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The Dynasty League ConundrumSacrificing Upside for Proven Players


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#1 AirForceOne

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 07:52 PM

This seems to happen to me every year. I load up with the 'high upside' guys in the draft. A few are decent, and a few are awful. And maybe these guys won't always be awful, but it's clear they require more patience to improve... Possibly another full season -- if not longer.

But, the solid guys I DO start every week has led my team to an average start. Still in the hunt for the playoffs, a little over half the season left, and it's pretty clear that I'm gonna have to trade one of my beloved 'high upside' guys for a veteran on the downside of his career to get my team to the playoffs.

The first option is standing pat, hoping that my players improve (some drastically) as the season goes on. If I stay patient, I will potentially have a stacked team next year.

The second is make a trade or two for a solid veteran starter -- and hope they play well enough to get me to the promised land THIS year...because these guys are at the tail end of their careers and it won't be long before they retire or give way to the next guy.

Is it worth sacrificing guys like Terrance Williams, Reuben Randle, Lamar Miller, Cameron Jordan, Trent Richardson, Andrew Luck, and/or 1st round draft pick(s) for a Peyton Manning, Tony Gonzalez, Tom Brady, Larry Fitzgerald, Wes Welker, Frank Gore, Knowshon Moreno or Marshawn Lynch?

At what point do you sacrifice the future of your franchise to win now?

Edited by AirForceOne, 16 October 2013 - 07:53 PM.


#2 kflo01

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:06 PM

To answer. Yes within reason. If your real close say your qb is weeden and the guy who has manning is winless yes you trade so future peices to win a chip without a doubt.
Name of the game is to win chips not stack players to say oh look at all these guys I got.
But if you dont think you can win it all. Stay put and build from within with your young talent.

#3 undefined

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:09 PM

Answer: you win now.  You always win now.  Rebuilding is another name for losing.
"He could have had a much bigger game."  -- words etched on Dez Bryant's tombstone.

#4 Boss Battle E

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:13 PM

Rebuilding is another name for losing if you don't win eventually. You can 'rebuild' so long as it actually pays off. You get caught in the Jaguars, Browns, Bills, Raiders forever rebuilding mode then yes, it's another name for losing. But if you trade away veteran players for younger talent to forgo winning this year and possible make a deep run in the years to come, how is that wrong?

To add to this, I tried the win now mentality in the waning years of a dynasty league a few years back before it closed shop, and it back fired a couple years later. Once those guys fall off or retire, you're kinda f*cked and forced into rebuilding because you either can't trade them for any kind of talent or they just left so now you're SOL.

Edited by Boss Battle E, 16 October 2013 - 08:17 PM.

Alliance of Sh*t Stompers (1-1) (2012 Champions, 2013 Champions)
QB: Jay Cutler, Carson Palmer
RB: Matt Forte, Giovani Bernard, Mark Ingram, Jonathan Stewart
WR: Dez Bryant, Randall Cobb, Golden Tate, Mike Evans, Allen Hurns, Marqise Lee
TE: Eric Ebron, Zach Miller
D/ST: Saints
IR: Marvin Jones

Touchdown Kings (1-1) - 1 Year Military League
QB: Aaron Rodgers, Carson Palmer
RB: Montee Ball, Bishop Sankey, Joique Bell, Jeremy Hill, Terrence West
WR: Dez Bryant, DeAndre Hopkins, DeSean Jackson, Sammy Watkins
TE: Rob Gronkowski, Dennis Pitta, Zach Miller
D/ST: Saints
K: Dan Bailey
IR: -none-

#5 96mnc

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:18 PM

Depends.  Is a true dynasty league or a keeper league?

I lean towards win now, especially in football where major injuries happen at any moment.  

If you "rebuild" in a keeper league that should be for next year, no longer than that.  Dynasty can vary depending on your league and roster size.

#6 undefined

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:20 PM

View PostBoss Battle E, on 16 October 2013 - 08:13 PM, said:

Rebuilding is another name for losing if you don't win eventually. You can 'rebuild' so long as it actually pays off. You get caught in the Jaguars, Browns, Bills, Raiders forever rebuilding mode then yes, it's another name for losing. But if you trade away veteran players for younger talent to forgo winning this year and possible make a deep run in the years to come, how is that wrong?
If my veteran players are guys like Peyton Manning, Wes Welker, or Marshawn Lynch, I'm not thinking about trading them away for prospects or draft picks unless I have zero chance of making the playoffs.  Otherwise I'm trying to win the title with those guys.
"He could have had a much bigger game."  -- words etched on Dez Bryant's tombstone.

#7 Boss Battle E

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:28 PM

View Postundefined, on 16 October 2013 - 08:20 PM, said:

View PostBoss Battle E, on 16 October 2013 - 08:13 PM, said:

Rebuilding is another name for losing if you don't win eventually. You can 'rebuild' so long as it actually pays off. You get caught in the Jaguars, Browns, Bills, Raiders forever rebuilding mode then yes, it's another name for losing. But if you trade away veteran players for younger talent to forgo winning this year and possible make a deep run in the years to come, how is that wrong?
If my veteran players are guys like Peyton Manning, Wes Welker, or Marshawn Lynch, I'm not thinking about trading them away for prospects or draft picks unless I have zero chance of making the playoffs.  Otherwise I'm trying to win the title with those guys.

Well obviously. I didn't say trade away the farm for years to come. All I was saying was that rebuilding is not necessarily a bad thing. Gotta find that balance.
Alliance of Sh*t Stompers (1-1) (2012 Champions, 2013 Champions)
QB: Jay Cutler, Carson Palmer
RB: Matt Forte, Giovani Bernard, Mark Ingram, Jonathan Stewart
WR: Dez Bryant, Randall Cobb, Golden Tate, Mike Evans, Allen Hurns, Marqise Lee
TE: Eric Ebron, Zach Miller
D/ST: Saints
IR: Marvin Jones

Touchdown Kings (1-1) - 1 Year Military League
QB: Aaron Rodgers, Carson Palmer
RB: Montee Ball, Bishop Sankey, Joique Bell, Jeremy Hill, Terrence West
WR: Dez Bryant, DeAndre Hopkins, DeSean Jackson, Sammy Watkins
TE: Rob Gronkowski, Dennis Pitta, Zach Miller
D/ST: Saints
K: Dan Bailey
IR: -none-

#8 undefined

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 08:32 PM

View PostBoss Battle E, on 16 October 2013 - 08:28 PM, said:

View Postundefined, on 16 October 2013 - 08:20 PM, said:

View PostBoss Battle E, on 16 October 2013 - 08:13 PM, said:

Rebuilding is another name for losing if you don't win eventually. You can 'rebuild' so long as it actually pays off. You get caught in the Jaguars, Browns, Bills, Raiders forever rebuilding mode then yes, it's another name for losing. But if you trade away veteran players for younger talent to forgo winning this year and possible make a deep run in the years to come, how is that wrong?
If my veteran players are guys like Peyton Manning, Wes Welker, or Marshawn Lynch, I'm not thinking about trading them away for prospects or draft picks unless I have zero chance of making the playoffs.  Otherwise I'm trying to win the title with those guys.

Well obviously. I didn't say trade away the farm for years to come. All I was saying was that rebuilding is not necessarily a bad thing. Gotta find that balance.
I see.  I guess I took the original question as an either/or.
"He could have had a much bigger game."  -- words etched on Dez Bryant's tombstone.

#9 Fortunax

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 02:14 PM

These are some ridiculous responses. Why would you sacrifice a few years of winning for maybe getting to the playoffs this year? How does that make any sense in a DYNASTY league, sure it equates to losing right now... but what does that really matter? What if your high-upside guys start producing down the stretch as their teams realize how good they are and slowly work them into the playbook. Then you will be looking silly as you trade Terrence Williams for 1-2 years of a veteran, while the other owner enjoys 5+ years of Terrence Williams.

Being mediocre is not the  way to do things. If you are not going to win your league by trading some upside guys then do not do it. If you were in the hunt for a #1 spot then I would say yeah trade some guys and win, but it sounds like you are just in the hunt for a playoff spot. Do you really think 1 veteran is going to change all of that (unless you get Jamal Charles or someone like that)? Why not role with what you have and keep adding players through the draft and waiver. Maybe even trade some of your veterans for younger players. Then instead of being stoked with making playoffs this year, you can be stoked when you make the playoffs and contend for a title every year.

For everyone that says "Rebuilding = Losing" ask the Spurs and the Sonics/Thunder how rebuilding worked out for them. Pretty good I would say. It's always smart to sacrifice a year or two for longevity as a contender.
Y! 14-Team Dynasty League (PPR) - '09 '12 Champ

QB-Brees/WR- B. Marshall, D.Jackson, R.Streater/RB-A.Foster, A.Ellington/TE-T.Eifert/WT-L.Green/WRB-R.Jennings/K-D.Bailey/DEF-Tampa Bay
BN- R.Tannehill, J.Stewart, C.Ivory, M. Jones, O. Beckham, D. Adams, A.Robinson, D. Carr
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Y! 20-Team Dynasty - Keep all players

C: T D'Arnaud, F. Cervelli
1B: Paul Goldschmidt
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RP: Chapman, Grilli, Perez, Gregerson, Strop, E. Jackson, A. Ogando, W.Smith, Dice-K

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#10 CL3VELANDBR0WNS

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 12:48 PM

Rebuilding is not another name for losing.... I am rebuilding. I took myself out of the hunt this year. I was tired of coming in 3rd-6th place year after year. I wanted to finally put a squad together that will come in first.... if you keep drafting below 10th pick every year then you will be stuck in 3rd.
CSB : In my old dynasty league, I took over a 2 win team and with the help of 2 first round picks, I came in third the next year. That league crumbled last year but I was consistently a playoff team who would lose before they hit the championship game.
14 tm non-ppr dynasty 30-man
QB- RG3, Carr , Austin Davis
RB- Martin, Gio, Stacy, Pierre, DMC, Bryce, Dunbar, Stewart
WR- Josh Gordon, Sammy Watkins, Michael Floyd, Cordarrelle Patterson, Cecil Shorts, Kendall Wright, Justin Hunter, Kenny Britt, Mike Williams, Brian Quick, Allen Hurns
TE- Gronk, Reed,CJF
K- Parkey
DT- Sen'Derrick Marks
DE- Jason Pierre-Paul
LB-Mosley, Shazier
CB- Johnathan Joseph
S- Cyprien
IR- Blackmon, KHunter, Alonso, DWashington, Marquess Wilson

#11 Ddam2013

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 01:02 PM

I love playing in dynasty leagues. In my main league I'm for sure going to be in the playoffs and another playoff team offered me a top 4 pick in next years rookie draft for tony Gonzalez (before the injuries to the falcons receivers) and I accepted it, CSB I know but it proves a point that you can win and rebuild at the same time. I traded away a top 5 TE yes, but I will get a top rookie for years to come. There is a fine line that you can walk where you win AND get good players.

Edited by Ddam2013, 02 November 2013 - 01:02 PM.

Winning gold is simple, you just have to be the best in the world at it.

#12 CL3VELANDBR0WNS

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 01:49 PM

View PostDdam2013, on 02 November 2013 - 01:02 PM, said:

I love playing in dynasty leagues. In my main league I'm for sure going to be in the playoffs and another playoff team offered me a top 4 pick in next years rookie draft for tony Gonzalez (before the injuries to the falcons receivers) and I accepted it, CSB I know but it proves a point that you can win and rebuild at the same time. I traded away a top 5 TE yes, but I will get a top rookie for years to come. There is a fine line that you can walk where you win AND get good players.
Wow nice.... long-term, I would take a TE in your draft like Jenkins or Ebron over gonzo.
14 tm non-ppr dynasty 30-man
QB- RG3, Carr , Austin Davis
RB- Martin, Gio, Stacy, Pierre, DMC, Bryce, Dunbar, Stewart
WR- Josh Gordon, Sammy Watkins, Michael Floyd, Cordarrelle Patterson, Cecil Shorts, Kendall Wright, Justin Hunter, Kenny Britt, Mike Williams, Brian Quick, Allen Hurns
TE- Gronk, Reed,CJF
K- Parkey
DT- Sen'Derrick Marks
DE- Jason Pierre-Paul
LB-Mosley, Shazier
CB- Johnathan Joseph
S- Cyprien
IR- Blackmon, KHunter, Alonso, DWashington, Marquess Wilson

#13 Cecilute Your Shorts

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 01:59 PM

I think it's a balance and every decision varies by situation. You have to understand how much of a chance you have at winning and then judge the future talent's weight, then trade accordingly.

For example, I am in a 4-keeper league and went with the approach of grabbing a few future studs like $2 Gordon and $3 Giovani. However I also nabbed a $1 Cameron to fill in for a cheap Gronk. I have Tate and K Allen as well so I was fairly stacked with top keeper value.

I was offered Dez and Calvin for Giovani, Cameron, and Gordon and I turned it down. I am in the middle of the pack in regards to standings, so why risk giving up 3-4 years of huge value from guys like Gio and Gordon, for the off-chance I win this year with the addition of Calvin and Dez. There is too much luck involved to throw away so much future potential unless I am a lock for the playoffs and a championship.

That's how I view it at least. And I ended up trading Allen, Cameron, and MJD for Dez. Being able to keep the top future value is my highest priority because I have hopes of being dominant in all the years to come. So all-in-all, use your judgement. There is no set answer to it, just depends on how you value the talent.
12-Team Dynasty (year 1); $300 budget; Keep 14 of 23; 2RB, 3WR, 2Flex
QBs: Cutler, A. Smith
RBs: Martin, Stacy, Giovani, Rashad Jennings, Ka'Deem Carey, Charles Sims [IR], Peyton Hillis
WRs: Calvin, DeAndre Hopkins, Hawkins, Miles Austin, Malcolm Floyd, Davante Adams, Cody Latimer, Josh Gordon
TEs: Clay, Kelce, Amaro
D/ST: Saints, Eagles
K: Dawson

10-Team Auction Keeper; $200 budget; Keep 4
QB: Tom Brady
RB1: Forte (K $33)
RB2: Giovani (K $3)
WR1: Julio Jones
WR2: Keenan Allen (K $6)
Flex: Doug Martin
TE: Gronk (K $11)
D/ST: Cincy
K: Crosby

Bench (6-spots): Cordarrelle, Kendall Wright, Jeremy Hill, Jordan Reed, Jordan Matthews, Josh Gordon

#14 CrypTviLL

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:03 PM

I have a mentality... this is a game... just win now, do everything you can to win now.
[ Ƥəɨɳ ]
QB Aaron Rodgers
WR Brandon Marshall
WR A.J. Green
WR Dez Bryant
RB Matt Forte
RB Jamaal Charles
TE Rob Gronkowski
K Matt Prater
DEF Streaming
Bench: Cecil Shorts III, Steven Ridley, Harry Douglas, Le'Veon Bell, Zac Stacy, Danny Amendola

#15 cs3

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:18 PM

Dont ever plan for the future at the expense of the current season in dynasty football leagues.
Dynasty leagues almost never last beyond a couple years. Many teams become awful beyond repair very very quickly, owners quit, and the league dissolves.

So always play to win as if its the last year of the league imo.

#16 Ddam2013

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:24 PM

View Postcs3, on 02 November 2013 - 02:18 PM, said:

Dont ever plan for the future at the expense of the current season in dynasty football leagues.
Dynasty leagues almost never last beyond a couple years. Many teams become awful beyond repair very very quickly, owners quit, and the league dissolves.

So always play to win as if its the last year of the league imo.
I'm only in 3 dynasty leagues 2 of them are currently in their 22nd year and the 3rd is in its 17th year, some dissolve yes but you just need good owners.
Winning gold is simple, you just have to be the best in the world at it.

#17 cs3

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:25 PM

I would say you are in the very rare minority.

#18 rippedonnitro

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:34 PM

View PostCL3VELANDBR0WNS, on 02 November 2013 - 12:48 PM, said:

Rebuilding is not another name for losing.... I am rebuilding. I took myself out of the hunt this year. I was tired of coming in 3rd-6th place year after year. I wanted to finally put a squad together that will come in first.... if you keep drafting below 10th pick every year then you will be stuck in 3rd.
CSB : In my old dynasty league, I took over a 2 win team and with the help of 2 first round picks, I came in third the next year. That league crumbled last year but I was consistently a playoff team who would lose before they hit the championship game.

Completely off topic, but was does 'csb' stand for?

#19 CL3VELANDBR0WNS

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:41 PM

View Postrippedonnitro, on 02 November 2013 - 02:34 PM, said:

View PostCL3VELANDBR0WNS, on 02 November 2013 - 12:48 PM, said:

Rebuilding is not another name for losing.... I am rebuilding. I took myself out of the hunt this year. I was tired of coming in 3rd-6th place year after year. I wanted to finally put a squad together that will come in first.... if you keep drafting below 10th pick every year then you will be stuck in 3rd.
CSB : In my old dynasty league, I took over a 2 win team and with the help of 2 first round picks, I came in third the next year. That league crumbled last year but I was consistently a playoff team who would lose before they hit the championship game.

Completely off topic, but was does 'csb' stand for?
Cool story bro
14 tm non-ppr dynasty 30-man
QB- RG3, Carr , Austin Davis
RB- Martin, Gio, Stacy, Pierre, DMC, Bryce, Dunbar, Stewart
WR- Josh Gordon, Sammy Watkins, Michael Floyd, Cordarrelle Patterson, Cecil Shorts, Kendall Wright, Justin Hunter, Kenny Britt, Mike Williams, Brian Quick, Allen Hurns
TE- Gronk, Reed,CJF
K- Parkey
DT- Sen'Derrick Marks
DE- Jason Pierre-Paul
LB-Mosley, Shazier
CB- Johnathan Joseph
S- Cyprien
IR- Blackmon, KHunter, Alonso, DWashington, Marquess Wilson

#20 CL3VELANDBR0WNS

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Posted 02 November 2013 - 02:42 PM

View Postcs3, on 02 November 2013 - 02:18 PM, said:

Dont ever plan for the future at the expense of the current season in dynasty football leagues.
Dynasty leagues almost never last beyond a couple years. Many teams become awful beyond repair very very quickly, owners quit, and the league dissolves.

So always play to win as if its the last year of the league imo.
I would like to say that all good owners need is one year to rebuild usually. If you are taking 3+ years to rebuild then you are doing something wrong.
14 tm non-ppr dynasty 30-man
QB- RG3, Carr , Austin Davis
RB- Martin, Gio, Stacy, Pierre, DMC, Bryce, Dunbar, Stewart
WR- Josh Gordon, Sammy Watkins, Michael Floyd, Cordarrelle Patterson, Cecil Shorts, Kendall Wright, Justin Hunter, Kenny Britt, Mike Williams, Brian Quick, Allen Hurns
TE- Gronk, Reed,CJF
K- Parkey
DT- Sen'Derrick Marks
DE- Jason Pierre-Paul
LB-Mosley, Shazier
CB- Johnathan Joseph
S- Cyprien
IR- Blackmon, KHunter, Alonso, DWashington, Marquess Wilson




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