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Alfred Morris 2014 Season Outlook


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#1 Code of Hammurabi

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:00 PM

I have a feeling that the exit of Shanny is going to be very bad for his value. I know there isnt a coach in place at the moment, but no matter who it is I'm going to very cautious with him next year. We all know that many of Shanny's back have been extreme system players that have often floundered in other situations. I am one of the few in the minority that actually thinks that Helu is more talented or at the least an equal talent. He was underutilized again this season. I have a feeling that the next coach is going to really look to get Helu involved more assuming he's still there (not sure of his free agency status).............
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#2 CyberneticGhostOfXMasPast

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:03 PM

K.

#3 joshua18

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:06 PM

I have a feeling that the exit of Shanny is going to be very bad for his value. I know there isnt a coach in place at the moment, but no matter who it is I'm going to very cautious with him next year. We all know that many of Shanny's back have been extreme system players that have often floundered in other situations. I am one of the few in the minority that actually thinks that Helu is more talented or at the least an equal talent. He was underutilized again this season. I have a feeling that the next coach is going to really look to get Helu involved more assuming he's still there (not sure of his free agency status).............


I completely agree. And Helu is more talented and complete as a back...hmm, may be worth stashing late in the draft next year.

#4 munde53

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:09 PM

Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.

#5 joshua18

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:15 PM

Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


Possible, but more likely scenario is that Morris = Mike Anderson.
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#6 Gains

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 11:11 PM

Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


morris is better at catching then last year but it still not what would consider a pass catching back.

also not many coaches ride back as heavy as shanny (kubriak does but he is shanny offshoot)

also not sure if they stick with the zone block scheme that works so well for morris.

plus garcon has chronic foot issues.........garcon misses time and the skins pass catcher are worse then the jets'

#7 Ddam2013

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:39 AM


Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


morris is better at catching then last year but it still not what would consider a pass catching back.

also not many coaches ride back as heavy as shanny (kubriak does but he is shanny offshoot)

also not sure if they stick with the zone block scheme that works so well for morris.

plus garcon has chronic foot issues.........garcon misses time and the skins pass catcher are worse then the jets'

I posted this before but I'll post it here again.
http://www.sbnation....ins-read-option
If you don't fell like clicking the link it shows that during his rookie year he averaged 4.6 YPC in pro style runs and 4 YPC in the zone read. The biggest negative for his value would be if they hire Art Briles, because let's face it he doesn't seem like he fits that scheme real well. I have said this before and will say it again, just because Helu's good at catching passes doesn't make him better than a player that has had 1600 and 1300 yards plus 20 TDs in two seasons. I'll take a running back that can run over one that can catch and no one in their right mind can say Helu is better than Morris, he doesn't even deserve to carry Alfs bags (not intended at you but to previous posters I just decided to have one post instead of two).
Edit: those were his rookie year YPC but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't change all that much this year.

Edited by Ddam2013, 31 December 2013 - 12:40 AM.

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#8 Shinobi88

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:46 AM

Buyer beware: this is a no-talent back who was 150% a product of Shanahan's system that had previously gotten big-time rushing seasons from Terrell Davis, Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson, Clinton Portis, Tatum Bell, and Helu/Royster. I'd be surprised if he rushed for 900 yards next season

#9 Ddam2013

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 12:51 AM

Buyer beware: this is a no-talent back who was 150% a product of Shanahan's system that had previously gotten big-time rushing seasons from Terrell Davis, Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson, Clinton Portis, Tatum Bell, and Helu/Royster. I'd be surprised if he rushed for 900 yards next season

Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees also have no talent either they are just products of McCarthy and Payton right.

Edited by Ddam2013, 31 December 2013 - 12:52 AM.

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#10 Shinobi88

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:22 AM


Buyer beware: this is a no-talent back who was 150% a product of Shanahan's system that had previously gotten big-time rushing seasons from Terrell Davis, Olandis Gary, Mike Anderson, Clinton Portis, Tatum Bell, and Helu/Royster. I'd be surprised if he rushed for 900 yards next season

Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees also have no talent either they are just products of McCarthy and Payton right.


Quarterbacking requires more smarts and skills than talent. See also: "Jay Cutler per game production vs. Josh McCown per game production". Think that applies to running backs as well?

Edited by dzemens, 31 December 2013 - 09:36 PM.


#11 SenatorSpaceman

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:18 AM


Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


Possible, but more likely scenario is that Morris = Mike Anderson.


So you think it's actually MORE likely that Morris all of a sudden becomes completely irrelevant? I mean he wasn't as much of a product of the system as many people would have you believe. If you compare his numbers from zone blocking to non-zone blocking plays, they're actually very comparable.

I don't predict that he will be an every down back in 2014, but I certainly wouldn't make any Mike Anderson comparisons either.

#12 Shinobi88

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:33 AM



Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


Possible, but more likely scenario is that Morris = Mike Anderson.


So you think it's actually MORE likely that Morris all of a sudden becomes completely irrelevant? I mean he wasn't as much of a product of the system as many people would have you believe. If you compare his numbers from zone blocking to non-zone blocking plays, they're actually very comparable.

I don't predict that he will be an every down back in 2014, but I certainly wouldn't make any Mike Anderson comparisons either.


Do you have ANY knowledge of how Mike Anderson performed in zone-blocking vs. non-zone blocking runs? If not, why would you even bring that point up when comparing Anderson to Morris? The base play of Shanahan's offense, aka the play his team will run the most over time, is the insize-zone run. The 2nd most common play in his system is the play-action pass that looks like an inside-zone run. In order to defend these two plays, the strategic move for defenses is to move your inside linebackers farther away from the line-of-scrimmage so they have more time to decipher the plays. Moving your linebackers farther back leaves you vulnerable to straight ahead runs. So running backs in Shanny's system SHOULD average more yards per carry on non-zone runs, because defenses are geared to slow down the zone. Zone-schemes and power-schemes require different talents from the running back. That's why we've seen Darren McFadden & MJD struggle on the ground the last two seasons when their team switched from a power-scheme to a zone-scheme or vice-versa. Alfred's talents are specifically designed for a zone-system. And they're not even especially good, which is why he was drafted so late. He'll completely bomb in a power-system and I don't even think he'll fare too well in a different style of zone-scheme
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#13 pikerbkb

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 07:41 PM




Or the next coach will favor a workhorse style back and will make Morris a 3 down back and Helu will become completely irrelevant.


Possible, but more likely scenario is that Morris = Mike Anderson.


So you think it's actually MORE likely that Morris all of a sudden becomes completely irrelevant? I mean he wasn't as much of a product of the system as many people would have you believe. If you compare his numbers from zone blocking to non-zone blocking plays, they're actually very comparable.

I don't predict that he will be an every down back in 2014, but I certainly wouldn't make any Mike Anderson comparisons either.


Do you have ANY knowledge of how Mike Anderson performed in zone-blocking vs. non-zone blocking runs? If not, why would you even bring that point up when comparing Anderson to Morris? The base play of Shanahan's offense, aka the play his team will run the most over time, is the insize-zone run. The 2nd most common play in his system is the play-action pass that looks like an inside-zone run. In order to defend these two plays, the strategic move for defenses is to move your inside linebackers farther away from the line-of-scrimmage so they have more time to decipher the plays. Moving your linebackers farther back leaves you vulnerable to straight ahead runs. So running backs in Shanny's system SHOULD average more yards per carry on non-zone runs, because defenses are geared to slow down the zone. Zone-schemes and power-schemes require different talents from the running back. That's why we've seen Darren McFadden & MJD struggle on the ground the last two seasons when their team switched from a power-scheme to a zone-scheme or vice-versa. Alfred's talents are specifically designed for a zone-system. And they're not even especially good, which is why he was drafted so late. He'll completely bomb in a power-system and I don't even think he'll fare too well in a different style of zone-scheme

The whole debate is kind of dumb and your opinion does seem a little out there. Morris is a talented back and doesn't need Shanny's scheme to have success. I will say that Morris is not "special", but neither is Stevan Ridley. Ridley runs primarily out of power blocking sets and has had a lot of success (when he's not fumbling). I mean, while your climbing out on your limb you want to also say that that Foster and Tate will bomb next year as well? Stacy's a 5th round pick without special skills and he's doing pretty damn good.Power or zone, there are not many backs that are special enough to make something out of nothing and be consistently productive. Heck, it takes a good running back like Ridley or Morris to take consistently take advantage of good run blocking at the point of attack and make good reads. If the blocking is there along with a competent passing attack and Morris is fed the ball he will do just fine next season. Let's not try and out think the room here.

Edited by pikerbkb, 31 December 2013 - 07:43 PM.

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#14 CL3VELANDBR0WNS

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 07:59 PM

Wow, I can't believe people actually think Morris is a product of Shannhan's system.
I am just going to go into the other room and laugh to myself. An explanation isn't needed for anyone who has eyes.
In fact, put me on record for this bold prediction. Morris will be a solid RB1 in 2014.

Edited by CL3VELANDBR0WNS, 31 December 2013 - 07:59 PM.

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#15 mbroo5880i

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:32 PM

Can't anyone argue a point on these forums anymore without attacking others and getting personal? This is fantasy football. This thread actually makes the ESPN forums look reasonable.
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#16 dzemens

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 09:44 PM

Personal attacks and racial arguments have no place on the forums. Lets keep it civil and keep it on topic. Thanks.
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#17 shypri

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 10:00 PM

They do have a decent early down runner and a good change of pace/ 3rd down back. They will split the work accordingly. Like a lot of other teams do. Just because the name Shanahan is somehow involved, people are still overreacting.
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#18 joshua18

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 10:13 PM

Amazing how people are overreacting to even the POSSIBILITY that Morris may be a Shanahan-system creation, and that next year his backup, who averaged 4.2 YPC before he got hurt (allowing Morris a chance to play in the first place) and doesn't have to come off of the field on 3rd downs, may be a much better fit for a new system.
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#19 zipsterfromvenus

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 11:45 PM

Hmm, perhaps we can revisit this when there is an actual coach in place. Posts that start with the words, "I have a feeling..." give me menstrual cramps, and I'm a dude. Just sayin.

#20 pikerbkb

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 04:34 PM

Amazing how people are overreacting to even the POSSIBILITY that Morris may be a Shanahan-system creation, and that next year his backup, who averaged 4.2 YPC before he got hurt (allowing Morris a chance to play in the first place) and doesn't have to come off of the field on 3rd downs, may be a much better fit for a new system.

Now that is a REASONABLE statement and in the realm of possibility. I think most of us are amazed by the posters saying he WILL BE A BUST in a power run scheme and quite possibly a bust in another zone dominated scheme and then flame a bunch of people for disagreeing...... Let's see, Average measurables, late round pick, Shanahan offense. Yep. He sucks, product of the system. Let's not consider his burst, tackle breaking power and vision at all in our analysis. come on. This guy was Zac Stacy BEFORE anyone knew who Zac Stacy was.

And Helu? The guy is talented but has an injury hx going back to college....was never a feature back...nevermind.

Edited by pikerbkb, 01 January 2014 - 04:37 PM.

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