10 replies to this topic

[jsp2014]

What % of MLB players (players likely to be on 25-man rosters) do you think have used a banned substance (aside from drugs) in the last 12 months?

curious what people think.

Edited by jsp2014, 15 February 2013 - 07:34 PM.

[Z06vette]

One thing that gets me is why isn't creatine not a banned substance? The most studied supplement on the market today, proven to enhance strength. Creatine may not be roids, but if u take it, great chance it gives you an advantage over ones who don't.

[ballfan4141]

creatine? really.

[yoda]

There is a fine line between supplements and PED's.  What is considered safe and legal could be dangerous and banned tomorrow.  I'd guess that 100% of athletes are on some type of supplements.  Some will push the limit while others stay with more traditional stuff.

[CM52]

Z06vette, on 15 February 2013 - 07:47 PM, said:

One thing that gets me is why isn't creatine not a banned substance? The most studied supplement on the market today, proven to enhance strength. Creatine may not be roids, but if u take it, great chance it gives you an advantage over ones who don't.

Yeah we should ban protein shakes, too.

[Z06vette]

ballfan4141, on 15 February 2013 - 10:34 PM, said:

creatine? really.

What exactly is that suppose to mean?  Nice reply!

Edited by Z06vette, 16 February 2013 - 10:52 AM.

[PRoSPx]

Z06vette, on 15 February 2013 - 07:47 PM, said:

One thing that gets me is why isn't creatine not a banned substance? The most studied supplement on the market today, proven to enhance strength. Creatine may not be roids, but if u take it, great chance it gives you an advantage over ones who don't.

Creatine is naturally made by just about all mammals.  Anytime you eat red meat there's creatine in it.  Creatine is a very effective workout supplement but it is nowhere near anything that would be considered a PED.

Edited by PRoSPx, 16 February 2013 - 11:03 AM.

[Z06vette]

PRoSPx, on 16 February 2013 - 11:02 AM, said:

Z06vette, on 15 February 2013 - 07:47 PM, said:

One thing that gets me is why isn't creatine not a banned substance? The most studied supplement on the market today, proven to enhance strength. Creatine may not be roids, but if u take it, great chance it gives you an advantage over ones who don't.

Creatine is naturally made by just about all mammals.  Anytime you eat red meat there's creatine in it.  Creatine is a very effective workout supplement but it is nowhere near anything that would be considered a PED.

I realize creatine is some foods that we eat, but if taking as a supplement daily it enhances performance. You say creatine is no where near anything that would be considered a PED, yet deer antler velvet is a banned substance? Creatine is a more proven strength supplement than deer antler velvet IMO.

[PRoSPx]

Z06vette, on 16 February 2013 - 11:16 AM, said:

I realize creatine is some foods that we eat, but if taking as a supplement daily it enhances performance. You say creatine is no where near anything that would be considered a PED, yet deer antler velvet is a banned substance? Creatine is a more proven strength supplement than deer antler velvet IMO.

You could say protein enhances performance, hell you could even say water enhances performance.  You can't just outlaw everything.  Creatine is so safe and occurs naturally enough that it will never get banned by any sport.

Creatine is a more mainstream supplement than deer antler velvet.  But deer antler velvet will give you far superior gains in a shorter period of time.  

Put it this way, I have taken creatine before a few times.  But even before I ever got on creatine my buddies who I worked out with who took it religiously weren't stronger than me (or at least noticably, a few exercises sure but for the most part I was the stronger one).  Granted I work out harder than they do, but don't get me wrong they work out hard too.  I just add in far more cardio which honestly I think kept my top end maxes down a bit but put my muscle stamina through the roof.

If they were on deer antler fuzz or an even better compassion some other legal supplement as there is far better stuff than just regular old creatine monohydrate that is still and probably always going to be 100% legal in all professional American sports.

Creatine is a great supplement it's been around since the 1800's and they are still finding out new benefits to the body to this day from it.

[Z06vette]

PRoSPx, on 16 February 2013 - 11:54 AM, said:

Z06vette, on 16 February 2013 - 11:16 AM, said:

I realize creatine is some foods that we eat, but if taking as a supplement daily it enhances performance. You say creatine is no where near anything that would be considered a PED, yet deer antler velvet is a banned substance? Creatine is a more proven strength supplement than deer antler velvet IMO.

You could say protein enhances performance, hell you could even say water enhances performance.  You can't just outlaw everything.  Creatine is so safe and occurs naturally enough that it will never get banned by any sport.

Creatine is a more mainstream supplement than deer antler velvet.  But deer antler velvet will give you far superior gains in a shorter period of time.  

Put it this way, I have taken creatine before a few times.  But even before I ever got on creatine my buddies who I worked out with who took it religiously weren't stronger than me (or at least noticably, a few exercises sure but for the most part I was the stronger one).  Granted I work out harder than they do, but don't get me wrong they work out hard too.  I just add in far more cardio which honestly I think kept my top end maxes down a bit but put my muscle stamina through the roof.

If they were on deer antler fuzz or an even better compassion some other legal supplement as there is far better stuff than just regular old creatine monohydrate that is still and probably always going to be 100% legal in all professional American sports.

Creatine is a great supplement it's been around since the 1800's and they are still finding out new benefits to the body to this day from it.

Good post. It looks like I should make myself clear here, I'm not trying to argue creatine should be a ban substance, trying to understand how does MLB determine what's a ban substance and what isn't, the guidelines that determine this process. I was using creatine as an example, and making the case how it enhances performance.

Far as faster gains using deer antler velvet, not sure I can agree with that, studies are mixed how effective deer antler velvet is.

[PRoSPx]

Z06vette, on 16 February 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

PRoSPx, on 16 February 2013 - 11:54 AM, said:

Z06vette, on 16 February 2013 - 11:16 AM, said:

I realize creatine is some foods that we eat, but if taking as a supplement daily it enhances performance. You say creatine is no where near anything that would be considered a PED, yet deer antler velvet is a banned substance? Creatine is a more proven strength supplement than deer antler velvet IMO.

You could say protein enhances performance, hell you could even say water enhances performance.  You can't just outlaw everything.  Creatine is so safe and occurs naturally enough that it will never get banned by any sport.

Creatine is a more mainstream supplement than deer antler velvet.  But deer antler velvet will give you far superior gains in a shorter period of time.  

Put it this way, I have taken creatine before a few times.  But even before I ever got on creatine my buddies who I worked out with who took it religiously weren't stronger than me (or at least noticably, a few exercises sure but for the most part I was the stronger one).  Granted I work out harder than they do, but don't get me wrong they work out hard too.  I just add in far more cardio which honestly I think kept my top end maxes down a bit but put my muscle stamina through the roof.

If they were on deer antler fuzz or an even better compassion some other legal supplement as there is far better stuff than just regular old creatine monohydrate that is still and probably always going to be 100% legal in all professional American sports.

Creatine is a great supplement it's been around since the 1800's and they are still finding out new benefits to the body to this day from it.

Good post. It looks like I should make myself clear here, I'm not trying to argue creatine should be a ban substance, trying to understand how does MLB determine what's a ban substance and what isn't, the guidelines that determine this process. I was using creatine as an example, and making the case how it enhances performance.

Far as faster gains using deer antler velvet, not sure I can agree with that, studies are mixed how effective deer antler velvet is.

If it didn't work they wouldn't ban it.  Believe that.  Well danger to the human body is a huge factor as well, but if there is danger envolved who is going to take that risk if they aren't getting very efficient gains?  No reasonable person and certainly no professional athlete.

Now creatine on the other hand has many different forms.  Monohydrate the most mainstream one is probably the lowest on the totem poll.  There are newer forms of creatine that are extremely efficient.

My buddy was on this supplement called M5 extreme.  The driving factor of the supplement is creatine but in a newer advanced form.  M5 doesn't have your regular monohydrate it has Magnesium Ceatine Chelate (I believe is the form, someone should check me on that though) as well as Creatine Nitrate.

He went from being stuck on a plateau max bench press of 250 (for weeks) to 315 in under 3 weeks he took 2 months worth and got up to 335.  So in 2 months of taking this he put on 85 pounds of his bench press.  Which is a damn incredible gain.  Granted, he never took anything other than whey protein and multi vitamins before and was only 24 a time where the body will get stronger naturally as well.

But even M5 is nothing compared to almost all of the banned substances.