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Chris Carson 2019 Outlook

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5 hours ago, dmb3684 said:

 

He had 70 total yards and three catches week 3.

 

But, If you say so. No one else was able to pick up Cohen in season. If you have an opening in your league, hit me up.

1. Don't be that insufferable fantasy dude that craps on someones league and thinks he would somehow be superior to all others because he has a different opinion of an add/drop or draft pick🤫

2. Are you really going to die on the Tarik Cohen Hill?  😂

FANTASY POINTS:

Game 1 = 7pts     Game2= 3pts    Game3 =  10pts

No one drafted Tareek Cohen in ppr expecting 20pts over 3 consecutive games with Howard in the backfield; his ADP shot up once Nagy was hired as the HC and the bet was he would be a ppr stud.  🤔

Grabbing the cut/drop data from the  fleaflicker platform you can see Cohen was the 9th dropped rb with 931teams cutting him. You said no one was able to pick up Cohen  and I just showed you that on 1 generic platform 931 teams made Cohen available, not traded but dropped.👏👏 

So please stop with your ridiculous position that no one else was able to pick him up because i am sure if you can pull data from the larger sites such as espn/yahoo which even with thousands of zombie leagues u will see he was dropped by active teams too after game 3.

Seriously dude just walk away from this debate you lost it the minute you made the ridiculous statement that he was unavailable after week 3.  🤫

The fact is he was unavailable after week 4 when he had his breakout game. . . 😱

 
RB JAC (9)
 
 
              1,349
 
RB SEA (7)
 
 
1,267
 
RB CAR (4)
 
 
1,037
 
RB CLE (11)
 
 
1,031
 
RB TB (5)
 
 
1,003
 
RB SF (11)
 
 
998
 
RB TB (5)
 
 
964
 
RB NE (11)
 
 
941
 
RB CHI (5)
 
 
              931
 
RB IND (9)
 
 
              857
 
RB GB (7)
 
 
782
 
RB SEA (7)
 
 
764
 
RB DEN (10)
 
 
756
 
RB CLE (11)
 
 
739

 

3. You lost this debate and you have been exposed as just shooting off to make your opinion sound like a fact while questioning my credibility with nothing to back you up. Please dont try to salvage your bad position with another bad position 👀

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3 hours ago, Sack Exchange said:

 

you've won me over to your side. i will help to promote the "avoid chris carson" cause for the reasons you've stated and more.

 

 

i see more clearly now thanks to dashoe's posts: taking the anti-carson stance is the best way to keep carson's ADP down.

I get it you are a Carson lover/fan and you invest heavily in what you feel is his talent. 

Interestingly i don't have an anti- Carson stance but of course you would view it that way because i'm not hyping him up. My point was you have to dig deeper and not simply look at last seasons total and  avg  of numbers to determine player value for the new season.

I have made no comment on talent/ability nor do I have a bias toward Carson or penney.  I will let you in on a little secret i took talent out of the fantasy equation years ago when I realized rb's in general benefit from the system and aside from a handful are generally plug and play. Case in point Davis looked like a stud when he started a game or 2 in SEA. 

My position was the SEA backfield was a mess last season primarily do to coaching  decisions. My position is until i see what shotty implements this season in terms of run schemes given that we know last season he didnt implement much of his own  staying with the previous SEA scheme that Carroll favored which Carson knew and was  difficult for Penney to adjust to - i'm not making a strong bet on either sea rb to be the one to own. 

So you can continue with the silly narrative that i am anti-carson  which is false and only your perception or you can say hey that awesome fun loving opinion sharing Dashoe guy has a point that i didnt think of; it's not a simplistic carson vs penney is better more talented etc but rather it's what schemes will the coaches create offensively that complement the rbs which may benefit one vs the other. 👏

 

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13 minutes ago, dashoe said:

I get it you are a Carson lover/fan and you invest heavily in what you feel is his talent. 

Interestingly i don't have an anti- Carson stance but of course you would view it that way because i'm not hyping him up. My point was you have to dig deeper and not simply look at last seasons total and  avg  of numbers to determine player value for the new season.

I have made no comment on talent/ability nor do I have a bias toward Carson or penney.  I will let you in on a little secret i took talent out of the fantasy equation years ago when I realized rb's in general benefit from the system and aside from a handful are generally plug and play. Case in point Davis looked like a stud when he started a game or 2 in SEA. 

My position was the SEA backfield was a mess last season primarily do to coaching  decisions. My position is until i see what shotty implements this season in terms of run schemes given that we know last season he didnt implement much of his own  staying with the previous SEA scheme that Carroll favored which Carson knew and was  difficult for Penney to adjust to - i'm not making a strong bet on either sea rb to be the one to own. 

So you can continue with the silly narrative that i am anti-carson  which is false and only your perception or you can say hey that awesome fun loving opinion sharing Dashoe guy has a point that i didnt think of; it's not a simplistic carson vs penney is better more talented etc but rather it's what schemes will the coaches create offensively that complement the rbs which may benefit one vs the other. 👏

 

 

i am open-minded by nature. i come to rotoworld essentially with that intention: what can i learn here about players i don't know, and how can i use this knowledge to defeat my leaguemates? yes, silliness is part of it, because although i take fantasy football very seriously, it is after all, a hobby we should all enjoy. suffering, yes, that's a part of it. but we must make each other laugh and thereby balance the pain we've all experienced, like losing a playoff game by a field goal... or less.

i think the one post you made previously, one that's entirely relevant here is, you play PPR, and chris carson is not the PPR maverick. choosing a different RB2 for a slightly higher price tag because he is a PPR machine (cohen?) seems prudent. but the counterpoint to this element is this post i'm responding to, when you say that i "invest heavily in" carson: that's the key point i seek to illuminate --- the volume of carson, and what i see as skill, is currently dirt cheap --- it is not a heavy investment at all. it's a bargain.

but my awesome fun loving opinion sharing colleague dashoe, let's forget all about the numbers, the stats i've been posting for pages. take some time to watch him run. yes, i know i'm posting the highlights, and i know the highlights inherently reveal only the "best" plays, but look at the kid, even beyond the jumping. more specifically, look at the second and third effort, the relentless pushing and pushing, especially at the goal line (second half of the video, specifically, if you can only spare 3 minutes instead of the full 6). look at the initial hits where carson punishes defenders, and then the relentlessness. i know you buy into a system, as you stated, and that you're not buying into petey's, but take some time to watch carson just for the fun of it.

 

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2 hours ago, dashoe said:

1. Don't be that insufferable fantasy dude that craps on someones league and thinks he would somehow be superior to all others because he has a different opinion of an add/drop or draft pick🤫

2. Are you really going to die on the Tarik Cohen Hill?  😂

FANTASY POINTS:

Game 1 = 7pts     Game2= 3pts    Game3 =  10pts

No one drafted Tareek Cohen in ppr expecting 20pts over 3 consecutive games with Howard in the backfield; his ADP shot up once Nagy was hired as the HC and the bet was he would be a ppr stud.  🤔

Grabbing the cut/drop data from the  fleaflicker platform you can see Cohen was the 9th dropped rb with 931teams cutting him. You said no one was able to pick up Cohen  and I just showed you that on 1 generic platform 931 teams made Cohen available, not traded but dropped.👏👏 

So please stop with your ridiculous position that no one else was able to pick him up because i am sure if you can pull data from the larger sites such as espn/yahoo which even with thousands of zombie leagues u will see he was dropped by active teams too after game 3.

Seriously dude just walk away from this debate you lost it the minute you made the ridiculous statement that he was unavailable after week 3.  🤫

The fact is he was unavailable after week 4 when he had his breakout game. . . 😱

 
RB JAC (9)
 
 
              1,349
 
RB SEA (7)
 
 
1,267
 
RB CAR (4)
 
 
1,037
 
RB CLE (11)
 
 
1,031
 
RB TB (5)
 
 
1,003
 
RB SF (11)
 
 
998
 
RB TB (5)
 
 
964
 
RB NE (11)
 
 
941
 
RB CHI (5)
 
 
              931
 
RB IND (9)
 
 
              857
 
RB GB (7)
 
 
782
 
RB SEA (7)
 
 
764
 
RB DEN (10)
 
 
756
 
RB CLE (11)
 
 
739

 

3. You lost this debate and you have been exposed as just shooting off to make your opinion sound like a fact while questioning my credibility with nothing to back you up. Please dont try to salvage your bad position with another bad position 👀

 

What are you talking about? I'll rephrase. Tarik Cohen was never available in any of my 5 leagues at any point after the draft, so I'd assume this was common and your OP wasn't relevant to most leagues. Fair enough?

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18 hours ago, dmb3684 said:

 

Cohen was a 4th round pick in PPR leagues and had two bad games to start the season. No one else had this option. 

 

8 hours ago, dmb3684 said:

 

He had 70 total yards and three catches week 3.

 

But, If you say so. No one else was able to pick up Cohen in season. If you have an opening in your league, hit me up.

 

3 minutes ago, dmb3684 said:

 

What are you talking about? I'll rephrase. Tarik Cohen was never available in any of my 5 leagues at any point after the draft, so I'd assume this was common and your OP wasn't relevant to most leagues. Fair enough?

 

Next time state your specific circumstances because your previous posts were  not written that way and you came across in a highly unflattering manner.

And now you know that your 5 leagues are not the consensus for the thousands of leagues out there. 

Your leagues are not that special; they are only special to you so no need to disparage other leagues.👁️

 

 

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1 hour ago, dashoe said:

 

 

 

Next time state your specific circumstances because your previous posts were  not written that way and you came across in a highly unflattering manner.

And now you know that your 5 leagues are not the consensus for the thousands of leagues out there. 

Your leagues are not that special; they are only special to you so no need to disparage other leagues.👁️

 

 

 

Yeah I don't care about any of that. My point is still valid.

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3 hours ago, dmb3684 said:

 

What are you talking about? I'll rephrase. Tarik Cohen was never available in any of my 5 leagues at any point after the draft, so I'd assume this was common and your OP wasn't relevant to most leagues. Fair enough?

I picked Cohen up after the draft...and oddly enough, it might’ve come at the expense of dropping Carson.

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2 hours ago, Stonej14 said:

I love the arguments over semantics in this thread.

 

at least you're arguing over something, which can't be said about all of the posts here

 

weird-logic-lol_o_1243379.jpg

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2 hours ago, dmb3684 said:

 

Yeah I don't care about any of that. My point is still valid.

 

No. Your original point/statement was false and factually wrong.

Your "rephrase"  was a completely different point/statement.

Written language is very particular regardless of your intent or spin. . .😂

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21 hours ago, Stonej14 said:

I love the arguments over semantics in this thread. 

 

 

This is my fault, I didn't intend to get into that argument, apologies. Carry on.

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On 4/5/2019 at 4:23 PM, dashoe said:

 

Here let me help you step away a bit from your seasonal averages  which really don't mean much if you are planning a lineup for the week..

Carson burned you if you started him the firs t 10  games of the season because you could not place him in your lineup and predict a certain outcome; which you should be able to do for a starting NFL rb sharing a backfield with a lost rookie and a journeyman.  What would you get 4pts? 8pts? 20pts? how many touches 0. 5. 15, 20? Would he play the whole games? Would he stay healthy?  Will Petey move him to special teams because he looked gassed? Why the heck is Davis getting 40% mkt share? Why is penney even on the field if he doesnt know the offense?

I know if  Lamar Miller is the starting rb on his team, his touches are very predictable even though his production blows vs those touches. 

THAT's what your seasonal averages and std deviations WON'T tell you.  ThATS's what made Carson unpredictable for 10 weeks., His situation was unpredictable because  the coaching and the offense were unpredictable.  

Also your method is BACKWARDS LOOKING meaning you didnt have this information last season when you were planning your lineups. .  . so great hindsight analysis but for those of us in deciding to start Carson in real time it didnt exist 😂👀

Not sure why you are not grasping this concept. 🤨

I mean outside of the top 6-7 stud RBs aren't they all inconsistent?  They all have big weeks coupled with average to low weeks.  Give me an RB that was consistent enough with a high output that you consider didn't "burn" you last year?

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10 minutes ago, Fort4242 said:

I mean outside of the top 6-7 stud RBs aren't they all inconsistent?  They all have big weeks coupled with average to low weeks.  Give me an RB that was consistent enough with a high output that you consider didn't "burn" you last year?

regarding consistency and what players are averaging on a per game basis, consider some numbers:

2018 top 10 RBs in rushing yards per game order

Rk Player Tm Age Pos G GS Att Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G
Fmb
1 Ezekiel Elliott* DAL 23 RB 15 15 304 1434 6 41 4.7 95.6 6
2 Todd Gurley*+ LAR 24 RB 14 14 256 1251 17 36 4.9 89.4 1
3 Joe Mixon CIN 22 RB 14 13 237 1168 8 51 4.9 83.4 0
4 Chris Carson SEA 24 RB 14 14 247 1151 9 61 4.7 82.2 3
5 Saquon Barkley* NYG 21 RB 16 16 261 1307 11 78 5.0 81.7 0
6 Marlon Mack IND 22 RB 12 10 195 908 9 49 4.7 75.7 2
7 Kareem Hunt KAN 23 RB 11 11 181 824 7 45 4.6 74.9 0
8 James Conner* PIT 23 RB 13 12 215 973 12 30 4.5 74.8 4
9 Melvin Gordon* LAC 25 RB 12 12 175 885 10 34 5.1 73.8 1
10 Sony Michel NWE 23 RB 13 8 209 931 6 34 4.5 71.6  

his 82/gm puts carson in good company looking at the historical list (list excludes last two seasons)

Rank Player Y/G Years Tm
1 Jim Brown+ 104.3 1957-1965 cle
2 Ezekiel Elliott 101.2 2016-2018 dal
3 Barry Sanders+ 99.8 1989-1998 det
4 Terrell Davis+ 97.5 1995-2001 den
5 Eric Dickerson+ 90.8 1983-1993 4TM
6 Adrian Peterson 89.4 2007-2018 4TM
7 Walter Payton+ 88.0 1975-1987 chi
8 Clinton Portis 87.8 2002-2010 2TM
9 Le'Veon Bell 86.1 2013-2017 pit
10 Billy Sims 85.1 1980-1984 det
11 Curtis Martin+ 83.9 1995-2005 2TM
12 O.J. Simpson+ 83.2 1969-1979 2TM
13 Edgerrin James 82.7 1999-2009 3TM
14 Earl Campbell+ 81.8 1978-1985 2TM
15 Arian Foster 81.6 2009-2016 2TM
16 Emmitt Smith+ 81.2 1990-2004 2TM

also worth considering 2018 total yards from scrimmage per game, again in good company

image.thumb.png.514246b188b39a4e602456785ecb2156.png

 

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Penny will be worked in but ThunderHawk will get his chance to keep the primary RB job.    If I end up with ThunderHawk, I'll look for Penny later.  Although I could see a situation where both are playing about the same and it being a wasted of the TH pick.

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15 minutes ago, K197040 said:

Penny will be worked in but ThunderHawk will get his chance to keep the primary RB job.    If I end up with ThunderHawk, I'll look for Penny later.  Although I could see a situation where both are playing about the same and it being a wasted of the TH pick.

 

That's his nickname? I'm out for sure.

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17 minutes ago, dmb3684 said:

 

That's his nickname? I'm out for sure.

if "ThunderHawk" really is carson's nickname, i out as well. moderators, please delete my posts from this thread.

still, better than rashaad's "SeaPenny".

 

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, dmb3684 said:

 

That's his nickname? I'm out for sure.

 

Yes.   He's The ThuderHawk.   Although there's supposed to be an umlaut over the "a" in Hawk.  But I didn't want to figure out how to type it.

Edited by K197040

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STEADDDDYYY HUSTLIN'

 

This dude looks like the ultimate value in 2019. I'll own him in every league if his ADP stays relatively static.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Fort4242 said:

I mean outside of the top 6-7 stud RBs aren't they all inconsistent?  They all have big weeks coupled with average to low weeks.  Give me an RB that was consistent enough with a high output that you consider didn't "burn" you last year?

 

Geez  you are TOO FOCUSED ON THE AVERAGES and spend too little effort understanding what underlies those numbers. 🤪

Let me help you again Carsons inconsistency wasnt his talent or on field play.  The inconsistency and unpredictability was as I have mentioned multiple times before THE COACHING.  How many of the top rb's are pulled for half a game because the coach thinks they look gassed or they really really really want to see how the rookie who couldnt compete in training camp looks every other game?

Zeke can have a crappy game but I know with 99% certainty zeke wont get pulled in a game and he will play all  4 qtrs or football and I cant say the same today for any rb coached by Pete Carroll

If the same unpredictable pattern emerges this season I'll take tarik cohen and nagy unpredictability over carson again this year

Edited by dashoe

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15 minutes ago, dashoe said:

I’ll take tarik cohen and nagy unpredictability over carson again this year

That would be awesome...to have you haunted by the usage of a 2nd/3rd year rb, Mike Davis, and rookie rbbc all over again.

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On 4/9/2019 at 3:05 AM, K197040 said:

 

Yes.   He's The ThuderHawk.   Although there's supposed to be an umlaut over the "a" in Hawk.  But I didn't want to figure out how to type it.

ThünderHåwk maybe? That would phonetically make slightly more sense.

large.png.9e5b7a101e9e6cfdc0e64101eac5cf5e.png

 

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1 hour ago, Boudewijn said:

ThünderHåwk maybe? That would phonetically make slightly more sense.

large.png.9e5b7a101e9e6cfdc0e64101eac5cf5e.png

 

 

No.  If anything ti would need more umlauts.  Like Motley Crue.  That would be awesome.

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6 hours ago, Boudewijn said:

I'm sure... that's... fine?
OXR9.gif

 

Penny for your thoughts. . .🤣

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

Penny for your thoughts. . .🤣

Oh, my thoughts are very cheap. I don't trust coaches, much less Pete Carroll.

 

I realise there are indeed many procedures these days that could have you up and (mostly) running in a matter of weeks, but if Carroll says "a little work on his knee" I wouldn't be surprised if Carson has a wooden leg by now.

giphy.gif

Edited by Boudewijn

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