Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

DK64MASTER

Why don't MLB NL league managers roster a hitter in the pitchers spot

Recommended Posts

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

I think it would be using/wasting up your bench way too early in the game.

Most teams only have 4-5 bench bats and a lot of them are specialized to fill out the roster. Your utility guy can man all the infield spots, a second catcher, an OF and maybe a specialized hitter. If you have any type of injury during the game, need a faster runner later when you are down by one with a man on, or need a key AB from your best hitter, you have already burned up one of those options.

Since most NL teams use pinch hitters and do double switches anyway, they usually have no problem getting those bats into the game in key moments.

You might see this type of strategy used if teams had bigger benches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is interesting and I thought of this a couple days ago and just realized this thread. I think it would be tough if its a normal game, just wasting bench like that in the first inning. However, if its in September with 40 man rosters, managers should be doing this. I see nothing wrong with getting your last bat on the bench in there if you are away and you bat around. I don't think the 3rd pitching spot makes much sense, just because then the next 2 times around order your pitcher is around your best hitters.

Another strategy that could be used even with 25 man rosters is if you bat around on the road in NL in 1st inning, just have you best pitcher hit no matter who is pitching. For example, if the Cubs are at the Brewers and the Cubs bat around in the 1st with Edwin Jackson pitching, why not just have Travis Wood hit in his spot, then have Edwin come out next inning? I don't see much wrong with this. It doesn't muck up the W at all I don't think. If someone pinch hits for a pitcher and in that inning the team takes lead, the last pitcher still gets victory.

This is pretty great and smart to think of. I would love to see a manager try it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

As the posters above me have said, it would waste the bench player too early in the game under normal circumstances. The hitter would have to be in the original lineup (as the pitcher) to start the game. Then there would have to be a pitching substitution for the bottom half of the inning, ruling the hitter out for the rest of the game regardless of whether he hit or not. I really have no idea what would happen to the W/L 5 inning rule if the starting pitcher didn't technically start- you raise an interesting question there!

As far as the 3hole question, that one wouldn't ever be done for two reasons.. In addition to the same reason as above, then the pitcher would be in the 3 hole for the rest of the game! By the time the third inning rolls around, your SP would have to hit between your two best hitters. You could double switch and have a hitter who should start begin the game on the bench, but that would waste two bench players.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

Because there is a thing called the official lineup. Managers give an official line up to the umpire before the game, they dont get to change it as it goes. So lets say the Padres employ your strategy, they put Tommy Medica (their bat off the bench) as the starting pitcher as the visitor, guess what happens when the Pads go 1-2-3 and you dont get to him in the first inning, you have to sub out Medica for your starting pitcher and he didnt even get an at bat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

Because there is a thing called the official lineup. Managers give an official line up to the umpire before the game, they dont get to change it as it goes. So lets say the Padres employ your strategy, they put Tommy Medica (their bat off the bench) as the starting pitcher as the visitor, guess what happens when the Pads go 1-2-3 and you dont get to him in the first inning, you have to sub out Medica for your starting pitcher and he didnt even get an at bat.

Its applicable when teams use 40 man roster. And optimally, you wouldn't use your best pinch hitter, you'd use your worst one. The whole point is that its better than the pitcher. So if you had 8-9 bench bats, you can use your last guy in the pitcher's spot. I don't see any harm in this. Your average AAA hitter should still be much more accomplished than the average or below average pitcher. Maybe guys like deGrom or Cahsner or Leake you would never think about it, but Colon, Lance Lynn, auto outs it makes sense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

During away (I think) games, the visiting team doesn't pitch until the bottom of the inning, right? So why not put in your normal pinch hitter at the start of the game in the pitcher's spot? If every man gets a chance to bat in the first inning, you won't have a high percentage out to stop your first inning rally.

If not all batters appear in the first inning, just switch him out for the main pitcher as the top of the first expires.

Even better, why not pretend the pitcher's spot is the 3rd spot at well? That way he won't have to bat until later in the game.

Is it tradition? Is it a problem with who gets the win? Is it a waste of a pinch hitter? Or is my logic unsound (it wouldn't be the first time).

Because there is a thing called the official lineup. Managers give an official line up to the umpire before the game, they dont get to change it as it goes. So lets say the Padres employ your strategy, they put Tommy Medica (their bat off the bench) as the starting pitcher as the visitor, guess what happens when the Pads go 1-2-3 and you dont get to him in the first inning, you have to sub out Medica for your starting pitcher and he didnt even get an at bat.

Its applicable when teams use 40 man roster. And optimally, you wouldn't use your best pinch hitter, you'd use your worst one. The whole point is that its better than the pitcher. So if you had 8-9 bench bats, you can use your last guy in the pitcher's spot. I don't see any harm in this. Your average AAA hitter should still be much more accomplished than the average or below average pitcher. Maybe guys like deGrom or Cahsner or Leake you would never think about it, but Colon, Lance Lynn, auto outs it makes sense.

How often do they bat around in the 1st inning? Is that number worth risking giving up a bench player? Because again, if they dont come up, you have wasted that player because you have to then sub the pitcher into that spot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting to think about, but not really all that practical. Not sure if its legal, either. I know early in the DH days some managers would list yesterday's pitcher as the DH, and then switch him out when their turn came up. They eventually made a rule against that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting to think about, but not really all that practical. Not sure if its legal, either. I know early in the DH days some managers would list yesterday's pitcher as the DH, and then switch him out when their turn came up. They eventually made a rule against that.

Again, it is legal, but to make it work you would have to list a hitter in the pitchers spot when you give the official line up to the umpire before the game when the managers and the home plate ump meet to exchange line ups, so at that point, you must list someone as the P, if you want to play the game discussed above, you list a hiter as the P, if that spot doesnt come up, then you have to sub the starting P into that spot, thus killing the hitter.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm hoping a manager tries it with 40 man rosters, but obviously not expecting it. Could put your worst hitter as the P and the penalty is negligent with expanded rosters.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3.05

(a) The pitcher named in the batting order handed the umpire-inchief, as provided in Rules 4.01 (a) and 4.01 ( B), shall pitch to the first batter or any substitute batter until such batter is put out or reaches first base, unless the pitcher sustains injury or illness which, in the judgment of the umpire-in-chief, incapacitates him from pitching.

So I was looking for something in MLB with regards to their new "speed up" proposals in talking to someone and stumbled across this. So the person who you list as "P" to start the game, would actually have to pitch to someone, probably meaning they get on base and what are the odds of scoring a run when the lead-off guy gets on? Especially considering you do not even know if you get to even get the guy at-bat, you could go 1-2-3 and then put yourself in a position to put the lead-off batter on.

Now onto more "why dont they" of sports....Sumo Hockey Goalie?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3.05

(a) The pitcher named in the batting order handed the umpire-inchief, as provided in Rules 4.01 (a) and 4.01 ( B), shall pitch to the first batter or any substitute batter until such batter is put out or reaches first base, unless the pitcher sustains injury or illness which, in the judgment of the umpire-in-chief, incapacitates him from pitching.

So I was looking for something in MLB with regards to their new "speed up" proposals in talking to someone and stumbled across this. So the person who you list as "P" to start the game, would actually have to pitch to someone, probably meaning they get on base and what are the odds of scoring a run when the lead-off guy gets on? Especially considering you do not even know if you get to even get the guy at-bat, you could go 1-2-3 and then put yourself in a position to put the lead-off batter on.

Now onto more "why dont they" of sports....Sumo Hockey Goalie?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites