Tryptamine

Eloy Jimenez - OF CHC

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Interesting note from Eric Longenhagen Prospects chat today:

AlphaCino

12:10

Who has the highest power on your top 100 prospects?

Eric A Longenhagen

12:10

Eloy Jimenez has 80 future raw.

Edited by garlando
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He hit an absolute seed single off of Danny Salazar today. This guy just looks so athletic and toolsy!

 

Edited by Coach George
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2 hours ago, Coach George said:
He hit an absolute seed single off of Danny Salazar today. This guy just looks so athletic and toolsy!

 

 

Thank you so much, I was talking about this in the Sally thread and was about to come post here about it because I wanted a vid so bad. Only hit Salazar gave up today. When I saw that pitch coming I was like, ah he ain't getting to that and when he laced it I was like, oh damn... 

 

Just wish they had a frontal view. That pitch got up on him quick. 

Edited by taobball
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Theo referred to Eloy today as a potential fantasy sleeper. Haven't listened to it but definitely perked my attention. 

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2 hours ago, taobball said:

Theo referred to Eloy today as a potential fantasy sleeper. Haven't listened to it but definitely perked my attention. 

 

As a Cubs fan I don't want to think about what would have to go wrong to get him to the majors. They already have too many positions players. This guy is going to be a stud but I really don't like thinking about why he would be with the MLB team in 2017.

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1 hour ago, Mickey Donovan said:

 

As a Cubs fan I don't want to think about what would have to go wrong to get him to the majors. They already have too many positions players. This guy is going to be a stud but I really don't like thinking about why he would be with the MLB team in 2017.

Really? You wouldn't mind moving that giant waste of a contract that is Jason Heyward to get an upgrade at pitching and have this guy in RF? Interesting....

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2 hours ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

Really? You wouldn't mind moving that giant waste of a contract that is Jason Heyward to get an upgrade at pitching and have this guy in RF? Interesting....

Why would anyone give them upgraded pitching in exchange for a "giant waste of a contract"?

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3 hours ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

Really? You wouldn't mind moving that giant waste of a contract that is Jason Heyward to get an upgrade at pitching and have this guy in RF? Interesting....

 

In fairness Theo called Heyward a sleeper in the same breath as Eloy.

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3 hours ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

Really? You wouldn't mind moving that giant waste of a contract that is Jason Heyward to get an upgrade at pitching and have this guy in RF? Interesting....

 

Nope, if Heyward falls on his face again, they stick Zobrist out there. Baez can handle second full time. If one goes down, Ian Happ is a more developed player. But Jimenez? I am looking forward to watching him but He's 20 and hasn't played about A ball. I'll wait.

Edited by Mickey Donovan

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On 3/7/2017 at 5:51 PM, mysonx3 said:

Why would anyone give them upgraded pitching in exchange for a "giant waste of a contract"?

 

On 3/7/2017 at 6:06 PM, taobball said:

 

In fairness Theo called Heyward a sleeper in the same breath as Eloy.

 

On 3/7/2017 at 6:10 PM, Mickey Donovan said:

 

Nope, if Heyward falls on his face again, they stick Zobrist out there. Baez can handle second full time. If one goes down, Ian Happ is a more developed player. But Jimenez? I am looking forward to watching him but He's 20 and hasn't played about A ball. I'll wait.

 

Mickey,

My point is that the team is incredibly deep. If Jimenez is up to contribute it isn't the end of the world, as your tone suggests in the " As a Cubs fan I don't want to think about what would have to go wrong to get him to the major" comment.

 

mysonx3,

there's always a trade for a better pitcher. For some reason GM's are paying for Heywards defense. If he's not hitting, move him and improve the bullpen or find the 5th pitcher they'll need to replace Lackey (getting up there in age, and I don't believe he puts it together this season).

 

taoball,

Heyward has been a sleeper for a few years now hasn't he? The guy gets paid for defense and that can only carry him so far. Defense can't carry a .230 avg., 7hr, 11 sb stat line much longer..... 

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Just now, Dark Kn19ht said:

 

taoball,

Heyward has been a sleeper for a few years now hasn't he? The guy gets paid for defense and that can only carry him so far. Defense can't carry a .230 avg., 7hr, 11 sb stat line much longer..... 

 

I mean, that' snot what he did in 2015. What he did in 2015 was completely fine. 

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2 minutes ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

there's always a trade for a better pitcher. For some reason GM's are paying for Heywards defense. If he's not hitting, move him and improve the bullpen or find the 5th pitcher they'll need to replace Lackey (getting up there in age, and I don't believe he puts it together this season).

Nobody is willing to pay what the Cubs pay Heyward, let alone give up something valuable for the right to do so. They're stuck with him unless they eat a good chunk of the contract

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10 minutes ago, mysonx3 said:

Nobody is willing to pay what the Cubs pay Heyward, let alone give up something valuable for the right to do so. They're stuck with him unless they eat a good chunk of the contract

which is a pretty easy option to accept if you're on the verge of back to back championships and Lackey is blowing up.

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On 3/9/2017 at 1:31 PM, Dark Kn19ht said:

 

taoball,

Heyward has been a sleeper for a few years now hasn't he? The guy gets paid for defense and that can only carry him so far. Defense can't carry a .230 avg., 7hr, 11 sb stat line much longer..... 

 

I know this is beginning to derail this forum topic... but... this is just a ludicrous and false statement.

 

Up till last season (when he had a terrible first season with the Cubs) he was a 5.5 WAR+ player in 4 of his 6 major league seasons.  In those two seasons that aren't included he only played (on average) 71% of games.  A WAR above 5 is considered a superstar (a 6 is considered a MVP candidate) player by the very Sabermetric definition.  Heyward has had WAR seasons of: 6.3, 5.5, 6.4 and 6.5 in his ML career.  Color that however you wish but Heyward has been a VERY good/well above average MLB player who has done much more than just "getting paid for his defense".  Saying that, believe it or not but defense is a HUGE part of baseball (and a huge reason why the Cubs won their first championship last year since the prehistoric ages).

 

Bringing the topic back on track - Jimenez isn't close to being in Chicago.  He might see a cup of coffee later this year (if literally every single thing breaks right for Jimenez this season) and be back in the minors for some seasoning next season.  It's a phenomenal problem to have for the Cubs - a potential ++ bat in their minor league system when their ML club is beyond loaded.

Edited by IlliniGuy76

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On 3/7/2017 at 4:03 PM, Dark Kn19ht said:

Really? You wouldn't mind moving that giant waste of a contract that is Jason Heyward to get an upgrade at pitching and have this guy in RF? Interesting....

lmao

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A bit concerning...

 

http://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/cubs-optimistic-eloy-jimenez-shoulder-injury-not-serious/

 

 Cubs top prospect Eloy Jimenez, who was reassigned to minor-league camp Friday, has undergone both an MRI and a CT scan on his sore shoulder and the Cubs expect to have more clarity on the injury by Monday.

The power-hitting outfielder hasn’t played on either side of camp since Tuesday, when he launched an errant, ninth-inning throw from left field that landed in the seats behind the third-base dugout. It’s believed that aggravated an already mildly sore shoulder.

The Cubs seem optimistic the injury won’t require more than a rest period and re-strengthening program to resolve.

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On 3/9/2017 at 11:33 AM, taobball said:

 

I mean, that' snot what he did in 2015. What he did in 2015 was completely fine. 

 

On 3/11/2017 at 10:14 AM, IlliniGuy76 said:

 

I know this is beginning to derail this forum topic... but... this is just a ludicrous and false statement.

 

 

Just to further my ludicrous statement and build a case for why Eloy would absolutely be fine over Heyward:

 

"Through 13 spring training games, Heyward is slashing just .143/.231/.286 with 10 strikeouts.
Spin: 
It's still a fairly small sample size, but Heyward's revamped swing is not yielding results. After a down year from Heyward in 2016, fantasy owners have to be concerned with his continued struggles this spring. Working in Heyward's favor is his defense in right field, which should keep the 27-year-old in the lineup most days." - ESPN update

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17 minutes ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

 

 

Just to further my ludicrous statement and build a case for why Eloy would absolutely be fine over Heyward:

 

"Through 13 spring training games, Heyward is slashing just .143/.231/.286 with 10 strikeouts.
Spin: 
It's still a fairly small sample size, but Heyward's revamped swing is not yielding results. After a down year from Heyward in 2016, fantasy owners have to be concerned with his continued struggles this spring. Working in Heyward's favor is his defense in right field, which should keep the 27-year-old in the lineup most days." - ESPN update

 

Got it - so you think it's completely logical to look at 13 ST at-bats, and one bad year, & toss out an entire career where he's been an elite player, and use the first ST for a 20 year old player and say that a defending World Champion squad with aspirations to repeat would be just "fine".

 

Totally makes sense.

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1 hour ago, IlliniGuy76 said:

 

Got it - so you think it's completely logical to look at 13 ST at-bats, and one bad year, & toss out an entire career where he's been an elite player, and use the first ST for a 20 year old player and say that a defending World Champion squad with aspirations to repeat would be just "fine".

 

Totally makes sense.

 

Yes, I don't take much merit in SP but a full year and then some of struggles has that ST line look really "good", don't you think?

And yes, Eloy would play decent defense and hit better than a pitcher (Heyward). So yeah the defending champs with little to no problems with/without Heyward  would be 100% completely fine if not even better with someone that could hit every once in a while (Eloy).

 

Can't wait to see this kid up hitting +30 bombs annually.

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40 minutes ago, Dark Kn19ht said:

 

Yes, I don't take much merit in SP but a full year and then some of struggles has that ST line look really "good", don't you think?

And yes, Eloy would play decent defense and hit better than a pitcher (Heyward). So yeah the defending champs with little to no problems with/without Heyward  would be 100% completely fine if not even better with someone that could hit every once in a while (Eloy).

 

Can't wait to see this kid up hitting +30 bombs annually.

 

Believe it or not, I'm not going to discount YEARS of ML service where Heyward has been an elite/top of his game player and believe that a 20 year old will produce more.  Sorry.. I'm not buying that.

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4 hours ago, IlliniGuy76 said:

 

Got it - so you think it's completely logical to look at 13 ST at-bats

 

 

His defense is fine (and where he provides the majority of his value these days), but he's actually hitting .132 through 38 ST at-bats, is coming off a .631 OPS season (absolutely horrendous) and hasn't had an OPS over .800 since 2012. He's shown flashes of brilliant power over the years, but I've never considered him an elite hitter for fantasy. He has been, and will continue to be, on my do not draft list.

 

As far as the complete package is concerned, I would agree that Eloy is not ready to take over for Heyward as he still has much to work on (hasn't even faced A+ pitching yet in the lower levels and has a poor K's to BB's ratio, so he needs to continue to work on refining his hit tool to pair with the power/athleticism to increase his chances of success at the MLB level), but Heyward is absolutely an albatross contractually in my opinion.

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3 hours ago, IlliniGuy76 said:

 

Believe it or not, I'm not going to discount YEARS of ML service where Heyward has been an elite/top of his game player and believe that a 20 year old will produce more.  Sorry.. I'm not buying that.

i feel like this is an argument for eloy

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