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Mike McCarthy 2018 Outlook

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tonycpsu

[Thread for previous season automatically locked. Feel free to post a new thread for 2019.]

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1 hour ago, Kyle87 said:

Long time Packer fan here and I always chuckle every time we lose a game and the talk of the town is "fire McCarthy", kinda feel bad for the guy. 

 

That being said I don't think McCarthy is a "bad" coach.  I think he's below average but not garbage like people always say.  That's what worries me most about a firing of him.  It's quite possible that we wind up with someone even worse, McVay's and Bellichek's don't just grow on trees.  Replacing McCarthy doesn't mean we'll wind up with something better, it's quite possible it would get worse.  McCarthy was there for the super-bowl, he was there for the 15-1 season, he's been there while the Pack dominated the NFC north for a long run.  It's hard when you are constantly winning and getting low draft picks to keep your roster talented enough to keep on winning.  Bellichek is the only coach that's made it work.  It's designed that way. 

 

Even the beloved McVay right now still has some real trials to over-come as he has to start dealing with cap-space and low draft picks over the next several years.  Gurley got paid, he's going to have to pay Goff soon.  It's a lot harder to win when you can't just sign every single elite FA on the market to your team.

 

Unfortunately though this is the exact mentality that's keeping McCarthy around garnering disappointing results for the Packers. You're certainly not wrong in that GB could end up with a worse candidate than McCarthy but I think at this point that's a gamble that needs to be strongly considered given that it's pretty clear what MM brings to the table as a coach and it seemingly just isn't working anymore.

 

McCarthy refuses to adapt to the modern NFL or use the players that he has to the best of their strengths, I think that is a bigger issue than what position the Packers draft in each year. The lack of Aaron Jones consistent involvement, relying on rookie WRs to create downfield separation rather than giving them more quick rhythm routes, not developing a true pass catching RB when all the best NFL teams right now heavily feature one, etc... And that's not even touching on poor clock management or the fear that he seemingly coaches with. 

 

I mentioned this in a player thread a week or two ago but Green Bay is so reliant on what worked for the passing game back in 2010/2011 that it's become their Achilles heel to an extent.. They were capable of running vanilla routes back then because when the play broke down Rodgers had a cast of pass catchers in which he had great chemistry with (Driver, Jennings, Jones, Finley, Nelson), that's not the case anymore yet they still aren't adjusting to that. 

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8 hours ago, Mackdaddy21 said:

You're giving the ball to a team with Russell Wilson behind the wheel who has just come from behind to take the lead. And there's 4 mins with 1 timeout left. Pretty much one first down and you're done. If you're lucky, 1 min left in the game but hard to stop Wilson in the 4th in Seattle. 

 

You act as if the Green Bay offense was setting the world on fire in the second half. Green Bay scored three whole points after HT. The Packers had 5 second half possessions and and went three and out on two of those possessions. Rodgers looked awful in the second half so to expect that he would just somehow magically turn it on could be possible, but most likely not. Seattle made 2nd half adjustments that worked. Point blank.

 

Again, with 4 minutes left and essentially two timeouts, it's a coin flip decision as to whether or not go for it. Sometimes, your defense and defensive unit needs to step up as well. Just like a few weeks ago, sometimes your special teams unit needs to step up as well and they didn't. The buck always starts and stops with the HC. That's what you sign up for, but can you really blame that on the HC?

 

And in regards to elevating players, yes that could come from a HC, but how about the QB elevating the skill players around him?

 

Looking at things bigger picture, I've always felt that GB has had holes everywhere and that's a HC AND GM issue. Maybe Brian Guntkunst can change that for you guys.

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2 hours ago, nonstopfan said:

 

You act as if the Green Bay offense was setting the world on fire in the second half. Green Bay scored three whole points after HT. The Packers had 5 second half possessions and and went three and out on two of those possessions. Rodgers looked awful in the second half so to expect that he would just somehow magically turn it on could be possible, but most likely not. Seattle made 2nd half adjustments that worked. Point blank.

 

Again, with 4 minutes left and essentially two timeouts, it's a coin flip decision as to whether or not go for it. Sometimes, your defense and defensive unit needs to step up as well. Just like a few weeks ago, sometimes your special teams unit needs to step up as well and they didn't. The buck always starts and stops with the HC. That's what you sign up for, but can you really blame that on the HC?

 

And in regards to elevating players, yes that could come from a HC, but how about the QB elevating the skill players around him?

 

Looking at things bigger picture, I've always felt that GB has had holes everywhere and that's a HC AND GM issue. Maybe Brian Guntkunst can change that for you guys.

 

Correction, they had 1 timeout (sure, two with the 2 minute warning) when they punted the ball but that's not enough with 4 mins left.

 

Agreed, their offense wasn't clicking as well as it was in the first half. But do we not know Wilson thrives on the 4th quarter, at home, especially his resume against the Packers. Just go for it! Just do it!

 

Hopefully, we clean up this mess and set some people straight.

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It's quite easy to tell the quality of a coach at half time. Making a game plan is one thing. However, the true difficulty comes from having to adjust and adapt and damn did McCarthy fail and he got utterly outclassed by Carroll. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Kyle87 said:

Long time Packer fan here and I always chuckle every time we lose a game and the talk of the town is "fire McCarthy", kinda feel bad for the guy. 

 

That being said I don't think McCarthy is a "bad" coach.  I think he's below average but not garbage like people always say.  That's what worries me most about a firing of him.  It's quite possible that we wind up with someone even worse, McVay's and Bellichek's don't just grow on trees.  Replacing McCarthy doesn't mean we'll wind up with something better, it's quite possible it would get worse.  McCarthy was there for the super-bowl, he was there for the 15-1 season, he's been there while the Pack dominated the NFC north for a long run.  It's hard when you are constantly winning and getting low draft picks to keep your roster talented enough to keep on winning.  Bellichek is the only coach that's made it work.  It's designed that way. 

 

Even the beloved McVay right now still has some real trials to over-come as he has to start dealing with cap-space and low draft picks over the next several years.  Gurley got paid, he's going to have to pay Goff soon.  It's a lot harder to win when you can't just sign every single elite FA on the market to your team.

Yes, great coaches do not grow on trees. However, McCarthy has been mediocre for a long time now and really not bringing anything to the table that suggests he is the right guy to bring this team where it needs to go.

If they move on from McCarthy, could the replacement be worse? Possibly. But something has to be done otherwise the Packers can continue to expect mediocrity.

 

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result.

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Can we give Rodgers a pass on poor leadership & vocal insubordination during losses?

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1 minute ago, psygolf said:

Can we give Rodgers a pass on poor leadership & vocal insubordination during losses?

 

Might as well, he gets a pass for everything else

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15 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

 

Might as well, he gets a pass for everything else

 

Well he is one of the best passers of all time...so he should get a pass as he completed so many to other guys. 

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4 hours ago, nonstopfan said:

 

You act as if the Green Bay offense was setting the world on fire in the second half. Green Bay scored three whole points after HT. The Packers had 5 second half possessions and and went three and out on two of those possessions. Rodgers looked awful in the second half so to expect that he would just somehow magically turn it on could be possible, but most likely not. Seattle made 2nd half adjustments that worked. Point blank.

 

Again, with 4 minutes left and essentially two timeouts, it's a coin flip decision as to whether or not go for it. Sometimes, your defense and defensive unit needs to step up as well. Just like a few weeks ago, sometimes your special teams unit needs to step up as well and they didn't. The buck always starts and stops with the HC. That's what you sign up for, but can you really blame that on the HC?

 

And in regards to elevating players, yes that could come from a HC, but how about the QB elevating the skill players around him?

 

Looking at things bigger picture, I've always felt that GB has had holes everywhere and that's a HC AND GM issue. Maybe Brian Guntkunst can change that for you guys.

 

 

Really?  You are advocating taking the ball out of one of the best QBs of all time and relying on a mediocre at best defense to get you the ball back?  When you have someone as good as Rodgers you give him the opportunity to win the game.  Punting does not do that.  McCarthy is a coward and he should have been fired years ago.  

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4 hours ago, nonstopfan said:

 

You act as if the Green Bay offense was setting the world on fire in the second half. Green Bay scored three whole points after HT. The Packers had 5 second half possessions and and went three and out on two of those possessions. Rodgers looked awful in the second half so to expect that he would just somehow magically turn it on could be possible, but most likely not. Seattle made 2nd half adjustments that worked. Point blank.

 

Again, with 4 minutes left and essentially two timeouts, it's a coin flip decision as to whether or not go for it. Sometimes, your defense and defensive unit needs to step up as well. Just like a few weeks ago, sometimes your special teams unit needs to step up as well and they didn't. The buck always starts and stops with the HC. That's what you sign up for, but can you really blame that on the HC?

 

And in regards to elevating players, yes that could come from a HC, but how about the QB elevating the skill players around him?

 

Looking at things bigger picture, I've always felt that GB has had holes everywhere and that's a HC AND GM issue. Maybe Brian Guntkunst can change that for you guys.

Yeah but doesn't McCarthy have a little bit to do with the offensive struggles? Jones was getting chunk yardage, in fact he had a couple nice yardage plays taken away due to penalty. McCarthy went away from the run game in the 2nd half which was odd. Going into the 2nd half I was thinking to myself, "Now is when you use your emerging running game." To no surprise really though, McCarthy went away from it. I understand that Rodgers could be checking out of run plays or whatever, but if he was committed to the run game, they'd run the ball. The bottom line is that McCarthy consistently gets out coached.

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Still trying to piece together the logic behind not challenging Lockett's bobbling red zone catch that set up the winning TD, on the grounds that losing the challenge (he wouldn't have lost) would cost a timeout.  THEN punting on 4th and 2 knowing you only have one timeout and need to get a stop to get the ball back.

 

Having that extra timeout didn't mean anything because that defense couldn't make a stop to save their lives, and they had showed this over and over again in the second half.  Not throwing the challenge flag is what really cost them the game.

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3 hours ago, WaiverLooter said:

2018 Outlook: Fired.

2019 outlook: hanging out on Jeff Fisher's couch with Philbin by his side.

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1 hour ago, psygolf said:

Can we give Rodgers a pass on poor leadership & vocal insubordination during losses?

Fock no. That clown is completing passes at a Blake Bortles rate. Right now he blows. 

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1 hour ago, eg4190 said:

Still trying to piece together the logic behind not challenging Lockett's bobbling red zone catch that set up the winning TD, on the grounds that losing the challenge (he wouldn't have lost) would cost a timeout.  THEN punting on 4th and 2 knowing you only have one timeout and need to get a stop to get the ball back.

 

Having that extra timeout didn't mean anything because that defense couldn't make a stop to save their lives, and they had showed this over and over again in the second half.  Not throwing the challenge flag is what really cost them the game.

 

Needs a lesson or two from Belichick on when and how to throw it..

 

SCREW_U_TITANS.0.gif

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Why does this thread exist?  Y’all play in a league with coach points or something?

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3 minutes ago, lla887 said:

Why does this thread exist?  Y’all play in a league with coach points or something?

Coaches have a big impact on players. See Nagy/Jordan Howard

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1 minute ago, bhawks489 said:

Coaches have a big impact on players. See Nagy/Jordan Howard

 

True.  Nagy/Trey Burton also relevant.  Or Nagy/all Chicago poor decisions. 

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15 minutes ago, lla887 said:

Why does this thread exist?  Y’all play in a league with coach points or something?

Because GB fans cannot hold Aaron accountable for any loss.

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i wouldnt be surprised if rodgers was trying to get him fired 

i doubt rodgers have ever liked him 

i dont think rodgers can let it go that mccarthy took smith #1 over him 

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19 minutes ago, Flyers_28 said:

i wouldnt be surprised if rodgers was trying to get him fired 

i doubt rodgers have ever liked him 

i dont think rodgers can let it go that mccarthy took smith #1 over him 

 

Or his best friend Jordy didn't get paid and has to throw to plugs (I liked Geronimo though)

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9 minutes ago, nosh0t said:

 

Or his best friend Jordy didn't get paid and has to throw to plugs (I liked Geronimo though)

 

I do think ARod cant get over the fact that the front office didn’t take his fee-fees into account when they sent his bestie out to pasture, but it’s not like Jordy has been lighting it up in Oakland.  They needed to get younger at WR immediately.  This is almost certainly a major reason Rodgers has a season-long sad though.

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McCarthy needs to go.  That punt on 4th and 2 was a cowardly surrender in a league where aggressive coaching is on the rise and is being richly rewarded in towns like New Orleans, Los Angeles, Kansas City, and Philadelphia (last year).  

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Stay the course, keep McCarthy and never make another Super Bowl during they Rodgers years, win an occasional NFC North title, maybe... MAYBE reach the NFC championship but that is no guarantee with the way the NFC is shaping up with the Rams, Saints, Eagles, Seahawks, Panthers, Vikings, not to mention the Falcons, Vikings, Bears, Cowboys who have all looked better than the Packers recently, imo. They have the talent to be elite in the conference but with this coaching they are in the bottom half.

 

It was clear as day to me when the Packers were up in the 2nd half they'd lose. I'd seen that movie too many times before in the McCarthy era. It's become the norm now.

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