DerrickHenrysCleats

Amari Cooper 2018 Outlook

tonycpsu

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He'll finish top 5 this year...then someone will come out after the fact to say he had Cooper rated as a 1st rd dynasty pick all along.

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34 minutes ago, Rolling Thunder said:

Now that we know that Crab is out of the picture, and in light of Gruden's recent comments praising Cooper, how does Cooper slot in this rough, too early full point PPR ranking:

Editing to my rankings and inputting Cooper

 

 

AB

Nuk

OBJ

Allen

Julio

Adams

Thomas

AJG

Baldwin

Evans

T.Y.

Cooper

D. Thomas

Diggs

Thielen

A Rob

Fitz

Alshon

Cooks

M. Jones

Garcon

Gordon

Tate

Fuller

Woods

Watkins

JuJu

Landry

Crabtree

Sanders

 

 

 

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40 minutes ago, Rolling Thunder said:

Now that we know that Crab is out of the picture, and in light of Gruden's recent comments praising Cooper, how does Cooper slot in this rough, too early full point PPR ranking:

 

AB

Nuk

OBJ

Julio

AJG

Allen

Adams

Thomas

Baldwin

Evans

T.Y.

ARob

D. Thomas

Diggs

Hill

Thielen

Alshon

Fitz

Cooks

Garcon

Fuller

Woods

M. Jones

Crabtree

Tate

JuJu

Landry

Cobb

Sanders

 

Are the Cooper truthers slotting him after Evans and before TY?  

 

How about the Cooper doubters?

There's maybe two guys on this list i'd draft Cooper over-  Woods and Crabtree, I think.      Maybe Cobb and Sanders.   Landry also possible. 

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Just now, BrianM said:

There's maybe two guys on this list i'd draft Cooper over-  Woods and Crabtree, I think.      Maybe Cobb and Sanders.   Landry also possible. 

raiders will be throwing a-lot due to game script. Amari will finally be used enough. I think this will be his best year. 

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6 minutes ago, CharlieWhitehurst said:

raiders will be throwing a-lot due to game script. Amari will finally be used enough. I think this will be his best year. 

 

Personally I see his ceiling as a repeat of 2016, with his floor being 2017- he can't do better than he did in '16 when they IMO peaked as an offense.     I thought last year was so bad that he's truly got some issue that's going to hinder him.    Beyond that, i'm a Gruden skeptic, which has me leaning towards the negative on Cooper.  

 

I am perhaps being TOO negative on him- time will tell, but ultimately, this thread proves that people still like him enough to draft as a WR2.   Even a slight fade of Cooper would mean you wont get him cheap.  I've resigned myself to that fact- even if I decide i'm too harsh and bump him up a bit, he's not going to be on my team.  

Edited by BrianM

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At the moment I'm willing to reach for him at the bottom of the 2nd or top of the 3rd in a 12 teamer me thinks. But the hype train is gonna keep chugging along.

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Just now, Deadpool said:

At the moment I'm willing to reach for him at the bottom of the 2nd or top of the 3rd in a 12 teamer me thinks. But the hype train is gonna keep chugging along.

 

Every single year he gets pushed to this 2/3 turn.

 

Every single year he fails to deliver.

 

Will we ever learn?

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2 minutes ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

Every single year he gets pushed to this 2/3 turn.

 

Every single year he fails to deliver.

 

Will we ever learn?

 

Nope, it's fantasy football. We are doomed to repeat the same mistakes every year. ?

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1 hour ago, Lord_Varys said:

 

Every single year he gets pushed to this 2/3 turn.

 

Every single year he fails to deliver.

 

Will we ever learn?

 

I would be shocked if he is taken in the 3rd he is really 4/5.

 

ithink people are going to get QB stupid this season grabbing watson-Rodgers-Wilson-Brady-Wentz in the first  5rds thus pushing down questionmark wr's.

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The thing i don't get here is the "hype train".   What reason is there here for hype at this point?     Did you not see how bad Gruden's post SB Tampa teams were?  The guy hasn't coached in eons, and is loading his team up with old guys across the board.   I have no idea why people think HE is the answer to Cooper's problems.      Even if you think Cooper's righting the ship, the team itself is unstable.  They're about to relocate.  The defense is full of holes.  Carr looked lost at times last year.    When none of this was true- and they clicked in 2016, Cooper STILL was WR15 in PPR.   And he's going in the early 3rd after a horrendous season?   

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Fool me once: shame on you

Fool me twice: shame on me

Fool me three time: shame on me

Fool me four times: shame on me

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15 hours ago, FreakFries said:

Fool me once: shame on you

Fool me twice: shame on me

Fool me three time: shame on me

Fool me four times: shame on me

 

Haha this is how I feel and why based on Cooper’s still high ADP I’m unlikely to own him anywhere

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17 hours ago, BrianM said:

The thing i don't get here is the "hype train".   What reason is there here for hype at this point?     Did you not see how bad Gruden's post SB Tampa teams were?  The guy hasn't coached in eons, and is loading his team up with old guys across the board.   I have no idea why people think HE is the answer to Cooper's problems.      Even if you think Cooper's righting the ship, the team itself is unstable.  They're about to relocate.  The defense is full of holes.  Carr looked lost at times last year.    When none of this was true- and they clicked in 2016, Cooper STILL was WR15 in PPR.   And he's going in the early 3rd after a horrendous season?   

 

 

 I took a shot on Amari his rookie year with a waiver pick and lost. I avoided him since then because the crabtree  effect was tangible.  I may take a shot on him if he falls because I think these guys will be playing catchup the entire season based on the talent they have been adding.

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23 hours ago, BrianM said:

 

Personally I see his ceiling as a repeat of 2016, with his floor being 2017- he can't do better than he did in '16 when they IMO peaked as an offense.     I thought last year was so bad that he's truly got some issue that's going to hinder him.    Beyond that, i'm a Gruden skeptic, which has me leaning towards the negative on Cooper.  

 

I am perhaps being TOO negative on him- time will tell, but ultimately, this thread proves that people still like him enough to draft as a WR2.   Even a slight fade of Cooper would mean you wont get him cheap.  I've resigned myself to that fact- even if I decide i'm too harsh and bump him up a bit, he's not going to be on my team.  

Go WR heavy and try to get him as your 3rd option then. Most people will be drafting RB/RB or even RB/QB this year because the two podcasts they put on tell them to. If Cooper becomes the center of their offense and the raiders resemble 2016 without Michael Crabtree he could be a huge breakout. If he progresses even a little and you draft WR heavy, he's a good FLEX for you or replacement week WR2. I can't see a losing situation with drafting Amari unless you draft him as a WR1 and he flat out disappoints; but no one is saying he should be a WR1 at all. 

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19 minutes ago, CharlieWhitehurst said:

Go WR heavy and try to get him as your 3rd option then. Most people will be drafting RB/RB or even RB/QB this year because the two podcasts they put on tell them to. If Cooper becomes the center of their offense and the raiders resemble 2016 without Michael Crabtree he could be a huge breakout. If he progresses even a little and you draft WR heavy, he's a good FLEX for you or replacement week WR2. I can't see a losing situation with drafting Amari unless you draft him as a WR1 and he flat out disappoints; but no one is saying he should be a WR1 at all. 

 

I just dont get how you can completely write off last year.  This wasn't just an off year- he was downright awful.  Outside of his one big game, he was dropping single digit duds almost every week.    

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On 4/3/2018 at 8:22 AM, CharlieWhitehurst said:

 

AB

Nuk

OBJ

Allen

Julio

Adams

Thomas

AJG

Baldwin

Evans

T.Y.

Cooper

D. Thomas

Diggs

Thielen

A Rob

Fitz

Alshon

Cooks

M. Jones

Garcon

Gordon

Tate

Fuller

Woods

Watkins

JuJu

Landry

Crabtree

Sanders

 

 

 

Not a bad list.  I’d consider him after Cooks.  Not because he’s a good receiver, but because of volume...

 

If I draft him, I’ll be hold my nose shut when doing so...

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1 hour ago, BrianM said:

 

I just dont get how you can completely write off last year.  This wasn't just an off year- he was downright awful.  Outside of his one big game, he was dropping single digit duds almost every week.    

Raiders offensive identity was completely out of wack last year. I'm not completely forgetting about last season, but a-lot has changed. I think Cooper will get tons of more targets this year and I think Gruden is a better coach. I also think since they are in a tough division they will be down a lot this season, hence throwing the ball more. I can't see them throwing the ball to Marshawn that much on dump-offs. Crabtree is gone. Cook is mediocre. Volume alone I see his numbers rise. 

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20 hours ago, CharlieWhitehurst said:

Raiders offensive identity was completely out of wack last year. I'm not completely forgetting about last season, but a-lot has changed. I think Cooper will get tons of more targets this year and I think Gruden is a better coach. I also think since they are in a tough division they will be down a lot this season, hence throwing the ball more. I can't see them throwing the ball to Marshawn that much on dump-offs. Crabtree is gone. Cook is mediocre. Volume alone I see his numbers rise. 

 

5 drops on less than 100 targets is downright awful. Even if Cooper lands in the Top 10 for targets (140+), he'll still have to 1) catch the ball, and 2) do something after the catch. Cooper has talent, but last year is proof that he's under some kind of witchcraft, and until an exorcism removes the spell old man Jordy might be a better bet.

 

That said, Cooper's performance was so bad last year I imagine that there will not be a hype train and he'll sell low. Look for reports in July and August to see if and how he's been working on his hands.

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1 hour ago, cohenstantinople said:

 

5 drops on less than 100 targets is downright awful. Even if Cooper lands in the Top 10 for targets (140+), he'll still have to 1) catch the ball, and 2) do something after the catch. Cooper has talent, but last year is proof that he's under some kind of witchcraft, and until an exorcism removes the spell old man Jordy might be a better bet.

 

That said, Cooper's performance was so bad last year I imagine that there will not be a hype train and he'll sell low. Look for reports in July and August to see if and how he's been working on his hands.

 

There will be a hype train. All he has to do is blowup on a preseason series or two and it will be full steam ahead. Gruden has been hyping the heck out of him ever since he became HC. 

 

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23 hours ago, seanismorris said:

Not a bad list.  I’d consider him after Cooks.  Not because he’s a good receiver, but because of volume...

 

If I draft him, I’ll be hold my nose shut when doing so...

 

 

 i will roster any wr1 until they show me they really suck. . 

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On 4/5/2018 at 8:33 AM, cohenstantinople said:

 

5 drops on less than 100 targets is downright awful. Even if Cooper lands in the Top 10 for targets (140+), he'll still have to 1) catch the ball, and 2) do something after the catch. Cooper has talent, but last year is proof that he's under some kind of witchcraft, and until an exorcism removes the spell old man Jordy might be a better bet.

 

That said, Cooper's performance was so bad last year I imagine that there will not be a hype train and he'll sell low. Look for reports in July and August to see if and how he's been working on his hands.

He can drop balls every year if he sucks that bad. I don't care about that. I care about increased volume, which means more receptions and if he becomes a RZ threat, that increases his value as well. His ADP might put him in the 40-45th range. You're crazy not to take a chance on him there. And like I said, I would never roster him without at least having a minimum of 2 WRS before drafting him. He's a very high flier, but I would never give him a permanent slot as of the beginning of the season.

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3 minutes ago, CharlieWhitehurst said:

He can drop balls every year if he sucks that bad. I don't care about that. I care about increased volume, which means more receptions and if he becomes a RZ threat, that increases his value as well. His ADP might put him in the 40-45th range. You're crazy not to take a chance on him there. And like I said, I would never roster him without at least having a minimum of 2 WRS before drafting him. He's a very high flier, but I would never give him a permanent slot as of the beginning of the season.

 

I expect we'll see Cooper go in Round 3, picks 25 to 36. But like I said, July and August will tell a lot: if we don't hear reports on Cooper's hands, on improvement, on anything positive, why would 1) we not expect the same bumbling, and 2) why would Carr throw to him? I do expect improvement, because the kid is talented, maybe just needs a guru / mentor. It'll be interesting to see how Jordy plays out in this: are you suggesting that Cooper will be at 40-45 (which he most likely will not come August) and Jordy will be higher or lower?

 

If you go zero-RB, picking two solid WRs to start, and then landing Cooper as your third, you could definitely do worse. I mean, Cooper can't be worse than last year.

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On 4/4/2018 at 9:17 AM, CharlieWhitehurst said:

Raiders offensive identity was completely out of wack last year. I'm not completely forgetting about last season, but a-lot has changed. I think Cooper will get tons of more targets this year and I think Gruden is a better coach. I also think since they are in a tough division they will be down a lot this season, hence throwing the ball more. I can't see them throwing the ball to Marshawn that much on dump-offs. Crabtree is gone. Cook is mediocre. Volume alone I see his numbers rise. 

 

I come to this discussion as a Cooper skeptic (I've owned him twice), but your consistent, courteous and credible pitch is beginning to sound like the voice of reason here.  At one time, I was of a mind that Adams would never amount to much, and even I have to admit that Cooper is more talented overall than Adams.

 

Finally, amidst all my frustration over Cooper, I have always believed that he is a player who is committed to doing whatever he can to get better.  With young players, commitment to the game is what makes the difference more often than not.  Maybe he'll fail to improve in the end, but it won't be for lack of effort.  That much I know.

 

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