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Brewcrew85

Tatis and Tanaka for Bogaerts and Maeda?

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Dynasty roto league keep 24 out of 30.

I'm being offered Tatis and Tanaka for my Bogaerts and Maeda. I'm sure most of you wouldn't accept this in a redraft but does dynasty change your mind?

What do you guys think? 

WHIR!

Thanks 

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Nah.  I still prefer Bogaerts because of the better park and better lineup (and overall better franchise). 

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49 minutes ago, Brewcrew85 said:

Thanks guys, anyone else?

It comes down to which SS you like overall. Xander has proved himself, but imo, Tatis can be that solid as well. Both are in young line ups, that should compete for a period of time. Especially when SD brings up Urias. Cant fault you for accepting, if you prefer Tatis. 1 of those win-win type deals. The SP's in the deal dont really sway it 1 way or the other. Good luck!

 

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Tatis not close

MVP player

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On 6/16/2019 at 6:14 PM, Josean Pelota said:

Nah.  I still prefer Bogaerts because of the better park and better lineup (and overall better franchise). 

Better park true

Better talent no

Lineups change yearly it's a moot point

Franchise means nothing

Talent age means everything with park considerations

How did Gywnn do his whole career in SD with a bad park, franchise?

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Posted (edited)

Tatis will pay off in the long run.id do it

Edited by exaulz
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On 6/16/2019 at 8:35 PM, Brewcrew85 said:

Dynasty roto league keep 24 out of 30.

I'm being offered Tatis and Tanaka for my Bogaerts and Maeda. I'm sure most of you wouldn't accept this in a redraft but does dynasty change your mind?

What do you guys think? 

WHIR!

Thanks 

I can’t believe how many said no. Bogaerts is very solid. Tatis is a game changer. I’d take this in a heartbeat.

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11 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

Better park true

Better talent no

Lineups change yearly it's a moot point

Franchise means nothing

Talent age means everything with park considerations

How did Gywnn do his whole career in SD with a bad park, franchise?

 

Tony Gwynn retired before Petco opened.  In any case, he was a contact and average hitter.  Tatis's profile is as a power hitter and it's still early to predict some HOF career for him. Petco isn't just a bad park; it has the toughest park factors most seasons (including this one).  Go check out Machado's home/away splits this year if you need more real world proof of what that park can do to a good hitter.  You basically need Renfroe level power to thrive there.  It's not easy. As for lineups, yes, they change but C'mon. Franchises mean nothing?  Who are you going to drive in, or be driven in by, if the hitters around you aren't good?  You're going to say with a straight face that lineup and franchise doesn't matter when we're comparing the BoSox, a team that is in the championship hunt almost every year, with a consistently good lineup, versus a franchise that more often than not serves as a farm team for bigger clubs?  Sure.  Samesies.  

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It's a no-brainer to accept for me.

 

Bogaerts is good and he's in the early stages of his prime.

 

Tatis is 20 and looks like a phenom. In dynasty, he's gold.

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Josean Pelota said:

 Petco isn't just a bad park; it has the toughest park factors most seasons (including this l   

As for lineups, yes, they change but C'mon. Franchises mean nothing?  Who are you going to drive in, or be driven in by, if the hitters around you aren't good?  You're going to say with a straight face that lineup and franchise doesn't matter when we're comparing the BoSox, a team that is in the championship hunt almost every year, with a consistently good lineup, versus a franchise that more often than not serves as a farm team for bigger clubs?  Sure.  Samesies.  

You can say fancy terms all you want like franchises. Means squat. Lineups change.

Twins lead in runs scored. Rangers 2nd. Mariners 6th. How's those FRANCHISES?

Padres have as many hrs 107 as that FRANCHISE Boston, in fewer games.

How did Vlad do in Montreal? Griffey in Seattle? Wait? They must be good FRANCHISES?

Stick to relevant stuff. Not stuff as meaningful as a players hair color.

 

 

Edited by HOOTIE
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Bogaerts is a good player who reached his ceiling. Tatis can be a great player, so in a dynasty Tatis is the one to want.

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2 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

You can say fancy terms all you want like franchises. Means squat. Lineups change.

Twins lead in runs scored. Rangers 2nd. Mariners 6th. How's those FRANCHISES?

Padres have as many hrs 107 as that FRANCHISE Boston, in fewer games.

How did Vlad do in Montreal? Griffey in Seattle? Wait? They must be good FRANCHISES?

Stick to relevant stuff. Not stuff as meaningful as a players hair color.

 

 

Lol players hair color. Anyway this. 

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3 hours ago, Josean Pelota said:

 

Tony Gwynn retired before Petco opened.  In any case, he was a contact and average hitter.  Tatis's profile is as a power hitter and it's still early to predict some HOF career for him. Petco isn't just a bad park; it has the toughest park factors most seasons (including this one).  Go check out Machado's home/away splits this year if you need more real world proof of what that park can do to a good hitter.  You basically need Renfroe level power to thrive there.  It's not easy. As for lineups, yes, they change but C'mon. Franchises mean nothing?  Who are you going to drive in, or be driven in by, if the hitters around you aren't good?  You're going to say with a straight face that lineup and franchise doesn't matter when we're comparing the BoSox, a team that is in the championship hunt almost every year, with a consistently good lineup, versus a franchise that more often than not serves as a farm team for bigger clubs?  Sure.  Samesies.  

Franchise history isn’t really relevant to this conversation. Historically Boston is far better than SD, but it has nothing to do with deciding between Bogaerts and Tatis. Tatis is the better player in a dynasty regardless of what team he’s on. Lineups change and previously bad teams have good runs, while previously good teams go into decade-long slumps. You go with talent in dynasty not anything else. In fact, what if Tatis gets traded to the Yankees or Red Sox? Or signs with either as a free agent? I don’t see him getting traded there, but just pointing out that Tatis may not even finish his career in SD.

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Posted (edited)

 

48 minutes ago, Thenewwildone8 said:

Franchise history isn’t really relevant to this conversation. Historically Boston is far better than SD, but it has nothing to do with deciding between Bogaerts and Tatis. Tatis is the better player in a dynasty regardless of what team he’s on. Lineups change and previously bad teams have good runs, while previously good teams go into decade-long slumps. You go with talent in dynasty not anything else. In fact, what if Tatis gets traded to the Yankees or Red Sox? Or signs with either as a free agent? I don’t see him getting traded there, but just pointing out that Tatis may not even finish his career in SD.

 

Ok, so looking at the last 20 years of success (and a steady, reliable offense) and good management of a wealthy franchise, in a hitter friendly park, that's irrelevant.  The possibility that 5-6 years from now Tatis may wear the uniform of that very franchise, that's somehow relevant.  Got it. 

I have no idea what kind of player Tatis is going to become.  None of us do. He's a hyped prospect but so what?  For every Bryce Harper there are several Lastings Milledges, Jesus Monteros, and Matt Bushes, prospects that their teams and fantasy players were gaga about, guys too good to ever trade, who failed spectacularly for one reason or another. What do we know about Tatis?  That he's hit for good but never great average in the minors, that he has decent power at the position with potential for much more, that he's never played triple A, and that he's struck out over 23% of the time at every level he's played at.  He might become a very good player, but there's a lot of risk in that profile, regardless of where he plays, which makes slotting him in Petco where he will likely remain for the next several years (if for no other reason, price tag) give me heartburn.  Add to that a mediocre franchise, with mediocre ownership, and Tatis could be their next star or he could be the next player to languish there.  What you have in him are a bunch of what ifs. 

We know what Bogaerts is now, and we have a pretty good idea of floor for the next several years.  And he's presently surrounded by good talent, in a great offensive club, in a hitter friendly stadium, with a well-managed champion club.  That's worth a lot more than a bunch of what ifs in a basket.  The most common mistake I see dynasty players do is that they delude themselves into thinking The Next Big Thing will pan out and that they'll have Mike Trout on their roster for the next twenty years, so they pass up on solid players now for the hope of what may be. It's like that family episode where Peter goes to a time share presentation, gets offered a boat, and passes on it for the mystery box because the mystery box could be anything; it could even be a boat!

I have no idea what Bogaerts will be doing 5 years from now. Or Tatis. But I know what Bogaerts is (and it's certainly not bad), and he's in a great environment to be a useful player for the next several seasons. I have no idea what kind of player Tatis will even be ROS, let alone for the next two or three seasons, and even less 10 years from now. Give me the guy with the better floor, with a franchise and park that will likely be setting him up for success and nice counting stats for the next few years, over the guy who may this and may that, but whom we know will likely spend his next few years in a cavernous park, subject to mediocre management, and potentially surrounded by equally promising but questionable talent. 

Edited by Josean Pelota

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Lineups and production change pretty fast

Basing lineups in a keeper or dynasty is fools gold

Park effects I get

Twins lead in runs

Were 12th last year

Rangers are 2nd

Were 13th last year

Mariners are 6th

Were 21st last year

Indians are 23rd

Were 3rd last year

The Padres have the same amount of hrs as Red Sox in fewer games

Running out 8 hitters and a pitcher versus Bostons 9 hitters

 

 

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