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2019 League Settings Discussion

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2 hours ago, BackyardBaseball said:

Wanna hear some suggestions on 5x5 categories for roto in a dynasty league of mine.  Going into our 7th year and I feel like a change is going to be inevitable with how pitchers are being managed in the MLB.  The introduction of the "opener" along with the "fire-man" role having the best relievers stay away from the 9th inning.

 

Current league is pretty standard, R, RBI, HR, SB, OBP x W, S, Whip, ERA, K

 

We just switched to OBP and I think I'm good with the hitting categories, no reason to change things there.  What I am struggling with now is both Saves and Wins.  

 

Options I know of:

Saves+Holds

Savesx2 + Holds

Quality Starts

 

None of these are really what I'm looking for.  I think quality starts really kill some starting pitchers that may not deserve it and the whole saves and holds category in general is a bit of a crap shoot past the top few guys.

 

Are there any other pitching metrics people use that encapsulate something like a "quality outing" or just a "good relief appearance" i have no idea, but definitely feel like we need something better than whats out there.

 

 

I play in a league where we have QS over wins and I prefer it that way.  It, IMO, puts the outcome on the pitcher.  deGrom, for example, would have been completely hosed last year in a wins league vs QS league.  I just don't like to feel like the offense has to aid in my pitching category.  

 

Also, we are moving from saves to saves+holds.  Haven't tried it before so I can't personally comment, but from what I have read I think people like the added holds, especially with the way the game is going with closer by committees and such.  

 

Just my .02 on everything.

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I need HELP with my ROTO settings.

I need to put a MAX IP for Pitchers but I don't know what to put:

On Yahoo 12 team standards, you have 2 SP, 2 RP, 4 P, 5 B, Yahoo uses 1400 IP limit

In my league I'm creating I've upped the rosters to: 10 P, 7 Bench, I'm using 1800 IP limit

Is this correct? I figured I added 2 more P slots and 2 more B slots so I should increase the IP limit. IS this too much or too little? 

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2 minutes ago, CrypTviLL said:

I need HELP with my ROTO settings.

I need to put a MAX IP for Pitchers but I don't know what to put:

On Yahoo 12 team standards, you have 2 SP, 2 RP, 4 P, 5 B, Yahoo uses 1400 IP limit

In my league I'm creating I've upped the rosters to: 10 P, 7 Bench, I'm using 1800 IP limit

Is this correct? I figured I added 2 more P slots and 2 more B slots so I should increase the IP limit. IS this too much or too little? 

We have 10 at 1550. No one is going to be able to reach 1800 unless they go no RPs.

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2 hours ago, CrypTviLL said:

I need HELP with my ROTO settings.

I need to put a MAX IP for Pitchers but I don't know what to put:

On Yahoo 12 team standards, you have 2 SP, 2 RP, 4 P, 5 B, Yahoo uses 1400 IP limit

In my league I'm creating I've upped the rosters to: 10 P, 7 Bench, I'm using 1800 IP limit

Is this correct? I figured I added 2 more P slots and 2 more B slots so I should increase the IP limit. IS this too much or too little? 

 

2 hours ago, duke of queens said:

We have 10 at 1550. No one is going to be able to reach 1800 unless they go no RPs.

in our points league we have 4 SP, 5 RP, and 1 P (with 5 bench spots) and a max limit of 2000 IP. we also have max moves of 50 per season and i reach the 2000 IP limit every year. typically my bench is split in the middle 2-3 bats and 2-3 pitchers.

imo, 1800 is fine, but i wouldn't be surprised to see some folks hit the limit or come close.

weekly or daily lineups?

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1 hour ago, osb_tensor said:

 

in our points league we have 4 SP, 5 RP, and 1 P (with 5 bench spots) and a max limit of 2000 IP. we also have max moves of 50 per season and i reach the 2000 IP limit every year. typically my bench is split in the middle 2-3 bats and 2-3 pitchers.

imo, 1800 is fine, but i wouldn't be surprised to see some folks hit the limit or come close.

weekly or daily lineups?

Daily with no moves limit. But its a keeper league so less turnover on streaming. say if you had 7 starters averaging 180 IP. The 5 RPs are going to cover the other 540 IP?

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8 minutes ago, duke of queens said:

Daily with no moves limit. But its a keeper league so less turnover on streaming. say if you had 7 starters averaging 180 IP. The 5 RPs are going to cover the other 540 IP?

streaming (even in limited capacity), SPs with RP eligibility, and hybrid guys like lugo, etc. who might get 80-100+ IP out of the pen with a few starts sprinkled in.

easily attainable to reach the IP threshold.

 

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3 minutes ago, osb_tensor said:

streaming (even in limited capacity), SPs with RP eligibility, and hybrid guys like lugo, etc. who might get 80-100+ IP out of the pen with a few starts sprinkled in.

easily attainable to reach the IP threshold.

 

Why would you have more RP slots than SP slots?

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59 minutes ago, duke of queens said:

Why would you have more RP slots than SP slots?

the OP's question was about an 1800 IP limit in conjunction with having 10 generic P slots. we use 10 total pitcher slots in our league and reaching 2000 IP has been accomplished several times, so reaching 1800 IP is certainly possible in OP's scenario. that's the information i was trying to convey. 

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4 minutes ago, osb_tensor said:

the OP's question was about an 1800 IP limit in conjunction with having 10 generic P slots. we use 10 total pitcher slots in our league and reaching 2000 IP has been accomplished several times, so reaching 1800 IP is certainly possible in OP's scenario. that's the information i was trying to convey. 

Gotcha, I was just trying to figure out how that was possible to get there with limited moves and everyone else trying to get to that limit. To get 180-200 innings out of each slot seems almost impossible. There are only so many SPs(or RPs with SP elig) to go around and be worth adding, especially in Roto.

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1 hour ago, duke of queens said:

Gotcha, I was just trying to figure out how that was possible to get there with limited moves and everyone else trying to get to that limit. To get 180-200 innings out of each slot seems almost impossible. There are only so many SPs(or RPs with SP elig) to go around and be worth adding, especially in Roto.

touche with regard to the roto part. crappy pitchers probably won't be desirable in OP's league, even as streamers, due to ratios being affected. it might be harder to reach the IP limit.

Edited by osb_tensor

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10 hours ago, duke of queens said:

We have 10 at 1550. No one is going to be able to reach 1800 unless they go no RPs.

Not necessarily true. One of my leagues has a 1600 ip cap with 8 active pitchers, and we have guys max out regularly. Daily roto league with no limits on transactions. 

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On 2/12/2019 at 3:31 PM, BackyardBaseball said:

Wanna hear some suggestions on 5x5 categories for roto in a dynasty league of mine.  Going into our 7th year and I feel like a change is going to be inevitable with how pitchers are being managed in the MLB.  The introduction of the "opener" along with the "fire-man" role having the best relievers stay away from the 9th inning.

 

Current league is pretty standard, R, RBI, HR, SB, OBP x W, S, Whip, ERA, K

 

We just switched to OBP and I think I'm good with the hitting categories, no reason to change things there.  What I am struggling with now is both Saves and Wins.  

 

Options I know of:

Saves+Holds

Savesx2 + Holds

Quality Starts

 

None of these are really what I'm looking for.  I think quality starts really kill some starting pitchers that may not deserve it and the whole saves and holds category in general is a bit of a crap shoot past the top few guys.

 

Are there any other pitching metrics people use that encapsulate something like a "quality outing" or just a "good relief appearance" i have no idea, but definitely feel like we need something better than whats out there.

 

This almost needs it’s own thread. In a roto league, what categories do you use to make any RP’s worth bidding on? I’ve never been a big spender on saves, but even teams that do are going to start spending money elsewhere. Adding holds to saves(even Sx2+holds) gives me even more incentive to spend on high K middle relievers, and there’s too many of them to justify spending any amount of money on them. 

 

In my NL only league top RP used to go $20-$25, and I don’t see anyone going close to that this year with them progressively getting cheaper. 

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Kicking around some ideas.... in standard roto would era/whip/k/w+s/something else, help revalue closers? Maybe the “something else” being a category that also boosts closers value. K/9 or BB’s, not really sure what the fifth category would be. 

 

Cant find an auction calculator to support it, so I can run the results. 

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For a redraft roto league what are the BEST scoring categories in your opinion?

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1 hour ago, CrypTviLL said:

For a redraft roto league what are the BEST scoring categories in your opinion?

I like the standard 5x5 

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Right now I have a 6x6. R/HR/RBI/SB/OBP/SLG and W/S/K/ERA/WHIP/(K/9)

 

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Last year in my league I ha QS over W's as a stat.This year I think I'm going back to Wins.

Both stats are problematic. With wins, RP gain some extra value for vulture wins and it is a more common statistic as opposed to QS. However, pitchers get rewarded for giving up 7 runs but their team piling on 20. Then you have situations like DeGrom where he pitches perfect and gets so little wins. Bogus.

With QS, RP no longer get any vulture stat which hurts them and puts more of an emphasis on SP, but it's still a pretty cheap stat. A pitcher needs to go at least 6 innings which is rare these days and give up less than 3 earned runs. 

I just find that QS's are hard to chase after, I mean how many times did I have a starter who was doing great only to get pulled out of the 5th inning? 

I feel there's very little strategy to QS while with W's you can focus some strategy on RP's. 

So, WINS > Quality Starts

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One more pet peeve of mine is the HOLDS category.

As soon as you put HOLDS into your league two things happen:

1) Closers become greatly down valued as why in the hell would I pay $15+ for an elite closer when I can grab 5 MRP's for $5 who will win me holds.

2) The stat becomes a crapshoot with every RP being capable of providing holds. They flood the market and it becomes a luck-based stat.

What I mean by point 2 is that there are so many relievers and if you are in a 12 or 14 team league, that means you wait until the end of the draft, choose your group of 3 or 4 of them for $3-$4 and now you have a shot at winning holds, but so does your opponent. It's just luck.

I'm all behind finding a way to get value out of the Middle relief position... it's a lost art in fantasy baseball. However, holds is not it.

Now, a better future statistic might involve something like a combined Saves and holds category which awards like 3 points for a Save and 1 point for a hold. This ensures that CP still remain elite while the very best MRPs become more important. Still... it doesn't stop someone from completely ignoring holds and loading their team up elsewhere. 

I'm not sure what the best solution is, but I can tell you that I run away from leagues that have HOLDS as a category. 

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@CrypTviLLcaptures my feelings on QS and HLD well. Good ideas on paper that don't hold up well in practice.

My go-to format is 5x5 with OBP in place of AVG. I could see the argument for TB instead of HR, but that's a hard sell. There's no 6th category on either the hitting or pitching side that adds enough value to be worth the hassle. So SB and SV are overvalued from a pure sabermetric perspective. That's part of the appeal for me. 

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Wondering opinions on this:

If there was a NET Saves + Holds category that: Awarded 3 points for a Save, and 1 point or a Hold.

Would that work? In my mind, a team would ideally want closers, but if they all were going too high in price, you could theoretically get by with using some of your roster space for MRP's. I would think it keeps the closers valued at their appropriate price while making MRP an interesting add on.

Just throwing it out there.

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On YAHOO, I'm in a Head to Head POINTS league.

When I look at the match up for the first week, there is a bar that has 'Games Played' on it. For my roster settings it has 291 total games. What does this mean?? Is this tracking how many games are played amongst my players in a given week and won't allow me to cross it? How does it work?

 

Thanks

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Posted (edited)
40 minutes ago, CrypTviLL said:

On YAHOO, I'm in a Head to Head POINTS league.

When I look at the match up for the first week, there is a bar that has 'Games Played' on it. For my roster settings it has 291 total games. What does this mean?? Is this tracking how many games are played amongst my players in a given week and won't allow me to cross it? How does it work?

 

Thanks

 

It's just telling you how many games your players will play. It has nothing to do with limits. It is for information purposes only.

Edited by Grinner
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I'm very interested in league setups, I love how altering the smallest things can lead to a change in balance. I also find beauty in creating leagues that try to eliminate luck as much as possible. 

I think the highest LUCK-based leagues are standard, shallow 10 or 12 team H2H leagues where the playoffs end up at the end of the year. It's got to be near 90% luck to finish first place in these leagues. 

Here is the league set up that I think might be the most skill-based.

Deeper, Roto Weekly leagues (note: Why weekly? Forces you to make decisions based on your team. Do you sit player A to start player B based on schedule? etc., do you want to play 2 starts worth of pitcher C while or 1-start of the better pitcher B? etc.)

Settings (these are extremely important): 6x6, R/RBI/HR/Net SB/OBP/SLG 

Note, Average is completely outdated by OBP. It's pretty horrid that the standard is Average... OBP NEEDS to replace average, interesting to hear any dissenting opinions on this, but I don't see how you can ignore walks here. SLG percentage I think is a nice add on for the 6x6, but I can see arguments being made that one can do away with it. I choose net SB for roto as I think it adds a fun wrinkle to it for the year and obviously it's important in real life fantasy baseball.

For pitchers: W/K/ERA/WHIP/ Net Saves / K per BB

Screw QS (I've already talked about that), Net Saves for the same reason I have Net SB, it is important in real life and adds fun following it in fantasy. The 6th pitching category to add is very very difficult.

K per BB is likely the next best category (at least on Y! settings). K per 9 hurts pitchers who don't k people unfairly, but K per BB does a bit better of a job of judging skill as if a pitcher doesn't K people its OK as long as he doesn't walk people. 

 

Roster Settings: C, 1b, 2b, 3b, SS, CI, MI, OFx5, 9xP, 8xBench, 2xDL, 1xNA

29 total roster spots there I believe, NO UTILITY.

What do you think?

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