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Shohei Ohtani - Angels

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1 hour ago, brockpapersizer said:

The difference between 300k and 3.5 million isn't a lot when you consider he's setting himself up for a contract in 2 years that could easily fluctuate by the tens of millions depending on where he signs. I have to think even if he's the same pitcher a 3.7 ERA from an NL Team after 2 years probably gets him paid more than a 4.3 with the Yankees. 

The only thing is does he want to be safe.  What if he gets seriously injured and can't play anymore some time in his first two years?  It is good to "bank" a sure thing up front just in case of stuff like this I'd think. 

He will get that super big paycheck if healthy down the line either way but at least he has several millions in the bank up front now as "insurance money" basically. 

And he can afford to live it up some the first two years as well as opposed to looking for subsidized housing, heh.  Never underestimate a young player and the allure of instant money to play with immediately.  Granted Japanese players have a reputation of being a bit more disciplined than the average American ones but hey he is only human in the end and the lifestyle of major league high rollers has an allure for a lot of them.

Edited by The Big Bat Theory

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1 hour ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

The only thing is does he want to be safe.  What if he gets seriously injured and can't play anymore some time in his first two years?  It is good to "bank" a sure thing up front just in case of stuff like this I'd think. 

He will get that super big paycheck if healthy down the line either way but at least he has several millions in the bank up front now as "insurance money" basically. 

And he can afford to live it up some the first two years as well as opposed to looking for subsidized housing, heh.  Never underestimate a young player and the allure of instant money to play with immediately.  Granted Japanese players have a reputation of being a bit more disciplined than the average American ones but hey he is only human in the end and the lifestyle of major league high rollers has an allure for a lot of them.

 

I get the whole "he could be hurt and never have a 2nd contract" thing. Belive me I do.  That being said, he's already a legend in Japan. It's not like this guy won't have an oppurtunity to make money via appearances, coaching, whatever. He's not some random linebacker or 2nd round NBA player. 

 

I get both sides honestly. That being said, even if he is financially motivated, it seems like someone of his talent would bet on himself. Unless he's calculated his maxnimum value to be a result of hitting too, and the DH being able to drive up that cost, I'd rather pitch in the NL if it was to decide my next big contract. 

Edited by brockpapersizer

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47 minutes ago, brockpapersizer said:

I get the whole "he could be hurt and never have a 2nd contract" thing. Belive me I do.  That being said, he's already a legend in Japan. It's not like this guy won't have an oppurtunity to make money via appearances, coaching, whatever. He's not some random linebacker or 2nd round NBA player. 

I get both sides honestly. That being said, even if he is financially motivated, it seems like someone of his talent would bet on himself. Unless he's calculated his maxnimum value to be a result of hitting too, and the DH being able to drive up that cost, I'd rather pitch in the NL if it was to decide my next big contract. 

Oh I agree with a lot of that but having millions of dollars immediately basically for your asking is really really tempting.

Also I think it doesn't matter if he pitches in the AL for his next big contract.  MLB teams know the difference in ERA etc a pitcher adds pitching in the AL and can "translate" that down to NL digits easily.  Kind of like a golfing handicap maybe though I never have played golf so may have the analogy off.

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55 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Oh I agree with a lot of that but having millions of dollars immediately basically for your asking is really really tempting.

Also I think it doesn't matter if he pitches in the AL for his next big contract.  MLB teams know the difference in ERA etc a pitcher adds pitching in the AL and can "translate" that down to NL digits easily.  Kind of like a golfing handicap maybe though I never have played golf so may have the analogy off.

 

If Mike Leake wasn't on the Cardinals and was on the White Sox or something, do you really think his stats would have measured up to getting an 80 million dollar contract. I don't. I agree organizations have done better at factoring in home parks and leagues, but there are still big biases. 

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his 270 Million Japan salary converts to 2.4 million USD. He's already taking a future years paycut being apart the arbitration system. Betting on yourself in a 6 years of control arbitration system is super risky and I don't find it financially smart either. Today dollar is worth more than tomorrows and all that jazz

 

If he signs with a small bonus, you bet your butt the MLB is going to investigate with a fine tooth comb for under the table agreements. Simply put, it would look TOO fishy for it to make sense. So it likely going to be one the big bonus teams.

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http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/hideki-matsui-expects-yankees-recruit-shohei-otani-article-1.3644743

 

Matsui to recruit Otani for Yanks

 

@brockpapersizer

@The Big Bat Theory

 

do you think that,plus the fact Tanaka is a yankee helps him?

 

meaning, do you think he WANTS to have a fellow Japanese player on his team or does he want all the Japanese attention for himself?

 

i guess what im asking is does Tanaka and Matsui increase or decrease yankees chances 

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8 hours ago, jfazz23 said:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/hideki-matsui-expects-yankees-recruit-shohei-otani-article-1.3644743

 

Matsui to recruit Otani for Yanks

 

@brockpapersizer

@The Big Bat Theory

 

do you think that,plus the fact Tanaka is a yankee helps him?

 

meaning, do you think he WANTS to have a fellow Japanese player on his team or does he want all the Japanese attention for himself?

 

i guess what im asking is does Tanaka and Matsui increase or decrease yankees chances 

 

Is Matsui offering Shohei some of his massive porn collection in an effort to woo him?

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Surprised but not overwhelmingly shocked this hasn't received more attention. Probably cause it's hidden over here in MiLB. With that said, it's great for us Dynasty leaguers to have someone like this available at the top of our drafts. Interested to see where he signs. Gonna stink if he ends up in a place like Texas where the long balls go a flyin'. Yankee fan here so I'd like to see him in Pinstripes but even that's a rough landing spot, getting adjusted to the MLB in the AL East. Good grief Charlie Brown. 

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1 hour ago, JeterPimpedUrGF said:

Surprised but not overwhelmingly shocked this hasn't received more attention. Probably cause it's hidden over here in MiLB. With that said, it's great for us Dynasty leaguers to have someone like this available at the top of our drafts. Interested to see where he signs. Gonna stink if he ends up in a place like Texas where the long balls go a flyin'. Yankee fan here so I'd like to see him in Pinstripes but even that's a rough landing spot, getting adjusted to the MLB in the AL East. Good grief Charlie Brown. 

your name checks out :lol:

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Posted this in the main forum too.  Rotoworld blurb today:

 

Quote

In a new team podcast, Mariners GM Jerry Dipoto says that the Mariners will make a "full-court press" for Shohei Otani.

 

Dipoto also says that the team would be willing to play slugger Nelson Cruz a few days in the outfield to accomodate Otani being able to DH on the days he's not pitching. The Mariners have long been considered a candidate for Otani because of their history with Japanese players (Ichiro Suzuki, Hishashi Iwakuma, Kazuhiro Sasaki, just to name a few), but also because they have an obvious need for starting pitching. The fact that Seattle would also be willing to let him hit, at least according to the podcast, is also something that could serve them well in their bid for the 23-year-old. It wouldn't be a major upset at all if Otani ends up playing in Seattle in 2018.

 

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This may have been discussed but the thread is so long and I am too lazy to search through. 

 

Are the stat providers going to allow the teams' owning otani to place him where they wish, ie. some periods at pitcher, some periods at hitter?  

 

I ask because I messaged cbs and to paraphrase, "it is under discussion but that would be a MAJOR change to the system". 

 

Huh?  What?  EVERYONE knows he is coming.  It is purely code.  I can place trey mancini at outfield or 3b, but only one of those spots.  How is this different then otani at dh or pitcher?  

 

Why should cbs get to dictate that otani is only a hitter or only a pitcher.  If they set it up like this, that means  1/ you have two different otani owners (alex bregman is eligible at two positions, can two teams in your league own him?)   2/  if cbs has two otani's, and your league says only one owner for each player, one of the rosters has to be expanded, thus changing the dynamics.  

 

People, this is not out of the blue.  Message cbs to get it right!!  

 

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This is a good point. I would have to believe they're going to be forced to make accommodations for him to the system because if not then people will find a service that does. The question imo becomes this: how will it impact a manager's roster limit. Will Otani be considered one player and be coded for use as hitter and or pitcher or will owing him require u to use two roster spots, one on the offensive side and one on the pitching portion. They're arguably going to have this same issue with the guy the Rays drafted Brendan McKay. 

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We might be witnessing the transcendence of the sport in Otani. He might change the game the same way the first manager who did the major infield shift did when he positioned almost everyone in his infield to the far right side for a left handed pull hitter. Now everyone does it.   

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6 hours ago, unknownrotoguru said:

This may have been discussed but the thread is so long and I am too lazy to search through. 

 

Are the stat providers going to allow the teams' owning otani to place him where they wish, ie. some periods at pitcher, some periods at hitter?  

 

I ask because I messaged cbs and to paraphrase, "it is under discussion but that would be a MAJOR change to the system". 

 

Huh?  What?  EVERYONE knows he is coming.  It is purely code.  I can place trey mancini at outfield or 3b, but only one of those spots.  How is this different then otani at dh or pitcher?  

 

Why should cbs get to dictate that otani is only a hitter or only a pitcher.  If they set it up like this, that means  1/ you have two different otani owners (alex bregman is eligible at two positions, can two teams in your league own him?)   2/  if cbs has two otani's, and your league says only one owner for each player, one of the rosters has to be expanded, thus changing the dynamics.  

 

People, this is not out of the blue.  Message cbs to get it right!!  

 

 

Apples and oranges.  Mancini still collects the same stats at either position.  Runs, RBI, SB etc etc.  He doesn't suddenly collect K's, Wins, ERA etc moving from the OF to 1B (he doesn't play 3B btw).  He stays in the hitting software subset at all times.  Otani won't.  So it isn't necessarily an easy fix. 

 

Hell if Yahoo can't keep prospect slots up (NA slots) from year to year for dynasty play as they promised they would do a half decade ago I don't see them doing something far more complicated.  fantasy baseball is an afterthought on sites like Yahoo and ESPN and CBS where maybe a hundred times more people play fantasy football there than fantasy baseball.

 

There is a thread already either here or in the main area (I think there) that has been discussing this topic going back about a month or two.  Fantrax seems to be working on the problem the most as I recall from that thread.

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3 hours ago, jfazz23 said:

scouts believe hell be a yankee

cant wait until hes striking out Xander 3 times next year

 

https://nypost.com/2017/11/22/scouts-are-conflicted-on-what-shohei-ohtanis-plan-should-be/

 

You don't need Otani to strike out Xander.  An AA pitcher would do just fine for that task.

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sounds like espn gonna make 2 diff players in the database lol

 

the SP and then the hitter lol thatd be an interesting draft strategy

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6 hours ago, kmoore1521 said:

sounds like espn gonna make 2 diff players in the database lol

 

the SP and then the hitter lol thatd be an interesting draft strategy

 

Is this true that espn is doing that? I cant find the source for that anywhere. Can you post a link? 

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https://forums.yahoo.net/t5/Help-with-Fantasy-Baseball/C-Chris-Gimenez/td-p/269924

 

To anyone in yahoo leagues, you can be almost certain that only Shohei Ohtani's SP stats will be used. Even though Gimenez was not a valuable player, he did meet position eligibility requirements for both both catcher and pitcher. The comments in the link attached explain that since his regular position was catcher, he was never given pitcher eligibility. 

 

I assume an exception will be considered to avoid complaints. Adding a 2nd separate Ohtani for offense only seems reasonable. 

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1 hour ago, BxBOMBERs28 said:

He'll look great in pinstripes ?

 

On 11/23/2017 at 7:40 PM, The Big Bat Theory said:

 

Apples and oranges.  Mancini still collects the same stats at either position.  Runs, RBI, SB etc etc.  He doesn't suddenly collect K's, Wins, ERA etc moving from the OF to 1B (he doesn't play 3B btw).  He stays in the hitting software subset at all times.  Otani won't.  So it isn't necessarily an easy fix. 

 

Hell if Yahoo can't keep prospect slots up (NA slots) from year to year for dynasty play as they promised they would do a half decade ago I don't see them doing something far more complicated.  fantasy baseball is an afterthought on sites like Yahoo and ESPN and CBS where maybe a hundred times more people play fantasy football there than fantasy baseball.

 

There is a thread already either here or in the main area (I think there) that has been discussing this topic going back about a month or two.  Fantrax seems to be working on the problem the most as I recall from that thread.

from mlb.com

 

  • MLB.com’s Jon Morosi tweets that executives from multiple teams are of the belief that Ohtani’s preference is to sign in a market that does not already have an established Japanese star, though Ohtani’s agents at CAA have not commented on that possibility. Morosi also spoke to one of Ohtani’s teammates in Japan, former big leaguer Brandon Laird, who offered a similar suggestion (Twitter link): “I feel like he just wants to come and not be compared to other guys who have already been here — to start fresh on his own, show what he can do by himself.”

 

 

this does not look good for yankees.  at this point im thinking seattle...

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19 minutes ago, jfazz23 said:

 

from mlb.com

 

  • MLB.com’s Jon Morosi tweets that executives from multiple teams are of the belief that Ohtani’s preference is to sign in a market that does not already have an established Japanese star, though Ohtani’s agents at CAA have not commented on that possibility. Morosi also spoke to one of Ohtani’s teammates in Japan, former big leaguer Brandon Laird, who offered a similar suggestion (Twitter link): “I feel like he just wants to come and not be compared to other guys who have already been here — to start fresh on his own, show what he can do by himself.”

 

 

this does not look good for yankees.  at this point im thinking seattle...

 

Ah but the tense of the verbs ("who have already been here") suggests any Japanese athlete who has ever played on a team, not current players only, so Seattle with Iwakuma in the recent past and signed to a minor league contract for this 2018 year as well plus hitting wise obviously Ichiro who is a VERY beloved icon there means Seattle isn't out of the woods in that regard.

 

And I'm sure playing in one of the most if not THE most famous city on earth with all the glitz and glamour and media attention will outweigh other concerns regards NY.  Well the NY of the Yankees.  Mets, not so much.  Their Keystone Kops version of a "medical staff" would destroy him the first year, heh.

 

In other words I don't think this stuff will factor into the signing all that much.  Or at least not overwhelm other factors.

 

So I'd say the Yankees and Seattle are leading contenders. If the Dodgers want to skip going after Darvish and using that money to go after Otani instead then they are in good position too.  Yankees and Dodgers are real contenders.  Seattle is trying at least.  I think contending is just as important or way more so a factor.  Who wants to go to a cellar dweller rebuilding for some years to come when you can go to two of the best and most famous franchises in baseball in the Yankees and Dodgers.  (And I say that even as a Red Sox fan.  Players want to put on those damn pinstripes).

Edited by The Big Bat Theory
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This idea of Ohtani wanting to be a trailblazer different from other Japanese players makes sense - if I were a player of his caliber and well-rounded game I, too, would want to separate/distinguish myself from others that came before me simply because of their national origin.

Go Cubs go! Man, those blue pinstripes would look great on him.

I don't think the likes of Kosuke Fukudome - the last and only MLB-ready, big Japanese star signing for the Cubs - should count as a previously long-lasting impression to an organization.

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23 hours ago, txrngr34 said:

This idea of Ohtani wanting to be a trailblazer different from other Japanese players makes sense - if I were a player of his caliber and well-rounded game I, too, would want to separate/distinguish myself from others that came before me simply because of their national origin.

Go Cubs go! Man, those blue pinstripes would look great on him.

I don't think the likes of Kosuke Fukudome - the last and only MLB-ready, big Japanese star signing for the Cubs - should count as a previously long-lasting impression to an organization.

i think NL team is ruled out

 

maybe twins? cant imagine someone wanting to go to Minnesota instead of Seattle or New york....maybe white sox???

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