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merlin401

Why don't we turn our attention to the stock market?

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Serious question.

With the amount of time and effort we spend on tracking baseball players and prospects, if we spent the same amount of time researching stocks, bonds, etc, wouldn't we be better off making a killing there than in a $30 league? The concepts are all the same. Buy low, sell high. You can watch your performance, which actually will be changing minute by minute if you so desire. There are strategies, analyst opinions, everything. For H2H guys, you won't get that high but essentially the stock market is like roto.

I've asked myself this question recently and don't see a reason why I would be spending so much time on baseball, even if I can win a few hundred at the end of the year. Thoughts?

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I do both. :)

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Serious question.

With the amount of time and effort we spend on tracking baseball players and prospects, if we spent the same amount of time researching stocks, bonds, etc, wouldn't we be better off making a killing there than in a $30 league? The concepts are all the same. Buy low, sell high. You can watch your performance, which actually will be changing minute by minute if you so desire. There are strategies, analyst opinions, everything. For H2H guys, you won't get that high but essentially the stock market is like roto.

I've asked myself this question recently and don't see a reason why I would be spending so much time on baseball, even if I can win a few hundred at the end of the year. Thoughts?

I know for my situation, I'm a working full-time college student and I don't make enough to invest. There's no point in buying a handful of stock every once in a while, the return isn't worth it. I would like to get into investing once I finish college though. I see your point that the stock market is indeed like fantasy sports, as I have made the connection before, but watching sports is more fun than watching market value go up and down :D

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I ask myself that too, and therefore do both. There is more to it than just buy low sell high though. Just as you have to know the game of baseball itself to play fantasy baseball, you need to know the language and analysis necessary for finance before you should invest.

I took some finance in college and briefly was a biotech analyst for a mutual fund, but I am still a novice.

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Personally, I dont know the jargon for finance, not can I lose my butt playin this. If I lost my house to FBB, I'd kick my own a** :)

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My wife asks me the same question. My answer? Because one is fun, the other is pretty boring. Analyzing players, forecasting their performance, drafting and then following said players is a hell of a lot more fun than analyzing financial markets and looking at ticker symbols all day.

Less money? Sure. But at least I'm happy doing it.

Edit add: Been playing in a $1k buy in, 12 team league. Same guys for the last 6 years. Needless to say, things get pretty intense and ultra competitive. Sort of like a "boiler room" setting.

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Analyzing players, forecasting their performance, drafting and then following said players is a hell of a lot more fun than analyzing financial markets and looking at ticker symbols all day.

There are few things more thrilling than making 50% back on your investment on a sleeper company that you invested in that goes off. I would say it's only boring in that there's no visual manifestation i.e. hitting a homerun that you watch go over the fence. Otherwise it's pretty much identical. It's less boring for you because you are a sports fan, but there are other folks who feel the opposite.

I can take excitement from both.

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There are few things more thrilling than making 50% back on your investment on a sleeper company that you invested in that goes off. I would say it's only boring in that there's no visual manifestation i.e. hitting a homerun that you watch go over the fence. Otherwise it's pretty much identical. It's less boring for you because you are a sports fan, but there are other folks who feel the opposite.

I can take excitement from both.

How often does that 50% return on the "sleeper" company happen? If it's often, are we talking long term or short term gains? If it's both, how about I pay you 10% and you do the research for me.

Deal?

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I was raised on NFL, MLB and the like. I was not raised on IPO, DOW and investments. Honestly though I would trade knowledge of the sporting world for knowledge of the stock market any day. I am completely in the dark when it comes to investments.

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So if someone asked me how to learn about playing fantasy baseball I'd say read Baseball Prospectus and the Baseball Forecaster to really understand the underlying metrics of player past performance and how they may impact the future.

What books would someone recommend for learn about how to play the stock market, including penny stocks and futures?

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I have actually thought this same thing, but frankly I do not know where to start. Do you guys have tips for novice stockholders? Maybe a good site with newbie information, or something like that? That would be fantastic to share.

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The stockmarket is rigged. Fantasy baseball is not.

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I do both as well. One thing that has really served me well that my dad (blue collar) drilled into my head over and over as I was growing up: The money that you make the first 5 years out of college is THE most imporant money you'll make in your lifetime because that's the money that gets the extra doubling. 400k turns to 800k with the extra doubling. 800k to 1.6 mil etc. So while my buddies bought nice new cars, etc ... I lived like I was still in college for another 4 years only bought a bed and a pc during that time and drove around a beater of a truck. The goal was to have 100k in the bank (not including retirement and 401k) by the time i was 30. So 5 years later, those same buds had 5 year old cars worth half as much as they paid ... putting themselve in a big hole. To this day, whenever we have new engineers just out of college, I'll offer them the same message. You have to have money to make money.

Love both fantasy baseball and investing.

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Fantasy baseball is fun. I can watch Tulowitzki blow up and hit 2 HRs in a game.

Stock Market..not so much.

Plus I don't trust the suits and ties in Wall St.

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I do both as well. One thing that has really served me well that my dad (blue collar) drilled into my head over and over as I was growing up: The money that you make the first 5 years out of college is THE most imporant money you'll make in your lifetime because that's the money that gets the extra doubling. 400k turns to 800k with the extra doubling. 800k to 1.6 mil etc. So while my buddies bought nice new cars, etc ... I lived like I was still in college for another 4 years only bought a bed and a pc during that time and drove around a beater of a truck. The goal was to have 100k in the bank (not including retirement and 401k) by the time i was 30. So 5 years later, those same buds had 5 year old cars worth half as much as they paid ... putting themselve in a big hole. To this day, whenever we have new engineers just out of college, I'll offer them the same message. You have to have money to make money.

Love both fantasy baseball and investing.

Can you tell me how to get the initial 400k.

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Gotta start somewhere ... that's the point. I saved 70% of my first years salary, was out of debt and building wealth. I wasn't even making that much at the time. Single and on the road installing fiber optics.

Investing is a war of attrition, just like rotissere leagues. Take rule of 72 where money doubles depending on pct rates. Market looks like it'll trade sideways for the next few years, but say you can get roughly 6%. Money doubles every 12 years (72 / 6). 100k -> 200k -> 400k -> 800k. But if you wait too long, you'll be gimped for retirement. You'll miss that last doubling from 400 to 800 (or worse). There's no get rich scheme. Just got to grind it out and sacrifice a bit. Make good sound investments.

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i actually know a lot about finance, im very well versed in it ... and yet i choose to focus all my analytical recreation on fantasy. i think i do this b/c it's more important to me that i prove to my friends that i know more than they do about baseball than it is that i try to make a lot of money... but then again, that's not true, since if someone offered me a lotta money if only i stopped playing fantasy, i'd stop... so yea, i don't get myself at all.

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Can you tell me how to get the initial 400k.

Well I don't think thats still not the initial step. If you get yourself 50k or maybe even 100k by the time you're 30 or so from saving, then thats more then enough to start investing.

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risk

If someone is consistently earning 6% on investments... please share your secrets. Back in the 90s and early 2000s you could invest in any company and make money. Not so much now.

A good book is, "how to invest $5 to $5,000". Also, "the millionaire next door". Some good tips and concepts here. Best tip I could give someone is to create a budget (WRITE DOWN EVERY EXPENSE FOR 1 MONTH AND CATEGORIZE IT). If you're like me, I was shocked when I saw how much I spent on eating out and drinking. Be wary of stuff that you buy one of every day... gum, coffee, pop. $1 per day is hundreds of dollars. Other tip, SPEND LESS THAN YOU MAKE. Force yourself to save by 'paying yourself first'. IE if your paycheck is $1,000 put $100 into a savings account THAT YOU DO NOT TOUCH. If you get a bonus or money for your birthday... put 50% of it in that savings account. Get yourself a cash back credit card. Household bank offers a 2% back card on all purchases with no catch that you can get with poor credit.

ING direct and a few other banks offer better returns than your checking account bank. Look at ing orange savings accounts. Online and secure earning a modest interest rate. Won't make you rich but the habit of saving money and being frugal doesn't start when you have 400k.

Blogs that I recommend:

http://freefrombroke.com/

http://wethesavers.com/

yahoo personal finance

Think about how you can save money... can you change cable plans, internet services, do you really need 300 channels? We survive on one income but we're frugal (use coupons, buy what we need, rent movies from the library, only go to matinee shows). I don't make a ton but we know what we make and where we want to spend money.

Talk to your grandparents or people at church who are older. They lived during the depression. They know how to save money.

Remember, it's not what you're driving or how fancy your clothes are... it's how much $ you have in the bank.

99.9% of the stuff you purchase depreciates in value (electronics, cars, cds, dvds, blu ray, etc).

Send me a PM if you have any questions.

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Wall Street would love it if people here got into the stock market...If I had a dollar for every can't miss prospect failure that was over-hyped on this forum I would have that 400K by now.

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If someone is consistently earning 6% on investments... please share your secrets.

Well you could invest in high-yield stocks that are pretty stable (ATT, Conoco Phillips, Verizon all pay dividends in the 5% area). Even with minimal long term improvement you'll be around 6% on those. Add in a few stocks with growth potential and you can do pretty well. Obviously you'll have hits and misses but like one person I think said, if you bought Apple LAST WEEK, you've already made 6% by today.

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risk

If someone is consistently earning 6% on investments... please share your secrets. Back in the 90s and early 2000s you could invest in any company and make money. Not so much now.

A good book is, "how to invest $5 to $5,000". Also, "the millionaire next door". Some good tips and concepts here. Best tip I could give someone is to create a budget (WRITE DOWN EVERY EXPENSE FOR 1 MONTH AND CATEGORIZE IT). If you're like me, I was shocked when I saw how much I spent on eating out and drinking. Be wary of stuff that you buy one of every day... gum, coffee, pop. $1 per day is hundreds of dollars. Other tip, SPEND LESS THAN YOU MAKE. Force yourself to save by 'paying yourself first'. IE if your paycheck is $1,000 put $100 into a savings account THAT YOU DO NOT TOUCH. If you get a bonus or money for your birthday... put 50% of it in that savings account. Get yourself a cash back credit card. Household bank offers a 2% back card on all purchases with no catch that you can get with poor credit.

ING direct and a few other banks offer better returns than your checking account bank. Look at ing orange savings accounts. Online and secure earning a modest interest rate. Won't make you rich but the habit of saving money and being frugal doesn't start when you have 400k.

Blogs that I recommend:

http://freefrombroke.com/

http://wethesavers.com/

yahoo personal finance

Think about how you can save money... can you change cable plans, internet services, do you really need 300 channels? We survive on one income but we're frugal (use coupons, buy what we need, rent movies from the library, only go to matinee shows). I don't make a ton but we know what we make and where we want to spend money.

Talk to your grandparents or people at church who are older. They lived during the depression. They know how to save money.

Remember, it's not what you're driving or how fancy your clothes are... it's how much $ you have in the bank.

99.9% of the stuff you purchase depreciates in value (electronics, cars, cds, dvds, blu ray, etc).

Send me a PM if you have any questions.

Thanks for the book recommendations. Any others? Anyone have any thoughts on the book "How to Pick Stocks Like Warren Buffet"?

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Well you could invest in high-yield stocks that are pretty stable (ATT, Conoco Phillips, Verizon all pay dividends in the 5% area). Even with minimal long term improvement you'll be around 6% on those. Add in a few stocks with growth potential and you can do pretty well. Obviously you'll have hits and misses but like one person I think said, if you bought Apple LAST WEEK, you've already made 6% by today.

Okay, so explain to me how this works...

http://www22.verizon.com/investor/dividenthistory.htm

I see the ~5% based on returns if the stock price is steady at ~$40.00.

What is the tax ramifications?

I honestly don't know. I know how to save but I do not know the in-and-out of dividends.

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