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The "LOST" Thread

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Yes, he didn't pass the test for salvation at the time, although he tried. He died with "blood on his hands" and his spirit was on the island as one of the "whispers" that you heard. What that existence is or for how long, will be an unanswered question. Some will ask then what about Ben? Well, again it implied that he had a long run as Hurley's #2 and repented for his sins and tried to seek salvation. Even with all of that, he wasn't ready to "let go" and pass. Perhaps he had more work to do, up for interpretation.....

Yea, I took it as Ben was not ready to go/could not account for what he did in the past.

This finale is getting better and better by the second.

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I restrained myself and refrained from posting in here and on imdb until after the "lost" finale and I left this thread and others alone seeing as how I don't watch the show.

As you all know I have a grudge against "stunt writing". Gawd how I hate it. I hate cockadoodie cheats.

Now, I don't necessarily begrudge people who enjoy that sort of thing, especially when it is accomplished at a high level as it is always pulled off by a JJ Abrams' team. It can be enjoyable. If that is your brand of escapist entertainment, indulge yourself.

(This is going to sound mean, but please read what follows it.)

But I have never seen so many people look down on others without realizing they only have that vantage point because they swing from the hook in their mouths.

You chose to take the bait. That was your prerogative.

BUT-

You cannot disregard legitimate questions about the narrative.

The fact that "Lost" didn't adhere to a "linear" storyline was not what made some people qualify it "a cockadoodie cheat". The non-linear "La Dolce Vita" was not a cockadoodie cheat for dog'ssakes.

Just because "Lost" didn't follow the form of a traditional narrative doesn't mean that it didn't have to adhere to certain rules of the form it chose to follow itself in the first place.

When the writers admitted they *had to* abandon Walt's storyline due to the time-line they decided to follow, Patrick, they made the admission, right then and there, that they had no idea where they were taking the story.

Big tip-off to the big rip-off.

Odd thing is that they didn't need to commit to that time-line.

But they must have felt they wanted to milk the pregnancy months and other slower gestating periods that otherwise would have passed too quickly. So *ppooff*! All this magic and mystique that they had developed around this beautiful and complex young black boy- about the rarest creature you are going to find on a prime time television hit- meant absolutely nothing.

It was disposable.

And that was okay with you?

It was not okay with me, I can tell you that.

Because they really didn't know where they were going back in season one, since the very real possibility that mutant Munchkins arriving from the planet Tigercat bringing a superweapon that fired flowers and cured cancer and ended war, hunger and crabgrass factored into the story's denouement at that time.

And that kind of thing pissed me off. Moving on a writer's whim. Or was it a producer's? Or an advertiser's? Was it based on focus group feedback itself based on demographic market research?

See where I'm going with this, guys?

A lot, A LOT along the way with "Lost" rang false within the context of the story. And when too many lies piled up, too many character incongruities, too many conveniences one way or another, already way back when, I fot the guck out.

And, man, I have to say I am so glad I stopped watching when I did. If I invested any more of my time in that series only to encounter a last season (and newly introduced previous season's character) plot device that served as the contrivance that put a bow on everything I would probably either be trying to rationalize my wasted devotion myself or watching absolutely NO TV at all, having no money to replace the one I blew a hole in.

"Lost", as the cliche goes, is what it is. It has millions and millions of fans who enjoy the sort of creative thrill-ride it represents. But it is creatively disingenuous, a trait that runs through much of what Abrams does. Concept first, story later. He cheats. He did it with "Alias". He's doing it with "Fringe". (Although he just chucked faking it and decided "Hey- Let's make this whole show a "flash-sideways" concept!") It is a legitimate observation and a frustrating one. These guys are talented. They make MILLIONS.

They can also come up with a storyboard and stick to it without insulting their audience.

But as long as starting with 19M viewers and ending with a robust 7M is an acceptable figure in this industry there is no incentive to do so.

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BTW- Many figured out the purgatory concept in year one. Either Abrams or a partner outright denied it. All these years for what was obvious in season one.

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BTW- Many figured out the purgatory concept in year one. Either Abrams or a partner outright denied it. All these years for what was obvious in season one.

Wrong. Many said the island was purgatory. It was not. So I'd say I'm confused that you think otherwise, except for the fact that you admitted you stopped watching the show.

Although Walt is one example of changes that had to be made, this is, as PB stated, part of television. In season 1 they had an idea, but they had no idea if the show would be cancelled after 9 episodes, run 2 seasons, or 6. It happens. But the overall story stayed true.

From this post it's clear you don't know what happened in the show. So no offense, but (This is going to sound mean, but please read), the opinion of Lost from someone who stopped watching and cannot judge in it's totality is not an opinion worth considering.

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Wrong. Many said the island was purgatory. It was not. So I'd say I'm confused that you think otherwise, except for the fact that you admitted you stopped watching the show.

Although Walt is one example of changes that had to be made, this is, as PB stated, part of television. In season 1 they had an idea, but they had no idea if the show would be cancelled after 9 episodes, run 2 seasons, or 6. It happens. But the overall story stayed true.

From this post it's clear you don't know what happened in the show. So no offense, but (This is going to sound mean, but please read), the opinion of Lost from someone who stopped watching and cannot judge in it's totality is not an opinion worth considering.

But I can accept that, 2B. AND respect it.

I will accept anything, really, that you want to say about my critiquing of a show to which you were devoted and I was not.

I am only going by what many of my friends who continued to watch the show took away from the final episode and what I can draw from reading everything written on the plot synopses. It seemed to them that all the experiences that transpired on the island, the trials the characters went through, and then the whole question of whether they accepted salvation or not, made the locale, the setting were analogous to the concepts of purgatory/limbo. In fact I am trying to find a way how it could not be representative of that. After all, the whole thing was an allegory after all.

So this was NOT just my outsider interpretation, this was theirs. This is also the interpretation of thousands, perhaps millions of "Lost" fans posting on boards from around the world who unlike me kept watching a show that made itself up as it went along remaining only true to a concept and not a story. So, if you think I'VE got it all screwed up, you have a lot of your fellow fans to straighten out (which I guess is why there is an encyclopedia).

2B, this was made clear by the things the writers said in season one and many of the religious aspects that the show ended up embracing and representing were at least somewhat cloyingly if not wholly disowned or somewhat disassociated by Abrams way back in season one. You might say that he wanted us to stay curious, but I think it would have been better had they said nothing about ANYTHING- about Walt and the timeline, about religion and the plot (eventually conceding the show was spiritual which aws obvious from the get-go and offensive to absolutely noone who enjoyed the show like us).

I love the show at its inception. I don't like cheats. Defend it all you want. If you can accept any plot contrivance in the name of fiction as long as it is carried off cleverly then the form works for you.

Might point to you and Patrick and everyone who doesn't understand the other perspective:

There are two other audiences that might criticize "Lost". You should distinguish between the two.

The one just doesn't like that sort of concept, that sort of entertainment. And I can understand why you might treat them dismissively.

But there are those who like entertainments like "Lost" but do not appreciate "Plot Contrivance Playhouse". For us, there is no reason to excuse a poor construct. And if we point that out, if we say it was built out of balsa way back when it's not likely to have been crafted out of oak by series end. You have a right to be protective of your show and blast me as an outsider. But back when a great many more people watched "Lost" on a weekly basis it was my show too. That it abandoned ME was in my opinion a failure of the show, 2Balls, not of mine.

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But I can accept that, 2B. AND respect it.

I will accept anything, really, that you want to say about my critiquing of a show to which you were devoted and I was not.

I am only going by what many of my friends who continued to watch the show took away from the final episode and what I can draw from reading everything written on the plot synopses. It seemed to them that all the experiences that transpired on the island, the trials the characters went through, and then the whole question of whether they accepted salvation or not, made the locale, the setting were analogous to the concepts of purgatory/limbo. In fact I am trying to find a way how it could not be representative of that. After all, the whole thing was an allegory after all.

So this was NOT just my outsider interpretation, this was theirs. This is also the interpretation of thousands, perhaps millions of "Lost" fans posting on boards from around the world who unlike me kept watching a show that made itself up as it went along remaining only true to a concept and not a story. So, if you think I'VE got it all screwed up, you have a lot of your fellow fans to straighten out (which I guess is why there is an encyclopedia).

2B, this was made clear by the things the writers said in season one and many of the religious aspects that the show ended up embracing and representing were at least somewhat cloyingly if not wholly disowned or somewhat disassociated by Abrams way back in season one. You might say that he wanted us to stay curious, but I think it would have been better had they said nothing about ANYTHING- about Walt and the timeline, about religion and the plot (eventually conceding the show was spiritual which aws obvious from the get-go and offensive to absolutely noone who enjoyed the show like us).

I love the show at its inception. I don't like cheats. Defend it all you want. If you can accept any plot contrivance in the name of fiction as long as it is carried off cleverly then the form works for you.

Might point to you and Patrick and everyone who doesn't understand the other perspective:

There are two other audiences that might criticize "Lost". You should distinguish between the two.

The one just doesn't like that sort of concept, that sort of entertainment. And I can understand why you might treat them dismissively.

But there are those who like entertainments like "Lost" but do not appreciate "Plot Contrivance Playhouse". For us, there is no reason to excuse a poor construct. And if we point that out, if we say it was built out of balsa way back when it's not likely to have been crafted out of oak by series end. You have a right to be protective of your show and blast me as an outsider. But back when a great many more people watched "Lost" on a weekly basis it was my show too. That it abandoned ME was in my opinion a failure of the show, 2Balls, not of mine.

I don't buy this idea that the story was made up as it went along. I know that I was "Lost" and felt this way as the show went on with seemingly no answers. I believe it was season 3 that seemed slow with little answers and only a bunch of random things happening. I was annoyed. My brother, who was also a "Lostie," quit watching as you did. But I stuck it out until the end. And they wrapped up everything, and it all made sense (save Walter). So while many have this idea that they made it up as it went along, it's clear they had an ending all along. The last season explained just about everything we were previously left thinking was being "made up as they went along." Anyone who watched from beginning to end and didn't see this, well, I'm not sure what they were watching. So I don't believe it was "plot contrivance." While I felt that way at once too, I don't believe they abandoned you, I believe you gave up too early. But if you want to believe that we were just "fish who took the bait" and you were much brighter as to figure that out early on, that's your prerogative.

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Just watched the final episode and I am officially sad.. sad that it's over, sad that there are no more episodes to look forward to and sad that I can no longer see Kate in that little black dress.. so so sad! I love Lost!

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this is the time where i am pretty happy that i'm not too attached, and that i only watched my first episode and the rest since starting in like august.

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