Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

chicagowhitesox1173

Mark Buehrle 2013 Outlook

19 posts in this topic

I didn't see a outlook for him so I made one up.

Nice game so far for Buehrle. He could be a nice replacement for Cobb for the next month.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know how much I'd trust him for more than one or two favorable starts. He has a very good track record against the Twins, but he's not going to do your ratios any favors if you catch him on the wrong day. He's on a solid offensive team, so he might get you W's, but the rest might not be pretty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ridiculous. He is a bum and all of a sudden he this good?

When Buerhle is on, he's a damn fine pitcher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ridiculous. He is a bum and all of a sudden he this good?

He's never been a bum.

Ok bum was too harsh..how about mediocre.

Career era of 3.83 and whip of 1.28 with a little more than a strike out every two innings.. That is mediocre.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know it sounds far fetched but Buehrle could make The Hall of Fame if he has 3 or 4 more Buehrle type years. He should reach 200 innings this year (179 now) and that will be 13 straight 200 inning seasons in a row for him. He's actually got a nice career war too. 54.9. If he has three more 3.3 war type seasons, he'll be around 65.0 career war which puts him in some pretty elite company. Usually every generation puts around 8 to 12 players in the Hall of Fame and for his current generation I don't see 8 guys who will have better careers. I really think he could end up being a strong candidate.

These are Hall of Famers from each generation. Some overlap a bit but I feel all in right spot.

1880's to 1890's HOF pitchers

Cy Young

Kid Nichols

Tim Keefe

John Clarkson

Amos Rusie

Pud Galvin

Charles Radbourne

Mickey Welch

Clark Griffith

1900's to 1910's HOF pitchers

Walter Johnson

Pete Alexander

Christy Mathewson

Three Finger Brown

Ed Walsh

Rube Waddell

Addie Joss

Rube Marquard

Chief Bender

Eddie Plank

Joe McGinnity

1920's to 1930's HOF pitchers

Lefty Grove

Carl Hubbell

Dazzy Vance

Dizzy Dean

Eppa Rixey

Red Faber

Ted Lyons

Stan Coveleski

Red Ruffing

Waite Hoyt

Jesse Haines

Herb Pennock

Burleigh Grimes

Lefty Gomez

1940's to 1950's HOF pitchers

Warren Spahn

Robin Roberts

Bob Feller

Hal Newhouser

Bob Lemon

Whitey Ford

Early Wynn

Satchel Paige

Billy Pierce....maybe

1960's to 1970's HOF pitchers

Tom Seaver

Steve Carlton

Nolan Ryan

Sandy Koufax

Bob Gibson

Gaylord Perry

Phil Neikro

Bert Blyleven

Ferguson Jenkins

Don Sutten

Jim Palmer

Juan Marichal

Don Drysdale

1980's to 1990's HOF pitchers

Greg Maddux

Roger Clemens

Randy Johnson

Pedro Martinez

Tom Glavine

Curt Schilling

John Smoltz

Mike Mussina

Jack Morris....maybe

David Cone...maybe

Kevin Brown....maybe

This generation 2000's to 2010's

Roy Halladay

CC Sabathia

Justin Verlander

Clayton Kershaw

Felix Hernandez

Tim Hudson

Cliff Lee

Roy Oswalt

Chris Carpenter

Matt Cain

Zack Grienke

Bartolo Colon

Jake Peavy

Barry Zito

Adam Waignwright

.............I would say Mark Buehrle has a decent shot for top 8 out of these guys.

-2005 WS Champion

-Perfect game and No-hitter

-4 gold gloves

-4 all-stars

-54.9 war which after tonight's game will put him behind only Roy Halladay for this generation.

-He's closing in on 200 wins, he might be last 200 game winner for quite awhile. He also might end up with more career wins than any of these guys.

-13 staight 200 inning seasons. No pitcher in this generation is even close. assuming he gets 200 this year.

-Has record for consecutive outs.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as I love Buerhle, no f'ing way will he be a HOFer

Agreed.

Buehrle is the definition of consistency and a workhorse. But he should never sniff Cooperstown.

And he's my favorite pitcher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll admit he's a longshot but he's already at 55 career war for his career and there is not one pitcher with 70 plus war who isn't in the Hall of Fame. If he reaches 70 war which is a strong possibility, then why should he be kept out? Saber stats could help him by the time he retires too. Voters are already using saber stats in alot of elections. War is now on Topps baseball cards so it's becoming a stat kids will relate to like how kids in the past related to counting stats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll admit he's a longshot but he's already at 55 career war for his career and there is not one pitcher with 70 plus war who isn't in the Hall of Fame. If he reaches 70 war which is a strong possibility, then why should he be kept out? Saber stats could help him by the time he retires too. Voters are already using saber stats in alot of elections. War is now on Topps baseball cards so it's becoming a stat kids will relate to like how kids in the past related to counting stats.

1) pitcher WAR seems kinda sketchy

2) being both solid and durable has led to that WAR tally. What's his average WAR per season?

I hope he comes back to the Sox.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll admit he's a longshot but he's already at 55 career war for his career and there is not one pitcher with 70 plus war who isn't in the Hall of Fame. If he reaches 70 war which is a strong possibility, then why should he be kept out? Saber stats could help him by the time he retires too. Voters are already using saber stats in alot of elections. War is now on Topps baseball cards so it's becoming a stat kids will relate to like how kids in the past related to counting stats.

1) pitcher WAR seems kinda sketchy

2) being both solid and durable has led to that WAR tally. What's his average WAR per season?

I hope he comes back to the Sox.

I don't think I'll ever forgive Kenny Williams for choosing Danks and Floyd over Buehrle. So much for loyalty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll admit he's a longshot but he's already at 55 career war for his career and there is not one pitcher with 70 plus war who isn't in the Hall of Fame. If he reaches 70 war which is a strong possibility, then why should he be kept out? Saber stats could help him by the time he retires too. Voters are already using saber stats in alot of elections. War is now on Topps baseball cards so it's becoming a stat kids will relate to like how kids in the past related to counting stats.

1) pitcher WAR seems kinda sketchy

2) being both solid and durable has led to that WAR tally. What's his average WAR per season?

I hope he comes back to the Sox.

I would say he averages around 4.0 war per season so if he can average 3.0 war for 3 or 4 more years it will be hard to ignore him. I never thought of him as a Hall of Famer but I recently looked up his stats and i'm kinda amazed how he compares to other pitchers from his era. I forgot to add Johan Santana to my list of 2000's to 2010's pitchers and i'll admit Santana was the better pitcher but when it's all said and done I think Buehrle will have a better career than him. You gotta remember Buehrle pitched in some pretty tough conditions too. US Cellular Field is a horrible pitchers park, He pitched in the steroid era and against some scary American League lineups. I'll admit he's never been a top 5 pitcher but these top 5 pitchers through the years have all usually fizzled out. Buehrle just keeps going. At this point, it wouldn't surprise me if he ends up with more career wins than both Roy Halladay and CC Sabathia. If that does happen, I find it hard to believe voters won't take notice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you asked hall of fame voters what WAR was they would say it involves guns and something most of them did in the midst of there careers at one point or another. Zero hall of fame voters look at WAR. So its really not even valid for discussion. Buehrle is similiar to Jaime Moyer, professional pitcher, workhorse, but not a hall of famer at the end of the day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you asked hall of fame voters what WAR was they would say it involves guns and something most of them did in the midst of there careers at one point or another. Zero hall of fame voters look at WAR. So its really not even valid for discussion. Buehrle is similiar to Jaime Moyer, professional pitcher, workhorse, but not a hall of famer at the end of the day.

I agree, if you asked most Hall of Fame voters now about war, they wouldn't be able to give you a good answer but in 15 years or so, war will be alot more mainstream.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you asked hall of fame voters what WAR was they would say it involves guns and something most of them did in the midst of there careers at one point or another. Zero hall of fame voters look at WAR. So its really not even valid for discussion. Buehrle is similiar to Jaime Moyer, professional pitcher, workhorse, but not a hall of famer at the end of the day.

Buerhle is a bit better than Moyer, but I understand your point

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see his point too but Buehrle has been ALOT better than Moyer.

Mark Buehrle's first 14 seasons..55.2 war

Jaime Moyer's first 14 seasons 27.9 war, Moyer ended up with 50.2 war in 25 seasons. This is a huge difference.

Buehrles career era plus is 118

Moyers caeer era plus was around 103...another huge difference.

Voters are starting to use saber stats too. Bert Blyleven got elected and it was only because of the saber stat community that opened alot of voters eyes that got him in. Felix Hernandez won only 12 or 13 games a few years ago and he was named Cy Young, "10 years ago that never would have happened". It will only get more saber influenced as years go by too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see his point too but Buehrle has been ALOT better than Moyer.

Mark Buehrle's first 14 seasons..55.2 war

Jaime Moyer's first 14 seasons 27.9 war, Moyer ended up with 50.2 war in 25 seasons. This is a huge difference.

Buehrles career era plus is 118

Moyers caeer era plus was around 103...another huge difference.

Voters are starting to use saber stats too. Bert Blyleven got elected and it was only because of the saber stat community that opened alot of voters eyes that got him in. Felix Hernandez won only 12 or 13 games a few years ago and he was named Cy Young, "10 years ago that never would have happened". It will only get more saber influenced as years go by too.

Buehrle gives up way too many hits for him to get HoF consideration. He's led the AL in hits allowed 4 times. Batters have a career .272 average against him. He's not exactly an uncomfortable AB for most hitters.

But he is extremely durable and a workhorse. He goes out every 5 days and usually gives his team a chance to win. Every year you can count on him for 200+ innings, 10+ wins, and a respectable ERA.

He's thrown 2 no-hitters (one of them being a perfect game) and won a World Series. His resume is impressive. But he's not HoF material.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.