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William Powell 2012 Season Outlook

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except that the context what foster was regarding preseason performance to regular season performance. and the 2 situations have nothing in common. if you want to make an argument that powell is a lottery ticket because he may be getting carries behind a injury prone rb i'm fine with that. i view him as a lotto ticket just like every other RB playing behind a injury prone or under performing rb. but trying to make an inaccurate comparison is a disservice to everyone here.

as far as Powell having the most upside of

Kendall Hunter

Jacquizz Rodgers

Joique Bell

Toby Gerhart

Mike Goodson

Bilal Powell

Daryl Richardson

Jackie Battle

i'd have to disagree

Hunter is the one who by far has the most upside of those on that list

Rodgers certainly is right there with Hunter

Gerhart showed last year he is more than capable

the rest of these guys are probably on the same level as Powell

but again he is a lotto ticket, just stop steering the hype train out of control

Actually the two situations have a lot in common. I listed the common factors. One common factor implies you can't say they have nothing in common. Sure you're right about Arain Foster was a lot closer to RB1 duties than William Powell was. But you can't say they have nothing in common, especially not after we have already gone over this.

1. They both went undrafted.

2. Neither was the starting RB1.

3. They both lead the preseason in rushing.

4. They both had extremely high yards per rush in preseason.

Again you are getting upside confused with floor or realistic expectation. Kendall Hunter had 16 TDs on 271 carries at football power house Oklahoma State. If he has so much more upside than William Powell, how come William Powell ran for 4 TDs in only 23 touches??

Sure small sample size, but the TD per touch average is so insanely high that it can't be ignored. Upside is a lot more about averages than it is total gross numbers. The guy with the higher yards per run and TDs per carry you figure will out produce the guy with the higher gross numbers if given equal opportunities. That is how "upside" works.

You totally lost me with this post and especially the end of it. Your previous arguments were at least coherent and logical, but arguing about his COLLEGE touchdowns per touch giving him more upside than Kendall Hunter because of his touchdowns per touch in college... Eek. The dude had 23 touches in college and your comparing his numbers to a guy in the big 12 who played several seasons. Not to say a guy who didn't do much in college can't be effective in the NFL, but your somehow spinning this as a positive that he only had 23 touches as opposed to a guy who proved himself over multiple seasons in college and is more of a known quantity because of it.

Hunter by all accounts is a talented runner playing on perhaps the most RB friendly team in fantasy (O line, strong defense leads to team controlling games.) He also can catch the ball. If Gore went down I doubt Hunter would become a 20+ carry guy, but he would still immediately become the RB getting the most touches on that team.

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I gotta agree with Panthor here.

I rostered him, as a long shot. But the pedigree between himself and Foster is way different. Not to mention, one offensive line (Houston) is night and the other (Arizona) is day.

I hope he pans out, like as early as THIS week, but literally every star in the galaxy would have to align for that to happen. It's a great story that he's even in the NFL.

Also, on top of all those other explanations for Foster going undrafted, he also had fumbling issues in college, if I remember correctly.

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and for the record i do own powell in 1 league with a big bench, so i do have skin the game. i'm just not ready to hype him up like others

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LOL! This will get the hype train moving even faster:

ESPNs Adam Schefter owns Ryan Williams in their 16 team league, and he scooped up William Powell! If anyone is clued in its Adam Schefter!

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=8435225

they talk about the Cardinals around the 40 minute mark

yeah but his picking up powell has more to do with cuffing him to williams

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At first I thought this was just another hype thread but then I looked at Ryan Williams stats. Has lost two fumbles already. That is the only way I see him losing his job.

He had a very good game last week and despite the fumbles, WIsehunt is giving him every chance to get back on track after the year lost because of the padella injury

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when did 4 things become a lot. i'll give you the first 2 you listed and quite frankly they are insignificant similarities. lots of rbs aren't the rb1 going into camp. as a matter of fact there are only 32 who can call themselves rb1. so it isn't a big accomplishment if you aren't in that group. he has a lot of company. and the same with going undrafted, plenty of guys go undrafted. to use either one of those to try to tie him to foster just shows how weak the rest of the argument gets

and as for foster being undrafted. it was due to a number of outside factors. he got hurt his senior year. the opinion of him was that he was a headcase and uncoachable, and then he had a bad combine and pro day

is that what happened with powell too?

Powell also got injured in his final year in college

http://blogs.kansas.com/kstated/2010/12/16/a-few-minutes-with-william-powell/

So chalk up another similarity.

Your whole argument that they aren't similar is as weak as it gets. To sum up your argument "A lot of players have a lot of similarities with a lot of other players therefore they cannot be considered similar." That is what you are saying. Doesn't sound all that intelligent when you break it down, does it?

When was the last time an undrafted RB lead the preseason in rushing? I'm not exactly positive but my memory leads me to Arian Foster. You can do the research to prove me wrong, by all means I welcome it because I honestly don't feel like looking into it right now.

as far as leading the preseason in rushing, i think you'd have to put it into context for it to mean anything. i don't remember who foster was running against that preseason but i'd imagine it wasn't the 5th string waterboy brought into fill out camp, since even very early in camp it was mentioned he could be competing for rb1, he would have seen much better competition.

i don't have floor and upside confused. Hunter is running for the best team in the NFC West, by most accounts a superbowl contender. and in an offense that is geared for running. and it isn't like Hunter is a slow plodding rb either, powell is going to run for a team that has a great defense and from what i have read a pretty weak running game and oline.

i get that powell is a lotto ticket and there are plenty of rb lotto tickets out there. i'm all for grabbing as many as you can fit on a roster. but the campaign to overhype with inaccurate comparisons and hyperbole only serves to mislead

Okay so far the standings say The Cardinals are the best team in the NFC West. Strength of schedule also confirms this. As well as point differential. Sure long season anything can happen but right now you can't ignore what The Cardinals have done so far. Being a Superbowl contender has nothing to do with fantasy hell being a good team has little to do with the success of a running back ask MJD or AP. Hell McCoy had a great year last year despite The Eagles being 8-8.

So needless to say whatever point you were trying to prove with those statements is clearly going to work for The Cardinals right now as well.

You are clearly getting mad for no reason and just arguing for the sake of arguing. It's clear by the lack of relevant points you bring compared to how much irrelevancy you have brought to your side of the argument that you are more caught up in being "right" than with what is right. What is right is that William Powell has a chance to be an insanely good player at an insanely low cost.

His situation is similar to Arain Foster who exponentially increased his value. Powell has a chance to do something similar. Don't get confused and think I'm saying Powell will become the clear cut #1 fantasy RB, but Powell could easily become the pick up of the year. Which let's face it this year there hasn't been many good pick ups so far.

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except that the context what foster was regarding preseason performance to regular season performance. and the 2 situations have nothing in common. if you want to make an argument that powell is a lottery ticket because he may be getting carries behind a injury prone rb i'm fine with that. i view him as a lotto ticket just like every other RB playing behind a injury prone or under performing rb. but trying to make an inaccurate comparison is a disservice to everyone here.

as far as Powell having the most upside of

Kendall Hunter

Jacquizz Rodgers

Joique Bell

Toby Gerhart

Mike Goodson

Bilal Powell

Daryl Richardson

Jackie Battle

i'd have to disagree

Hunter is the one who by far has the most upside of those on that list

Rodgers certainly is right there with Hunter

Gerhart showed last year he is more than capable

the rest of these guys are probably on the same level as Powell

but again he is a lotto ticket, just stop steering the hype train out of control

Actually the two situations have a lot in common. I listed the common factors. One common factor implies you can't say they have nothing in common. Sure you're right about Arain Foster was a lot closer to RB1 duties than William Powell was. But you can't say they have nothing in common, especially not after we have already gone over this.

1. They both went undrafted.

2. Neither was the starting RB1.

3. They both lead the preseason in rushing.

4. They both had extremely high yards per rush in preseason.

Again you are getting upside confused with floor or realistic expectation. Kendall Hunter had 16 TDs on 271 carries at football power house Oklahoma State. If he has so much more upside than William Powell, how come William Powell ran for 4 TDs in only 23 touches??

Sure small sample size, but the TD per touch average is so insanely high that it can't be ignored. Upside is a lot more about averages than it is total gross numbers. The guy with the higher yards per run and TDs per carry you figure will out produce the guy with the higher gross numbers if given equal opportunities. That is how "upside" works.

Ever since Arian Foster exploded onto the scene as an undrafted running back super stud, everyone is super quick to jump on the super bandwagon of the next super sleeper who is undrafted and suddenly 2 injuries away from super fantasy relevance.

The main thing that Foster and Powell have in common is that they were undrafted. Apart from that, they actually have very little in common, including their academic interests.

Foster was not undrafted because of athletic ability or football talent, but because of injury and a bizarre analysis of his mental makeup. (To oversimplify, Foster is a bit too much of a philosopher for your typical football talent scout.) Powell is more akin to someone like Jackie Battle or Joique Bell than Arian Foster, if we're going to make completely overbroad generalizations.

Powell may end up being a decent flex play if Ryan Williams gets knocked out. But likening him to Arian Foster in the least is purposely designed to exacerbate hype: because there is an implicit suggestion that Powell could conceivably be the #1 RB in all of fantasy given the right opportunity, which I think is complete OVER-hyping. By that analysis, ANY backup RB could be the next Arian Foster because if you're a backup RB who was drafted, presumably you're AT LEAST as good as a backup RB who was undrafted.

Arian Foster is the epitome of hopium. Because he exists, every undrafted player is now seen as the next potential #1 player in all of fantasy if given the right opportunity. (Oh yes, and if he has a good preseason. But keep in mind that Foster actually had a good regular season game BEFORE people started hyping him.)

Edited by bsong71
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you are overhyping by trying to tie him to foster, when there is nothing to tie to. which then gives has everyone thinking number 1 rb in fantasy football.

and then putting him as more upside than guys like Hunter who are thought as some of the top handcuff/sleeper rbs coming into the year

as far as that list goes. outside of Hunter, Rodgers and Gerhart the others could have been had off the wire prior to week 3. so it wouldn't be that hard for one of those guys to be the worst player on a roster. hell even if you drafted Hunter or Gerhart it wouldn't be hard for one of the them to be the worst player. and it would have nothing to do with luck

Honestly how do you compare players that is so great? Who would you compare him to?

I mean every player has something in common with many other players, therefore by your logic they would be weak comparisons. Cause undrafted players just lead the preseason in rushing all the time. You act like leading the NFL in rushing in the preseason is a negative thing. I understand "take it with a grain of salt" but you can't hold that against someone.

I mean what more do you want?

Here are so more similarities. Arain Foster had to make the team his rookie year. He was released but signed to the practice squad. Despite being unknown he continued to work hard. He wasn't on the active roster to start the season. He all of a sudden went off in the final two weeks of the season his rookie year and then become the best fantasy RB.

Okay the similarities stop after "He wasn't on the active roster".

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you are overhyping by trying to tie him to foster, when there is nothing to tie to. which then gives has everyone thinking number 1 rb in fantasy football.

and then putting him as more upside than guys like Hunter who are thought as some of the top handcuff/sleeper rbs coming into the year

as far as that list goes. outside of Hunter, Rodgers and Gerhart the others could have been had off the wire prior to week 3. so it wouldn't be that hard for one of those guys to be the worst player on a roster. hell even if you drafted Hunter or Gerhart it wouldn't be hard for one of the them to be the worst player. and it would have nothing to do with luck

Honestly how do you compare players that is so great? Who would you compare him to?

I mean every player has something in common with many other players, therefore by your logic they would be weak comparisons. Cause undrafted players just lead the preseason in rushing all the time. You act like leading the NFL in rushing in the preseason is a negative thing. I understand "take it with a grain of salt" but you can't hold that against someone.

I mean what more do you want?

Here are so more similarities. Arain Foster had to make the team his rookie year. He was released but signed to the practice squad. Despite being unknown he continued to work hard. He wasn't on the active roster to start the season. He all of a sudden went off in the final two weeks of the season his rookie year and then become the best fantasy RB.

Okay the similarities stop after "He wasn't on the active roster".

With all due respect, his name is AR-IA-N Foster, not AR-AI-N Foster. I thought it was a typo before, but that's the 2nd post where you've identified him as Arain Foster.

I think the point that some of us are trying to make is that by comparing Powell to Foster, there is an inherent over-hyping that occurs whether you intended it or not, precisely because there are MANY MANY other undrafted running backs who have fantasy relevance that make for a better comparison. The only reason people point to Arian Foster rather than Jackie Battle is to create excitement about this oh-so-seductive possibility that you could pick up a guy from waivers and have him turn out to be the #1 RB in all of fantasy.

But again, bear in mind that Foster's breakout season came in a year when he was drafted, certainly late in many rounds. But he didn't have this huge season during the first year he got playing time, which was late in the season BEFORE his breakout year.

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You are clearly getting mad for no reason and just arguing for the sake of arguing. It's clear by the lack of relevant points you bring compared to how much irrelevancy you have brought to your side of the argument that you are more caught up in being "right" than with what is right. What is right is that William Powell has a chance to be an insanely good player at an insanely low cost.

:blink: Ironic post is ironic....

I give this thread 10 more posts before it gets locked.

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Foster was not undrafted because of athletic ability or football talent, but because of injury and a bizarre analysis of his mental makeup. (To oversimplify, Foster is a bit too much of a philosopher for your typical football talent scout.) Powell is more akin to someone like Jackie Battle or Joique Bell than Arian Foster, if we're going to make completely overbroad generalizations.

Powell may end up being a decent flex play if Ryan Williams gets knocked out. But likening him to Arian Foster in the least is purposely designed to exacerbate hype: because there is an implicit suggestion that Powell could conceivably be the #1 RB in all of fantasy given the right opportunity, which I think is complete OVER-hyping. By that analysis, ANY backup RB could be the next Arian Foster because if you're a backup RB who was drafted, presumably you're AT LEAST as good as a backup RB who was undrafted.

Arian Foster is the epitome of hopium. Because he exists, every undrafted player is now seen as the next potential #1 player in all of fantasy if given the right opportunity. (Oh yes, and if he has a good preseason. But keep in mind that Foster actually had a good regular season game BEFORE people started hyping him.)

I love how you guys talk about this like you know this for a fact. As if you heard it out of Mel Kiper's mouth during the 2009 draft.

Arian Foster did not have great college numbers. He was an average RB his entire college career that got injured his senior season. He was averaging 4.4 yards a carry his senior season with only 1 TD in 131 carries. No that doesn't scream draft me. Hell that doesn't even say draft me.

No team's logic on Foster was, "Okay boys we are going to have to pass on Arian Foster this draft simply because he got injured as a senior and some guys on rotoworld message forums a few years from now will claim that he is what they call 'uncoachable'."

That was never uttered in a draft room. Sorry to say it guys, Foster just continued to improve. He wasn't some college stud that teams were really looking at.

Hell William Powell's senior year: 253 yards 4 TDs on 23 carries.

Arian Foster's senior year: 570 yards 1 TD on 131 carries.

Plus Powell returned a kick for a TD. I'd say that Powell was pretty effective his senior year.

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With all due respect, his name is AR-IA-N Foster, not AR-AI-N Foster. I thought it was a typo before, but that's the 2nd post where you've identified him as Arain Foster.

Just more evidence that you are clearly grasping at anything. Haha, great points. You really brought the facts to the table. I know how to spell but sure I guess anything to prove your point for you?

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Foster was not undrafted because of athletic ability or football talent, but because of injury and a bizarre analysis of his mental makeup. (To oversimplify, Foster is a bit too much of a philosopher for your typical football talent scout.) Powell is more akin to someone like Jackie Battle or Joique Bell than Arian Foster, if we're going to make completely overbroad generalizations.

Powell may end up being a decent flex play if Ryan Williams gets knocked out. But likening him to Arian Foster in the least is purposely designed to exacerbate hype: because there is an implicit suggestion that Powell could conceivably be the #1 RB in all of fantasy given the right opportunity, which I think is complete OVER-hyping. By that analysis, ANY backup RB could be the next Arian Foster because if you're a backup RB who was drafted, presumably you're AT LEAST as good as a backup RB who was undrafted.

Arian Foster is the epitome of hopium. Because he exists, every undrafted player is now seen as the next potential #1 player in all of fantasy if given the right opportunity. (Oh yes, and if he has a good preseason. But keep in mind that Foster actually had a good regular season game BEFORE people started hyping him.)

I love how you guys talk about this like you know this for a fact. As if you heard it out of Mel Kiper's mouth during the 2009 draft.

Arian Foster did not have great college numbers. He was an average RB his entire college career that got injured his senior season. He was averaging 4.4 yards a carry his senior season with only 1 TD in 131 carries. No that doesn't scream draft me. Hell that doesn't even say draft me.

No team's logic on Foster was, "Okay boys we are going to have to pass on Arian Foster this draft simply because he got injured as a senior and some guys on rotoworld message forums a few years from now will claim that he is what they call 'uncoachable'."

That was never uttered in a draft room. Sorry to say it guys, Foster just continued to improve. He wasn't some college stud that teams were really looking at.

Hell William Powell's senior year: 253 yards 4 TDs on 23 carries.

Arian Foster's senior year: 570 yards 1 TD on 131 carries.

Plus Powell returned a kick for a TD. I'd say that Powell was pretty effective his senior year.

Foster was pretty damn good his junior year. Had he left school than, he definitely would have been drafted. Probably by Round 3.

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you are overhyping by trying to tie him to foster, when there is nothing to tie to. which then gives has everyone thinking number 1 rb in fantasy football.

and then putting him as more upside than guys like Hunter who are thought as some of the top handcuff/sleeper rbs coming into the year

as far as that list goes. outside of Hunter, Rodgers and Gerhart the others could have been had off the wire prior to week 3. so it wouldn't be that hard for one of those guys to be the worst player on a roster. hell even if you drafted Hunter or Gerhart it wouldn't be hard for one of the them to be the worst player. and it would have nothing to do with luck

Honestly how do you compare players that is so great? Who would you compare him to?

I mean every player has something in common with many other players, therefore by your logic they would be weak comparisons. Cause undrafted players just lead the preseason in rushing all the time. You act like leading the NFL in rushing in the preseason is a negative thing. I understand "take it with a grain of salt" but you can't hold that against someone.

I mean what more do you want?

Here are so more similarities. Arain Foster had to make the team his rookie year. He was released but signed to the practice squad. Despite being unknown he continued to work hard. He wasn't on the active roster to start the season. He all of a sudden went off in the final two weeks of the season his rookie year and then become the best fantasy RB.

Okay the similarities stop after "He wasn't on the active roster".

With all due respect, his name is AR-IA-N Foster, not AR-AI-N Foster. I thought it was a typo before, but that's the 2nd post where you've identified him as Arain Foster.

I think the point that some of us are trying to make is that by comparing Powell to Foster, there is an inherent over-hyping that occurs whether you intended it or not, precisely because there are MANY MANY other undrafted running backs who have fantasy relevance that make for a better comparison. The only reason people point to Arian Foster rather than Jackie Battle is to create excitement about this oh-so-seductive possibility that you could pick up a guy from waivers and have him turn out to be the #1 RB in all of fantasy.

But again, bear in mind that Foster's breakout season came in a year when he was drafted, certainly late in many rounds. But he didn't have this huge season during the first year he got playing time, which was late in the season BEFORE his breakout year.

Yes I will give you that William Powell's rookie season is looking very similar to Foster's 2nd year. But technically this could be Powell's 2nd year as he was done with college in 2010. I don't know what he did if he was just a practice squad player last year or what. But either way the compassion still stands.

But feel free to continue to shoot me down for having my own opinion. It's funny seeing people get worked up over nothing.

YOU CAN'T COMPARE THIS GUY TO ARIAN FOSTER!! THAT IS JUST NOT RIGHT!! I DON'T CARE HOW LONG YOUR LIST OF SIMILARITIES IS, IT JUST CAN'T BE!! THERE WILL NEVER BE ANOTHER RB TO BREAKOUT LIKE THAT!! IT IS JUST IMPOSSIBLE!!

that is the one side. Then there's me saying.

Hey guys, there's a chance this kid could be a really damn good pick up right now. Remember when Arian Foster (another undrafted RB) lead the preseason in rushing? It could be similar to something like that if the guy gets a chance to carry the ball. Well hell it looks like he's going to touch the rock a little bit now doesn't it?

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There have been a number of RB's who came "out of nowhere" to some level of success. All they needed was the opportunity. Among current players, Arian Foster, Michael Turner, Peyton Hillis, Fred Jackson, Ahmad Bradshaw, Pierre Thomas, Ryan Grant, and Benjarvus Green-Ellis were all undrafted or unheralded guys that opened eyes when given a chance.

All it takes is one more Williams fumble for Powell to get that chance. Same for those other guys mentioned by Panthor. All should be rostered if possible (especially Goodson, who might belong at the top of that list).

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Foster was pretty damn good his junior year. Had he left school than, he definitely would have been drafted. Probably by Round 3.

Here's the last RB taken in the 2nd round this year.

LaMichael James http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/lamichael-james-1.html

All the 3rd round RBs.

Ronnie Hillman http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/ronnie-hillman-1.html

Brenard Pierce http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/bernard-pierce-1.html

RBs drafted in the 7th round (final round).

Michael Smith http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/michael-smith-6.html

Bryce Brown http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/bryce-brown-1.html

Edwin Baker http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/edwin-baker-1.html (the definition of should have come out a year earlier)

Daryl Richardson you find his stats and let me know.

Needless to say. He wouldn't have gone in the 3rd round. Maybe a 7th round draft pick. Foster has been a better NFL rusher than a college rusher. He did it by sticking it out and continuing to work hard. Not because he was this blow them away type talent out of college.

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Foster had like 600 college carries though, so there was a larger sample size to judge off. I am trying to think of a RB that got no run in college that became fantasy relevant in the NFL. Can anyone think of one? Closet one I think of is Priest Holmes who received only 252 rush attempts in college.

I'm trying to find one but can't either...

Powell could be a special breed, the first of his kind!!

I just can't believe the guy has 4 TDs in 23 carries and can't warrant more carries? I'm going to look deeper into this, I'm thinking he probably didn't even play the first half of the season?

From his sophomore-senior year at arkansas, Peyton Hillis only had 140 carries, behind felix jones and darren mcfadden. So for those 3 years, Hillis had only 10% of the carries in that backfield. Looks like William Powell had a similar situation with Daniel Thomas

and Thomas sucks, while DMC is arguably one of the best RBs in football and Jones was explosive, too bad Jones couldn't take a hit. so to use your comparison to Hillis coming out of college doesn't really work. and its not like Hillis is some world beater in the nfl either.

:wacko: he won me a championship 2 years ago and I'm sure he did the same for many others.. that's what this thread is all about isn't it???

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I've watched significant tape on this kid. He's definitely got what it takes to be the next Arian Foster if he gets a crack. By significant tape I mean the last clip that was posted a page or two ago.

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Love all the comparisons and speculation over a player who has not had a single touch on the NFL level... Regardless of what he can and may do this thread is ridiculous at this point.

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