHAT THE!   COLBY LEWIS in the same tier as Cueto, Greinke, Moore,......  Was that a mistake?  Come on, Colby Lewis!

[2ndCitySox]

Yeah, I saw that. I think I forgot to carry a 1.
Thanks.

[2ndCitySox]

malta69, on 18 January 2013 - 10:49 AM, said:

Nice work 2CS, but just glancing at the tiers, the very first thing that sticks out to me is that Gallardo is WAAAY too low.  Now I get that the WHIP/occasional blowup will always keep him out of the elite tier/ceiling, but its REALLY time the guy starts getting his props.  After a fantastic 2011,for him post the counting stats he did last year with that team/defense behind him, and then rank him slightly above Marcum is a little careless.  

Whether you like him or not, I really don't see any way you can quanitfy him as anything LESS than a top 25 SP.

I'm not a big fan of gallardo, but he should be. I'll look again and see if I had a number not quite rate. Maybe his k/game kinda sucks? A 9k/9 IP is great unless the guy doesn't go that deep. But I need to look again.

[SoundMaster]

RespectMyAuthority, on 18 January 2013 - 12:00 AM, said:

Sale too high, Zimmerman/M.Moore too low, Luebke won't be ready.  Really like the value in the Crash Man group.

I'd also move Shields up one tier.

[2ndCitySox]

For what's it worth regarding Luebke. Bill James has him @ 155 IP, a 3 ERA, a 1.13 WHIP, and a 8.13 k/9 rate....which is all pretty damn good. But, it is Bill James.

[2ndCitySox]

What are the chances for each of the following to start the season in the majors:
Dylan Bundy
Shelby Miller
Tyler Skaggs
Danny Hultzen
Taijuan Walker
Julio Teheran
Trevor Bauer

These are guys I'd like to include on the list but I don't know how likely it is for them to make the rotation.

Obviously, my initial post had a few flaws, so now that I've run it by the masses, I can fix it and make it better.

If there's any other young SP's I'm missing that you think will start in the bigs, let me know.

Thanks again!

[LyondellBasell]

Nice list. Brett Anderson will be bomb man or better. You missed him.