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2013 NBA Championship Finals: San Antonio Spurs vs. Miami Heat


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#21 StreetCred

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 05:55 PM


@sasnumberonefan, you're totally right . . . The Spurs have the championship pedigree, are too experienced, and are too well-coached to be counted out in a potential matchup against the Heat . . . When I said that the Heat have a "huge edge", it wasn't meant to discount the most successful franchise in the last decade . . . During their final regular season matchup, I saw something very interesting . . . The Heat were able to corral Tony Parker's screen-and-rolls, and this without Lebron/Wade/Chalmers in the lineup . . . I also think the Heat have the personnel to send various looks against Parker, with Chalmers, Cole, and Lebron potentially taking turns to guard him on the bounce, coupled with consistent traps coming from their versatile frontcourt . . . I also took something from the Warriors-Spurs series, when Mark Jackson used the length and versatility of his guards and wings (Klay Thompson, Harrison Barnes) to challenge Parker on both ends . . . The Heat, IMO, have the backcourt/wing versatility to replicate the Warriors blueprint . . .


Parker was playing on one ankle in that game. He wasn't healthy. You can take very little away from either matchup this season as both teams sort of ducked each other b/c of circumstance....

I totally agree that there is no definitive take-away from the regular season . . . But if you watched the Spurs-Warriors series, you saw Mark Jackson's strategy of making Tony Parker work on both ends. Styles make fights. The Spurs made easy work of the Grizzlies because the Grizz personnel had no effective counter to Parker's screen-and-roll game. Tony Allen may be a solid one-on-one defender, and Marc Gasol a great low-post defender, BUT the Grizz had no one fast enough or versatile enough to cover Tony Parker on the help side. Couple that with the Grizzlies having no one in their roster to punish Parker on the offensive side. The Warriors, on the other hand, had enough length and versatility (Klay Thompson/Harrison Barnes) to challenge Parker on both ends. One of the keys to Mark Jackson's game plan was to force Parker to switch defensively against Harrison Barnes or Klay Thompson, so that either two can back him down, or shoot over him . . . IMO, the Heat have the personnel and the defensive identity to replicate and adapt a similar game plan . . .

Edited by StreetCred, 28 May 2013 - 05:57 PM.

H2H STANDARD DAILY 9 CATS 7TH PICK:
PG Ty Lawson (Den), Isaiah Thomas (Sac), Jrue Holiday (NO), D.J. Augustin (Chi)
SG Kevin Martin (Min), Jodie Meeks (LAL)
SF Paul George (Ind), Nicholas Batum (Por)
PF Paul Millsap (Atl), Channing Frye (Pho), Terrence Jones (Hou)
C Marcin Gortat (Was), Anderson Varejao (Cle)

#22 sasnumberonefan

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 06:02 PM

No doubt Heat have the edge if that ends up the series, but I think it goes 6 for sure. These teams have yet to play each other full strength, so I don't think any regular season comps can be used as backup. I think we can match up pretty good with the Heat. Tony on Chalmers, Kawhi on LeBron (matchup of the series) with Green also guarding him, Green on Wade, Tim Duncan on Haslem? and Diaw on Bosh. Manu is the key to this series though IMO. If he can regain even a portion of his 05 form, just for 7 games, I think we get the edge. That is a tall order, but I have faith in this group and in Pop. Gonna be a fun Finals.
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#23 Patrick Bateman

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 06:06 PM



@sasnumberonefan, you're totally right . . . The Spurs have the championship pedigree, are too experienced, and are too well-coached to be counted out in a potential matchup against the Heat . . . When I said that the Heat have a "huge edge", it wasn't meant to discount the most successful franchise in the last decade . . . During their final regular season matchup, I saw something very interesting . . . The Heat were able to corral Tony Parker's screen-and-rolls, and this without Lebron/Wade/Chalmers in the lineup . . . I also think the Heat have the personnel to send various looks against Parker, with Chalmers, Cole, and Lebron potentially taking turns to guard him on the bounce, coupled with consistent traps coming from their versatile frontcourt . . . I also took something from the Warriors-Spurs series, when Mark Jackson used the length and versatility of his guards and wings (Klay Thompson, Harrison Barnes) to challenge Parker on both ends . . . The Heat, IMO, have the backcourt/wing versatility to replicate the Warriors blueprint . . .


Parker was playing on one ankle in that game. He wasn't healthy. You can take very little away from either matchup this season as both teams sort of ducked each other b/c of circumstance....

I totally agree that there is no definitive take-away from the regular season . . . But if you watched the Spurs-Warriors series, you saw Mark Jackson's strategy of making Tony Parker work on both ends. Styles make fights. The Spurs made easy work of the Grizzlies because the Grizz personnel had no effective counter to Parker's screen-and-roll game. Tony Allen may be a solid one-on-one defender, and Marc Gasol a great low-post defender, BUT the Grizz had no one fast enough or versatile enough to cover Tony Parker on the help side. Couple that with the Grizzlies having no one in their roster to punish Parker on the offensive side. The Warriors, on the other hand, had enough length and versatility (Klay Thompson/Harrison Barnes) to challenge Parker on both ends. One of the keys to Mark Jackson's game plan was to force Parker to switch defensively against Harrison Barnes or Klay Thompson, so that either two can back him down, or shoot over him . . . IMO, the Heat have the personnel and the defensive identity to replicate and adapt a similar game plan . . .


I understand what you're saying and I agree with the Grizzlies portion but the Heat don't really have anyone to make him "work" on the defensive end unless they go with their all wing deployment (Wade, Lebron, Battier, Allen, and Bosh) in which case Parker will be on Allen. Otherwise, they have Chalmers (more of a spot up shooter) and Cole (more of a defender/energy guy). In the Warrior series, Parker was being banged around on screen after screen and he was running around constantly chasing Curry before finally Pop wised up and put Green or Kawhi on him. The Heat don't do anything like this so it's not really comparable.

The Heat will have a quickness advantage with the big screen and will be able to close out on the double high roll (where the Spurs side PNR and then bring Duncan in behind Tiago/Diaw for a foul line jumper) off the side PNR. This will give the Spurs fits. It's the Heat's athleticism that may be the Spurs undoing. Unless the Heat are going to put Wade on Parker, something that I think would work in the Spurs favor as Wade is already banged up. I'd welcome the opportunity for him to try and run and around and thru screens for 38 minutes in game one......He may not come out for game 2.
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#24 StreetCred

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 06:42 PM

To clarify, I wasn't saying that the Heat had a Steph Curry-type PG to make Parker work . . . I was saying that unlike the Grizzlies, the Heat have the personnel to force Parker on some mismatches by using Lebron or Wade to initiate a guard-to-guard pick-and-roll, forcing Parker to switch on either those two, then those two isolating Parker on the perimeter, or on the high post . . . If Parker is guarding a taller Ray Allen, then the Heat can run Allen on some baseline and pin down screens to get a shot over Parker, or by simply posting Allen on the block to back down Parker . . .

Edited by StreetCred, 28 May 2013 - 06:47 PM.

H2H STANDARD DAILY 9 CATS 7TH PICK:
PG Ty Lawson (Den), Isaiah Thomas (Sac), Jrue Holiday (NO), D.J. Augustin (Chi)
SG Kevin Martin (Min), Jodie Meeks (LAL)
SF Paul George (Ind), Nicholas Batum (Por)
PF Paul Millsap (Atl), Channing Frye (Pho), Terrence Jones (Hou)
C Marcin Gortat (Was), Anderson Varejao (Cle)

#25 Patrick Bateman

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 06:55 PM

To clarify, I wasn't saying that the Heat had a Steph Curry-type PG to make Parker work . . . I was saying that unlike the Grizzlies, the Heat have the personnel force Parker on some mismatches by using Lebron or Wade to initiate a guard-to-guard pick-and-roll, forcing Parker to switch on either those two, then those two isolating Parker on the perimeter, or on the high post . . . Another option is if Parker is guarding a taller Ray Allen, the Heat can run Allen on some baseline screens to get a close shot over Parker, or by simply posting Allen on the block to back down Parker. In actuality, the Heat have more offensive versatility than the Warriors . . .


Again, I don't follow. Only in the all wing alignment, which I don't know how much the Heat will roll with, would Parker be on Allen. Allen in the post at this point is something the Spurs will live with. I don't get how they're going to get consistently get Wade or Lebron on Parker, even running a PNR w/ Chalmers running off a pick set by Lebron. Spurs will just run underneath or over the pick and live with Chalmers or Cole shooting off the dribble 20 foot jump shots all day rather than switching. The problem with the Warriors was you can't run or sag beneath the pick. Curry and to a degree when he's hot, Thompson, are much, much more dangerous jump shooters with much quicker releases. The Spurs would love for Chalmers and Cole to shoot 25+ times a game from 18+ off a PNR when the Spurs don't switch. If they hit 50% and the Heat in then the Spurs will live with that. They would rather have those guys shooting off the dribble jump shots then Lebron in the lane or kicking to those guys spotted up and wide open. I don't understand how the Heat are going to force TP thru PNR on Wade or Lebron consistently. Sort of apples and oranges on how one would defend it. If Chalmers goes Stephon Curry then the Heat are going to be impossible to beat anyway.....A PNR with Wade and Lebron would be a situation for Kawhi and Danny Green to figure out.

BTW, I could see the all wing formation in crunch time for the Heat, but again, I think the Spurs will just have to live with Ray Allen at almost 38 years old trying to post. This ain't Jesus Shuttlesworth!!!
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#26 StreetCred

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:03 PM

Again, to clarify, it's not Lebron or Wade setting the pick . . . its Chalmers or Cole setting the pick, forcing Parker to switch on either Lebron or Wade . . . The Heat are adept at this type of inverted offense, making the point guard set the screen for Lebron . . .

Edited by StreetCred, 28 May 2013 - 07:09 PM.

H2H STANDARD DAILY 9 CATS 7TH PICK:
PG Ty Lawson (Den), Isaiah Thomas (Sac), Jrue Holiday (NO), D.J. Augustin (Chi)
SG Kevin Martin (Min), Jodie Meeks (LAL)
SF Paul George (Ind), Nicholas Batum (Por)
PF Paul Millsap (Atl), Channing Frye (Pho), Terrence Jones (Hou)
C Marcin Gortat (Was), Anderson Varejao (Cle)

#27 keep it ONE hunnid

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:04 PM



Anybody seen the latest "SportsCenter Science" on LeBron?


The fact Lebron throws a basketball faster than Tom Brady throwing a football is disturbing.

Edited by keep it ONE hunnid, 28 May 2013 - 07:05 PM.


#28 StreetCred

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:05 PM

I'm not even suggesting that posting Ray Allen IF Parker is on him would represent the Heat's main strategy . . . It's just another wrinkle they can do to pressure Parker . . .
H2H STANDARD DAILY 9 CATS 7TH PICK:
PG Ty Lawson (Den), Isaiah Thomas (Sac), Jrue Holiday (NO), D.J. Augustin (Chi)
SG Kevin Martin (Min), Jodie Meeks (LAL)
SF Paul George (Ind), Nicholas Batum (Por)
PF Paul Millsap (Atl), Channing Frye (Pho), Terrence Jones (Hou)
C Marcin Gortat (Was), Anderson Varejao (Cle)

#29 Patrick Bateman

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:11 PM

Again, to clarify, it's not Lebron or Wade setting the pick . . . its Chalmers or Cole setting the pick, forcing Parker to switch on either Lebron or Wade . . . The Heat are adept at this type of inverted offense, making the point guard set the screen for Lebron . . .


Gotcha. Yea, the Spurs won't switch on that. Most likely just sag underneath it as neither Chalmers or Cole have a big base that would create a lot of space. Obviously like any PNR, Parker will hedge but Kawhi or Danny will go underneath that pick especially on Wade. They'll live with Wade shooting 22 footers.
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#30 StreetCred

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:14 PM

Yes, agreed that the Spurs will never switch that . . . but the Heat will try to force the switch . . . Again, it's just another way the Heat can attack Parker, when they do get that switch.

Edited by StreetCred, 28 May 2013 - 07:23 PM.

H2H STANDARD DAILY 9 CATS 7TH PICK:
PG Ty Lawson (Den), Isaiah Thomas (Sac), Jrue Holiday (NO), D.J. Augustin (Chi)
SG Kevin Martin (Min), Jodie Meeks (LAL)
SF Paul George (Ind), Nicholas Batum (Por)
PF Paul Millsap (Atl), Channing Frye (Pho), Terrence Jones (Hou)
C Marcin Gortat (Was), Anderson Varejao (Cle)

#31 nickalero99

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 10:26 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQLSlWi7NRA

Anybody seen the latest "SportsCenter Science" on LeBron?


The fact Lebron throws a basketball faster than Tom Brady throwing a football is disturbing.


That is amazing, but it's not like Tom Brady is in the upper tier of NFL QB's on pure throwing power. That was one of the reasons for the infamous Brady ESPN 30 for 30. It's also not like most of the NFL QB's are even on par with an average MLB SP.

#32 sasnumberonefan

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 11:47 PM

I think we may have been getting ahead of ourselves on penciling in the Heat for the Finals, myself included. Pacers shouldn't be counted out till that final whistle blows, and I hope this series goes 7 from a pure entertainment standpoint. Personally, I'd love to play the Pacers over the Heat in the Finals, but these next few games will be good.
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QB: Romo RB: Ogbonnaya, Pierre Thomas WR: Brandon Marshall, Jordy Nelson, Josh Gordon (K, 16th) TE: Jimmy Graham (K, 3rd) D/ST: New England K: Nick Folk Bench: Percy Harvin (K, FA) Justin Blackmon (K, FA) Toby Gerhart, Darren Sproles, Andre Brown, Danny Amendola

#33 EatPrayLove

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 12:30 AM

I think we may have been getting ahead of ourselves on penciling in the Heat for the Finals, myself included. Pacers shouldn't be counted out till that final whistle blows, and I hope this series goes 7 from a pure entertainment standpoint. Personally, I'd love to play the Pacers over the Heat in the Finals, but these next few games will be good.


I bet you would. Pacers would get overwhelmed by the Spurs much like the Grizzlies if they were to make it.

#34 sasnumberonefan

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 08:48 AM


I think we may have been getting ahead of ourselves on penciling in the Heat for the Finals, myself included. Pacers shouldn't be counted out till that final whistle blows, and I hope this series goes 7 from a pure entertainment standpoint. Personally, I'd love to play the Pacers over the Heat in the Finals, but these next few games will be good.


I bet you would. Pacers would get overwhelmed by the Spurs much like the Grizzlies if they were to make it.


Here's to hoping!
FFB 12 Team Standard 4 Keeper lose the draft pick the keeper was taken in
QB: Romo RB: Ogbonnaya, Pierre Thomas WR: Brandon Marshall, Jordy Nelson, Josh Gordon (K, 16th) TE: Jimmy Graham (K, 3rd) D/ST: New England K: Nick Folk Bench: Percy Harvin (K, FA) Justin Blackmon (K, FA) Toby Gerhart, Darren Sproles, Andre Brown, Danny Amendola

#35 markdash

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 06:02 PM

Spurs over Heat was my prediction in the "Bold Predictions" thread, so let's stick with it, shall we?

(That thread is amusing, I hit on like half the bold predictions and missed badly on the other half)
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#36 ballsohard

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 06:53 PM

An ESPN Insider article came out stating that the Spurs are better off facing the Heat than the Pacers. Does anyone with an Insider account care to share a summary of it? I'm especially curious because for me, the Spurs would be a lot better off facing the Pacers than the heat.

#37 EatPrayLove

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 10:10 PM

An ESPN Insider article came out stating that the Spurs are better off facing the Heat than the Pacers. Does anyone with an Insider account care to share a summary of it? I'm especially curious because for me, the Spurs would be a lot better off facing the Pacers than the heat.


Really? Who is it written by? The only reason I could see why is if the writer was playing up all of the Heat's injuries including fresh injuries to Bosh and Lebron (although minor) as maybe being more vulnerable than a fully fit Pacers squad?

#38 Doctor L

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 10:15 PM

An ESPN Insider article came out stating that the Spurs are better off facing the Heat than the Pacers. Does anyone with an Insider account care to share a summary of it? I'm especially curious because for me, the Spurs would be a lot better off facing the Pacers than the heat.


I'll just post the whole thing for you guys. It's not insider but I think this is what you might've been talking about. i have Insider but I didn't see anything. http://espn.go.com/n...-game-5-preview

The Spurs win the West! What kind of shot do they have against the East?

Steve Aschburner, NBA.com: What, the West suddenly is the D-League? Yes, Memphis has flaws, Oklahoma City was hurt, Golden State overachieved as it was and – ha! ha! – some people actually expected the Lakers to still be standing at this point. But none of that has a thing to do with San Antonio’s fitness to win it all. The Spurs have the best coach in the NBA, the best point guard these days, an echoes-stirring Hall of Famer and role players who do what they’re supposed to. I see San Antonio as a toss-up vs. Miami now and a favorite vs. Indiana. So yeah, a big chance.
Fran Blinebury, NBA.com: I’ll make this short and sweet. Spurs in six against either one.
Jeff Caplan, NBA.com: I believe the Spurs have such a good chance to win it all that I’m declaring them the favorite right here, right now, no matter which team prevails out of the East. If it’s Indiana, give me the Spurs in 6. If it’s the Heat, give me the Spurs in 6. No player has elevated his game to a higher degree thanTony Parker and no team is playing more cohesive, efficient ball than the San Antonio Spurs.

Posted Image
Tony Parker (Noah Graham/NBAE)


Scott Howard-Cooper, NBA.com: Definitely give them a chance, enough that maybe the question should be “How much of a chance do you give the East winner against the Spurs?” Beating the Grizzlies in the Western Conference final, at a time Memphis had been playing so well, would have been impressive enough. Sweeping the Grizz is an incredible run-up to the championship series. And now San Antonio gets to rest while Miami and Indiana knock each other around for at least two more games and possibly longer. The Spurs, of course, are voting for longer.
John Schuhmann, NBA.com: I give them a great chance against either potential opponent. If they play Miami, they have the pick-and-roll game, ball movement, and weak-side shooting to take advantage of the Heat’s aggressiveness. They also protect the rim very well when Duncan and Splitter are on the floor together. Against Indiana, I think Tony Parker, with his mid-range game and floaters, can take advantage of the way the Pacers defend pick-and-rolls. The Spurs scored pretty easily against the league’s No. 1 defense in the two regular season meetings, and Parker had 33 points and 10 assists in the second of the two. The Heat could change my mind in the next few days, but right now, I’m leaning toward picking the Spurs no matter who the opponent is.
Sekou Smith, NBA.com: I give them an even shot against the Heat and will go as high as75 percent against the Pacers. Any fears I had of the Spurs being too old were doused with their back-to-back undressing of younger, “more athletic” upstarts in Golden State and Memphis. The Benjamin Button All-Stars showed me that they have every intention of finishing what they started in the playoffs last year, when their run was interrupted by those young guns from Oklahoma City. The Spurs have an experience advantage over the Pacers that would be pronounced in The Finals. They’d have no such advantage if they matched up with the Heat. But based on the way they handled the Warriors and Grizzlies, they’d have just as good of a chance to walk away with the Larry O’Brien trophy as the Heat in a best-of-seven series.
Lang Whitaker, NBA.com’s All Ball blog: A great chance. No matter which team comes out of the East.Honestly, what kind of team do they not match up against? They’ve got one of the best post players of all-time, they’ve got one of the best point guards in the League, they’ve got a killer sixth man, they’ve got wing scoring and defense, they’ve got depth, and they’ve got arguably the best coach of his generation. They might not be the most exciting team in the League, but they are one of the best, if not the best.
Akshay Manwani, NBA.com India: It would be a good series no matter who the Spurs play, but I think they will eventually run out of steam. Compared to both Miami and Indiana, San Antonio’s an older outfit. Miami will beat them with their athleticism while the Pacers are a very physical team who are simply relentless on the boards. But yes, like I said, it will be a fascinating 2013 NBA Finals.
Eduardo Schell, NBA España: It’s 2013. An odd year like ’99, ’03, ’05 and ’07. Just watch the trend here and bear in mind that the Cocoon-type swimming pool at San Antonio is still giving eternal youth to Duncan, Ginobili and Parker. So the very well-coached Spurs have a chance. They work as a unit, an orchestra – a true TEAM aiming for a Hollywood ending for this dynasty. And with the curse lifted off T-Mac, anything can happen.
Adriano Albuquerque, NBA Brasil: A very good chance. The Spurs actually look like the best team in the league right now. Against the Grizzlies, they showed that they have multiple ways to win games and if you negate one of them, they will only come back stronger. The keys to beating San Antonio, exposed by the Warriors in the second round, are guard speed and outside shooting, and neither the Heat or the Pacers have both of these. Also, no one seems able to slow down Tony Parker. The Spurs look like the favorites right now.

Edited by Doctor L, 30 May 2013 - 10:18 PM.


#39 EatPrayLove

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 10:48 PM

If the Heat beat the Pacers I would say the Finals would be almost a coin flip for who wins. Spurs have more championship experience but Miami has the home court advantage.

Barring major injury, I would still say Heat hold a slight edge to take it out but it would have to be something like 53/47 split in the Heat's favor.

#40 gsw

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 01:58 AM

If anyone believes the Spurs have a better chance versus Miami than Indy, they need to get their head checked. Indy is basically a clone of Memphis: aka no 3-point shooting and spacing to deter the Spurs defense. That is just the most ridiculous garbage I have ever read.