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Kawhi Leonard 2018-19 Season Thread

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16 minutes ago, My Dinner With Andre said:

I still can't wrap my head around Kawhi being, I suppose you could say, a prima donna and demanding all these things.

 

Didn't Pop joke Kawhi never spoke!?!

It’s the most mind boggling thing. It just seems like he has some family members that really deserved to be punched in the face. 

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Aldridge also wanted to be traded, then he spoke to Pop. Next thing we know he is still in S.A. and made all-new team.  I would wait after Pop-Kawhi meeting before starting to speculate where he will land next .

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On 6/15/2018 at 5:23 PM, Gohawks said:

It’s the most mind boggling thing. It just seems like he has some family members that really deserved to be punched in the face. 

I think it is his uncle that is the one getting involved and trying to manage/handle Kawhi's career. 

 

On 6/15/2018 at 5:38 PM, Gile Pile said:

Aldridge also wanted to be traded, then he spoke to Pop. Next thing we know he is still in S.A. and made all-new team.  I would wait after Pop-Kawhi meeting before starting to speculate where he will land next .

This is a very different situation. LMA didn't have a handler and he is his own man. Pop and LMA talked person to person, but Pop pitched LMA to join the Spurs as a free agent. I bet that conversation referenced a lot of expectations based on the FA pitch.  

Pop needs to speak with Kawhi and his uncle. Kawhi still has the "grass is greener" thing going on since he has only played for the Spurs. If this was Kawhi and Pop I think Kawhi could stay with the Spurs. But, you add a crazy uncle to the mix and now it is a relationship beyond repair. 

 

This reminds me a little bit of DRose. Quiet guy that likes to compete. Gets injured. Has some crazy family talking in his ear. Next thing DRose thinks he is a mogel or businessman. Would it really be surprising if Kawhi came out and said something like this...

 

“But I think a lot of people don’t understand that when I sit out, it’s not because of this year. I’m thinking about long term. I’m thinking about after I’m done with basketball, having graduations to go to, having meetings to go to....I don’t want to be in my meetings all sore or be at my son’s graduation all sore just because of something I did in the past.’'

 

So strange to see the Spurs in this situation where a diva is holding them hostage. Pop is nearing the end of his career. There will be drastic changes in SA and it probably shouldn't be surprising. Hate seeing the diva be Kawhi, but I am really interested to see how the Spurs navigate this. 

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I think if Kawhi is leaving, he will be traded to the  eastern  conference.   No way Spurs trade him to Lakers and create another super team to compete with.     I still remember how  upset Pop was when Memphis traded Gasol to  Lakers.

My guess  is that Kawhi will be playing for Celtics next year

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On 6/15/2018 at 6:06 PM, My Dinner With Andre said:

I still can't wrap my head around Kawhi being, I suppose you could say, a prima donna and demanding all these things.

 

Didn't Pop joke Kawhi never spoke!?!

 

Gotta an Uncle Drew problem..... It's sad.  Probably also has Klutch Sports in his Uncle's ear too.....

 

10 hours ago, Nene said:

why not just make it a new 2018-2019 thread?

 

Good idea.  Done.

 

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6 hours ago, Gile Pile said:

I think if Kawhi is leaving, he will be traded to the  eastern  conference.   No way Spurs trade him to Lakers and create another super team to compete with.     I still remember how  upset Pop was when Memphis traded Gasol to  Lakers.

My guess  is that Kawhi will be playing for Celtics next year

 

Yes. I would love to see the Lakers get everyone and challenge the Warriors, but I can't see the Spurs setting up the Lakers so nicely. 

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1 hour ago, Alexcot said:

Мне нравится смотреть баскетбольные матчи, вы можете делать ставки на свою любимую команду в этом сервисе     https://1xbit.com/en/line/Basketball/

 

 

Stop messing with us Vlad :lol:

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On 6/19/2018 at 6:20 PM, brockpapersizer said:

 

Yes. I would love to see the Lakers get everyone and challenge the Warriors, but I can't see the Spurs setting up the Lakers so nicely. 

Agree for the most part. The Spurs will act in their best interests. Unfortunately, Kawhi and his handlers could sabotage his trade value by saying he will only sign with the Laker. If the Lakers need to purge everyone in a deal for Kawhi to create max cap space then it might be in the Spurs best interest to trade with the Lakers. Personally, I would love to see Kawhi get dealt to Boston or any team except the Lakers, hit free agency, and sacrifice tens of millions of dollars to sign a max deal with the Lakers. If the Lakers have the best offer the only reason the Spurs wouldn't do the deal is because of ego and the Spurs don't seem to let ego get in the way of conducting their busuiness.

 

Even if the Lakers get Lebron, Kawhi, and PG I would make the Warriors the favorites. In theory, that trio plus Lonzo and a 5 can switch most things, but they need a rim protector that can also participate on offense. Until a super team has the equivalent of Draymond Green they will all come up short versus the Warriors in the playoffs. The Warriors are just so unique in that their big 4 can all space to 3 and they don't require the ball. And they have Green that is willing to defend anyone and contest shots in the paint in the postseason. The Warriors are perfectly assembled as skilled players that can all thrive while sharing the ball.   

 

Lebron requires the ball. PG dipped in OKC without being able to handle the ball as much. Kawhi doesn't need the ball so he is a nice fit. Teams will funnel shots to Lonzo and that just won't be good. And the Warriors could reload with better players and could have better health next year. 

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1 hour ago, thezing1 said:

PG dipped in OKC without being able to handle the ball as much.

I’d say he dipped because he played with WB.

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4 hours ago, thezing1 said:

Agree for the most part. The Spurs will act in their best interests. Unfortunately, Kawhi and his handlers could sabotage his trade value by saying he will only sign with the Laker. If the Lakers need to purge everyone in a deal for Kawhi to create max cap space then it might be in the Spurs best interest to trade with the Lakers. Personally, I would love to see Kawhi get dealt to Boston or any team except the Lakers, hit free agency, and sacrifice tens of millions of dollars to sign a max deal with the Lakers. If the Lakers have the best offer the only reason the Spurs wouldn't do the deal is because of ego and the Spurs don't seem to let ego get in the way of conducting their busuiness.

 

Even if the Lakers get Lebron, Kawhi, and PG I would make the Warriors the favorites. In theory, that trio plus Lonzo and a 5 can switch most things, but they need a rim protector that can also participate on offense. Until a super team has the equivalent of Draymond Green they will all come up short versus the Warriors in the playoffs. The Warriors are just so unique in that their big 4 can all space to 3 and they don't require the ball. And they have Green that is willing to defend anyone and contest shots in the paint in the postseason. The Warriors are perfectly assembled as skilled players that can all thrive while sharing the ball.   

 

Lebron requires the ball. PG dipped in OKC without being able to handle the ball as much. Kawhi doesn't need the ball so he is a nice fit. Teams will funnel shots to Lonzo and that just won't be good. And the Warriors could reload with better players and could have better health next year. 

 

The issue is the Lakers may need Kawhi to get Lebron and Lebron may need Kawhi to go to the Lakers.  So what happens first?  Does Lebron grab PG (still up in the air) and head to LA without a guarantee the Lakers can woo Kawhi away or does he wait until they've completed a deal and then comes along?  The former is probably more likely if Lebron really wants to recruit his next super team in LA.  He gets a confirm from PG and hopes the Lakers can come through on Kawhi.  If the Lakers can't get the Spurs to come around within the FA period required, then they make another trade for another disgruntled superstar (maybe like a Jimmy Butler) and move along. 

 

If that's the case, then Kawhi can't go to the Lakers in the fall of 2019, there would be no more money unless he's willing to sign the MLE b/c presumably the Lakers would have Lebron (~36 million), George (~31 million) and the third guy (Butler for this example) armed with an extension for another maxish contract (~30 million) and be maxed out.  I guess Kawhi could go to the Clippers at that point but besides cap space, what do the Clippers have?  DJA is probably gone and Harris is a good player but probably not the superstar he's looking for and certainly not a threat to the powers in the West. 

 

So what happens if Lebron wants to operate with the latter and won't come to LA unless the Lakers secure a trade for Leonard?  What if the Spurs don't like the offer from the Lakers?  Does Lebron transition to plan B, which may be stay in Cleveland or go to say Philly, if he can't get Leonard?  Is PG enough for him to go plus the promise the Lakers will get that 3rd option he historically has always wanted to move, whomever that may be???  There's so many moving parts but in some ways, if the Lakers want Lebron and Kawhi wants to be a part of the team, the Lakers will have to not only offer the best package but possibly assemble assets they don't even have right now.... Also, they have a month to get all this done.  I'm of the opinion Lebron wants LA, but I have no idea what his demands are for personnel in place.  Everything in his history says he wants two other win now stars, not young players who are still developing....

 

FTR, I think Kawhi eventually gets moved, I simply don't know if the Lakers will have enough to get it done..... Philly may be a better destination.  Heck, if I'm Lebron and want the better road to the Finals, I probably look at Boston or Philly, but I think he wants LA with staying in Cleveland a weak plan C.

 

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13 hours ago, Gohawks said:

I’d say he dipped because he played with WB.

I think we are saying the same thing....WB just has the ball all the time. The only time PG got to facilitate/create was when WB was on the bench. 

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10 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

 

 

Interesting....just deleted your post so it wouldn't be half a page long.

 

I wrote this article for Nylon Calculus that looked at the road to the finals a couple years ago. Lebron had like 5 of the top 10 easiest road to the finals in the last 20ish years. I forget the details, but I will try to find the link if interested. Anyway, if Lebron is actually looking to win championships then I agree 100% that he stays in the East. If he wants an easy path to a superteam that locks him in with guys that will be in their late 20's into their 30's then it is probably LA. 

 

I understand his wish for 3 superstars. But that is where I think these superteams are missing the mark. The Warriors have 2 superstars (KD, Steph) and 2 players that perform like superstars filling roles (Klay and Dray). Sounds weird calling Klay and Dray role players, but that is what they are. They don't dominate the ball and they just do what the team needs them to do. They don't have insane stats because they don't have insane usages. They defer to the superstars when need be and don't let that lessen their impact on the game. Lebron/PG/Butler really doesn't excite me too much. Butler needs the ball to create and draw fouls in the paint. Lebron needs the ball. PG needs to the ball to play at a superstar level. And whatever the 4 looks like these days, Lebron is going to have to play it a lot and that is something he hasn't really wanted to do in the past.  

 

I guess my point is kind of who cares about what the Lakers do and what Lebron does in the west? Putting together available superstars and creating the next superteam with Lebron and two other big names won't match up to what the Warriors have created. The Warriors implemented an offensive philosophy and paired "role" players with superstars perfectly. I just struggle to see that with Lebron who just wants to play with superstars. One of those superstars needs to be a stretch 4/5 that rim protects. A lot of people think of Lebron's second stint in Cleveland as this great achievement and really successful, but we all forget that it was a kick to the dick that allowed him to win a championship there. Without Draymond stepping over the line Lebron would be 0 for 4 to the Warriors. And if Duncan didn't miss a bunny they would have only had 1 in Miami. And I know that the Duncan reference is very unfair, but Lebron superteams haven't really been competitive at the highest levels. 

 

To bring this back to Kawhi....if he went to the Sixers I would be super high on that team. I feel like Kawhi could slide into that roster and have all the room to put up stats, soak up usage, grow to whatever he wants to be. And the Sixers wouldn't gut their roster trading the assets to acquire Kawhi. Hell, the Sixers just got an unprotected Miami Heat first round pick last night on a Miami Heat team that will have age working against it in a couple years. Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi, Reddick would be pretty interesting. Reddick as the spacer. Embiid as the stretch 5, rim protecting, do anything and everything the team needs. Simmons playing PG solves all of the positional issues. Full disclousure, Philly is my team. 

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48 minutes ago, thezing1 said:

Interesting....just deleted your post so it wouldn't be half a page long.

 

I wrote this article for Nylon Calculus that looked at the road to the finals a couple years ago. Lebron had like 5 of the top 10 easiest road to the finals in the last 20ish years. I forget the details, but I will try to find the link if interested. Anyway, if Lebron is actually looking to win championships then I agree 100% that he stays in the East. If he wants an easy path to a superteam that locks him in with guys that will be in their late 20's into their 30's then it is probably LA. 

 

I understand his wish for 3 superstars. But that is where I think these superteams are missing the mark. The Warriors have 2 superstars (KD, Steph) and 2 players that perform like superstars filling roles (Klay and Dray). Sounds weird calling Klay and Dray role players, but that is what they are. They don't dominate the ball and they just do what the team needs them to do. They don't have insane stats because they don't have insane usages. They defer to the superstars when need be and don't let that lessen their impact on the game. Lebron/PG/Butler really doesn't excite me too much. Butler needs the ball to create and draw fouls in the paint. Lebron needs the ball. PG needs to the ball to play at a superstar level. And whatever the 4 looks like these days, Lebron is going to have to play it a lot and that is something he hasn't really wanted to do in the past.  

 

I guess my point is kind of who cares about what the Lakers do and what Lebron does in the west? Putting together available superstars and creating the next superteam with Lebron and two other big names won't match up to what the Warriors have created. The Warriors implemented an offensive philosophy and paired "role" players with superstars perfectly. I just struggle to see that with Lebron who just wants to play with superstars. One of those superstars needs to be a stretch 4/5 that rim protects. A lot of people think of Lebron's second stint in Cleveland as this great achievement and really successful, but we all forget that it was a kick to the dick that allowed him to win a championship there. Without Draymond stepping over the line Lebron would be 0 for 4 to the Warriors. And if Duncan didn't miss a bunny they would have only had 1 in Miami. And I know that the Duncan reference is very unfair, but Lebron superteams haven't really been competitive at the highest levels. 

 

To bring this back to Kawhi....if he went to the Sixers I would be super high on that team. I feel like Kawhi could slide into that roster and have all the room to put up stats, soak up usage, grow to whatever he wants to be. And the Sixers wouldn't gut their roster trading the assets to acquire Kawhi. Hell, the Sixers just got an unprotected Miami Heat first round pick last night on a Miami Heat team that will have age working against it in a couple years. Simmons, Embiid, Kawhi, Reddick would be pretty interesting. Reddick as the spacer. Embiid as the stretch 5, rim protecting, do anything and everything the team needs. Simmons playing PG solves all of the positional issues. Full disclousure, Philly is my team. 

 

Is Redick going to stay?  I've read he wants 20 million per on a 3 year deal with no Bird rights, so you being a Philly guy, how would the Sixers acquire Kawhi?  How would they fit Lebron if he wanted to come onboard?  I loved the fit of Bridges on your current squad.  Smith, less so although he's a good prospect.  I get acquiring another asset but it's 3 years down the road and feel Bridges as a 3 and D fits so much better with the lack of shooting for the Sixers.  

 

As far as Lebron, he's actually never had a stretch 4 who defends the rim.  Bosh was excellent defensively but never a great rim protector.  Love doesn't protect anything except his beard.  Who could fit the definition for a stretch 4 who defends the rim?  Or maybe..... the Clippers make more sense with Harris, DJA and then trying to get a good guard to come and play with Lebron.... I think it's really interesting.  

 

Apparently the Lakers are complaining no one will trade with them.  They were trying to buy into the 2nd round last night and couldn't get a deal done..... 

 

Also the Spurs can't offer the Super max until July 16th, so this probably doesn't play out until then.....

 

 

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Redick is a contingency plan, if they can make their team better without him, they will

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Kahwi for Covington, Fultz and one of PHI's future #1 picks from another team (either 2019 protected or 2021 unprotected) - who says no to that deal?  PHI would also be in a position to sign another major FA (LeBron, PG, CP3)

 

Possible 2018-19 PHI Roster:

 

PG - Simmons, McConnel, Bayless

SG - Paul George, Zhaire, Luwawu

SF - Kahwi, JAnderson, Korkmaz

PF - Dario

C - Embiid, Holmes

 

Even with this roster, the team will still be in a position to add at least another impact FA (maybe 2).

 

PHI needs to cash in some of their chips at some point and this offseason is as good a time for them as any.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, J.T. Marlin said:

Kahwi for Covington, Fultz and one of PHI's future #1 picks from another team (either 2019 protected or 2021 unprotected) - who says no to that deal?  PHI would also be in a position to sign another major FA (LeBron, PG, CP3)

 

Possible 2018-19 PHI Roster:

 

PG - Simmons, McConnel, Bayless

SG - Paul George, Zhaire, Luwawu

SF - Kahwi, JAnderson, Korkmaz

PF - Dario

C - Embiid, Holmes

 

Even with this roster, the team will still be in a position to add at least another impact FA (maybe 2).

 

PHI needs to cash in some of their chips at some point and this offseason is as good a time for them as any.

 

 

 

The Spurs will say no..... You'll have to increase the offer.

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Why are people assuming the Spurs have any bargaining power lol. Sixers aren't giving that up for a rental whose camp has made it clear he wants to be a Laker. 

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2 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

 

The Spurs will say no..... You'll have to increase the offer.

 

I'm not so sure.  The Bulls trade of Jimmy B was in the same range.  PHI is obviously not including Embiid or Simmons and would be foolish to include Dario.  I think both of those players (Fultz/Covington) + both of their future 1st rd picks (2019 SAC/MEM pick & 2021 MIA pick) could get the deal done or replace one of the #1's with Zhaire.  Would think that the Spurs would be much more motivated to move him to the East (PHI or BOS) vs. a team in the West.  They have to get something for him otherwise it's going to be another miserable year in SA and Kahwi will bolt for free in 2019.

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2 hours ago, J.T. Marlin said:

 

I'm not so sure.  The Bulls trade of Jimmy B was in the same range.  PHI is obviously not including Embiid or Simmons and would be foolish to include Dario.  I think both of those players (Fultz/Covington) + both of their future 1st rd picks (2019 SAC/MEM pick & 2021 MIA pick) could get the deal done or replace one of the #1's with Zhaire.  Would think that the Spurs would be much more motivated to move him to the East (PHI or BOS) vs. a team in the West.  They have to get something for him otherwise it's going to be another miserable year in SA and Kahwi will bolt for free in 2019.

 

1.  You were quick to add in both draft picks instead of either so even you were probably not confident your opening offer would get it done.  

 

2.  Building an offer around a kid who's barely played with a broken jump shot and wing , when the Spurs already have a PG who can't shoot is bold.  Not sure that's better than a Lakers rumored offer of Kuzma, Ingram, Wagner and a first round pick or two for Kawhi and Pau/Mills.  Guess it depends on how you look at the players but the unprotected is in 3 years.  It's nice to have but it's very far away and your protected 2019 pick is probably going to be in the late 20's.  I'm going to guess no deal gets done unless Saric is in the deal.... idk.  I'll guess we'll see but I don't expect a trade until mid July earliest.  Also a guess.

 

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29 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

 

1.  You were quick to add in both draft picks instead of either so even you were probably not confident your opening offer would get it done.  

 

2.  Building an offer around a kid who's barely played with a broken jump shot and wing , when the Spurs already have a PG who can't shoot is bold.  Not sure that's better than a Lakers rumored offer of Kuzma, Ingram, Wagner and a first round pick or two for Kawhi and Pau/Mills.  Guess it depends on how you look at the players but the unprotected is in 3 years.  It's nice to have but it's very far away and your protected 2019 pick is probably going to be in the late 20's.  I'm going to guess no deal gets done unless Saric is in the deal.... idk.  I'll guess we'll see but I don't expect a trade until mid July earliest.  Also a guess.

 

Fultz isn't even playing in Summer League because he . . . can't. His trade value is absolute zero right now. Can he really be included in serious offers for Kawhi?

Edited by Kaboom

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3 hours ago, Kaboom said:

Fultz isn't even playing in Summer League because he . . . can't. His trade value is absolute zero right now. Can he really be included in serious offers for Kawhi?

That cuts both ways. Fultz is working with a shooting coach and trainer that is becoming quite popular. Would the Sixers really want to sell him at a deep discount? The guy triple doubled last year without a jumper. He has talent. 

 

In the case of the Spurs, Fultz would have zero value to them. They already have a point. They need wings and bigs. I would instantly include Saric in any deal for Kawhi. Saric is a really nice player, but he is replaceable. Obviously, his contract is nice, but you have to deal something to get Kawhi. Lord Covington would probably be included to backfill the 3 for the Spurs. And a pick. And this is for a rental in Kawhi. Rentals don't get you much when they are sabotaging their team. Salaries would be included to offset. 

 

I don't really enjoy this type of speculation. For all we know the Spurs are content playing it out and seeing if Kawhi would really sacrifice tens of millions of dollars next year. 

10 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

 

Is Redick going to stay?  I've read he wants 20 million per on a 3 year deal with no Bird rights, so you being a Philly guy, how would the Sixers acquire Kawhi?  How would they fit Lebron if he wanted to come onboard?  I loved the fit of Bridges on your current squad.  Smith, less so although he's a good prospect.  I get acquiring another asset but it's 3 years down the road and feel Bridges as a 3 and D fits so much better with the lack of shooting for the Sixers.  

 

As far as Lebron, he's actually never had a stretch 4 who defends the rim.  Bosh was excellent defensively but never a great rim protector.  Love doesn't protect anything except his beard.  Who could fit the definition for a stretch 4 who defends the rim?  Or maybe..... the Clippers make more sense with Harris, DJA and then trying to get a good guard to come and play with Lebron.... I think it's really interesting.  

 

Apparently the Lakers are complaining no one will trade with them.  They were trying to buy into the 2nd round last night and couldn't get a deal done..... 

 

Also the Spurs can't offer the Super max until July 16th, so this probably doesn't play out until then.....

 

 

Lebron isn't really a great fit with Philly's current roster. Simmons would get really hurt playing with Lebron. I would deal Saric, Lord, and a pick as the base and include salary to make it work. I would be fine with dealing Saric. Obviously, I would want to resign Kawhi, but if the rental cost me Saric to upgrade Covington to Kawhi I would do that immediately. Reddick would still be key to resign for spacing. Reddick can say he wants 20 mil a year, but no one is coming close to that. Philly overpaid him last year because they had the money to spend. 

 

I think Lebron on the Clippers is intriguing, although I think DJ is a really difficult player to win a championship with since he cant hit FTs. Harris is a great player to pair with Lebron. 80% of the roster needs to be purged, but Tobias, DJ, Lebron isn't bad. Add PG to that mix and they might be cooking with gas....but they are still playing for second place in the West. 

 

No one should trade at market value with the Lakers. When a team commits to turning their roster to get max space available teams should exploit that pursuit as they near it. It is like a developer assembling lots. The first few are done at market value. If word gets out that they are trying to assemble a bunch of parcels the remaining properties are going to get paid WAY more than market value because their parcel is worth way more than market value to the developer. Same idea with the Lakers. If they wanted a second round pick I would ask for a protected first in return. And if they said no I would tell them to come back when they wanted that deal. Trading seconds to help a team superfy is pointless unless you get paid for it. Getting a protected first would be the only thing I would offer to help another team like the Lakers at this point in their journey to clear max space. 

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