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MNDOGG

Charlie V 2009-2010

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Who would you guys rather have this year..Charlie V or Bargnani? I have the 53rd and 60th picks..im wondering which order would give me the best shot to get both of them? Bargnani at 53 then Charlie V at 60? or vice versa?

westbrook

then take brooks

and with your last pick take ridnour

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westbrook

then take brooks

and with your last pick take ridnour

huh? an attempt at a joke?

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Ok, i just did a quick scroll of Charlie V's game logs from last year..no joke, every game he played 30+ mins he had MONSTER lines! I mean every single game with 30+ mins, minus maybe one or two games where his shot was off He will undoubtedly get 30+ mins every single night for the pistons this year..im officially really excited about this guy and praying to the fantasy gods that he is there for me at 60!

check it out..

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3933/g...QJzjhm5wiIePaB4

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Ok, i just did a quick scroll of Charlie V's game logs from last year..no joke, every game he played 30+ mins he had MONSTER lines! I mean every single game with 30+ mins, minus maybe one or two games where his shot was off He will undoubtedly get 30+ mins every single night for the pistons this year..im officially really excited about this guy and praying to the fantasy gods that he is there for me at 60!

check it out..

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3933/g...QJzjhm5wiIePaB4

I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from that simply because there's a lot of selection bias impacting those numbers. It seems like what's going on here is that when he's playing well, he gets at least thirty minutes, and you look at his line and see how amazing it was. When he doesn't play well, he doesn't get minutes, and rather than seeing that he played badly even on a per-minute basis, you blame the fact that he didn't play enough for his subpar line, when in fact the reverse happened: the lack of minutes was caused by the subpar line. I find per-minute stats much more informative than just selecting games where he played above an arbitrarily selected number of minutes, and while he is pretty good there as well, those stats should remind us to temper our expectations a little bit, and expect to usually see box scores in line with his per-minute numbers, and not just with those monster games. I'm honestly not making a big point here about Villanueva's prospects, because he's very good any way you look at it, but rather commenting on the statistical procedure you used. Just a small thing, but these kinds of math details are often important, especially in a game like fantasy basketball that is played entirely with numbers.

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I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from that simply because there's a lot of selection bias impacting those numbers. It seems like what's going on here is that when he's playing well, he gets at least thirty minutes, and you look at his line and see how amazing it was. When he doesn't play well, he doesn't get minutes, and rather than seeing that he played badly even on a per-minute basis, you blame the fact that he didn't play enough for his subpar line, when in fact the reverse happened: the lack of minutes was caused by the subpar line. I find per-minute stats much more informative than just selecting games where he played above an arbitrarily selected number of minutes, and while he is pretty good there as well, those stats should remind us to temper our expectations a little bit, and expect to usually see box scores in line with his per-minute numbers, and not just with those monster games. I'm honestly not making a big point here about Villanueva's prospects, because he's very good any way you look at it, but rather commenting on the statistical procedure you used. Just a small thing, but these kinds of math details are often important, especially in a game like fantasy basketball that is played entirely with numbers.

well you can also argue that this year he will be given the minutes night in and night out without any quick pulls or anything like that..when this guy gets on a roll he really fills it up..so those nights where he didnt play well and only saw the court for 18-20 mins will not happen this year..he will be given the time to get out of the funk, where as when he wasn't a star paid player he would be given a quick seat and not see the court again..that won't be happening at all this year..so there will be many nights where he gets off to a bad start but catches fire late..hence a MONSTER season coming..

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I still would expect to see his averages end up being around his average per-36 minute line (or per-however many minutes he ends up averaging), and not an average that just takes into consideration those monster games. I'm not making a hugely contentious point here, just that he'll end up with around the same per-minute averages in 36 minutes as he did in 27, and warning that the sample you're looking at is made up almost exclusively of his best games spread out over the course of a season, and that his per-minute rates in a sample of only his best games are obviously not sustainable for 82 games, barring a ridiculous change in his talent level over the offseason.

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I still would expect to see his averages end up being around his average per-36 minute line (or per-however many minutes he ends up averaging), and not an average that just takes into consideration those monster games. I'm not making a hugely contentious point here, just that he'll end up with around the same per-minute averages in 36 minutes as he did in 27, and warning that the sample you're looking at is made up almost exclusively of his best games spread out over the course of a season, and that his per-minute rates in a sample of only his best games are obviously not sustainable for 82 games, barring a ridiculous change in his talent level over the offseason.

I hear ya..but even then, his averages over 36 per night come out to a whopping 20.8,8.7,2.3, 0.8stls, 0.9 blks, 1.4 treys.( based off his 27 per averages of last year).with decent %s around 45%,83%... who does that? Its almost like David West with treys. or even close to KDs averages from last year... monster..

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I agree those numbers are amazing, and I pointed out his incredible per-minute ranks on BBM a couple pages earlier in this thread, but in fact it seems like players with these wonderful per-minute lines tend to lose per-minute production as they are given more playing time. I don't know if it's due to fatigue, or if being able to sit on the bench for most of the game on days when your shot isn't falling helps keep your rates up, or if foul trouble makes players play more conservatively, but it happens to everybody except the very greatest players. On that final point, Villanueva averaged 4.4 fouls per 36 minutes last year, which would have led the league by a huge margin if he had actually been given 36 minutes, and in fact probably played a large role in why he was only able to play 27 minutes per game last year.

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I agree those numbers are amazing, and I pointed out his incredible per-minute ranks on BBM a couple pages earlier in this thread, but in fact it seems like players with these wonderful per-minute lines tend to lose per-minute production as they are given more playing time. I don't know if it's due to fatigue, or if being able to sit on the bench for most of the game on days when your shot isn't falling helps keep your rates up, or if foul trouble makes players play more conservatively, but it happens to everybody except the very greatest players. On that final point, Villanueva averaged 4.4 fouls per 36 minutes last year, which would have led the league by a huge margin if he had actually been given 36 minutes, and in fact probably played a large role in why he was only able to play 27 minutes per game last year.

good points Rico.. definitely someting i didn't consider and makes sense..I actually think Charlie V can have numbers very close to what i posted over 36 mins..but i didn't consider his foul rate..that definitely can be a factor to temper expectations..

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I actually do like Charlie V a fair amount, I just think people shouldn't get too overexcited about him. The 60th pick is where I've seen him ranked, and that seems about right to me. He won't duplicate the per-36 minutes that would make him top-25, but considering the pistons frontcourt, I don't see how he could avoid doing at least well enough to warrant a pick in the sixth round.

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Does anybody think he's going to not play as hard this year after signing this huge contract? I usually avoid guys coming off huge contract signings...

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I expect big things from Charlie V next year. With consistent playing time, he is going to beast it up!

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I drafted him in the 3rd round...I've had him the past 3 years every year my team name is Villanueffer.

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I drafted him in the 3rd round...I've had him the past 3 years every year my team name is Villanueffer.

Charlie V gets lower rankings on ESPN, Big Board, Hoops World and just about every ranking I've seen him has him listed around 70s. How would you rank him vs. Mo Williams, Horford, Ben Gordon, Nene, Al Harington, and even Bynum??

Hard to see Charlie V out playing guys within 5-10 predraft rankings away from him.

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is anyone watching the game? how come he only has 3 minutes of PT?

that's what i was trying to figure out, but it looks like he's starting the 2nd half. *shrugs*

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O he suck

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hard to do much after collecting 3 fouls in 2 minutes

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CV collected two fouls pretty early and didn't play at all in the 2nd quarter because of them. When he was on the court for the majority of the 3rd quarter he looked very good. DET is using him as a pick and pop guy on nearly every offensive set and he's going to get tons of offensive opportunities. He will be able to catch the ball with space and take the three or attack the basket as he did on a couple of his FGA tonight.

I'm really liking CV this season considering the way they are going to be utilizing him.

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He looked really out of shape last night. You see those flabby arms? He almost broke his neck on that breakaway dunk...

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early foul trouble.

the 3 blocks was very nice tho.

usually he's capable of scoring a lot of points. and i know he will.

just gotta see a couple more games to see what's up.

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My decision to draft him over Jeff Green is not looking so good right now.

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He looked really out of shape last night. You see those flabby arms? He almost broke his neck on that breakaway dunk...

I disagree, he looked very good for the amount of time he was out there in the 3rd quarter. He was very active on defense and actually recorded some good blocks that showed quite a bit of spring and quickness. CV has never been the most muscly and toned guy but he sure didn't look out of shape. He probably played the best interior defense in the third quarter out of any of the DET front line players.

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