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the1gq2nvy

Serge Ibaka 2012-2013 Season Outlook

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That's not even true, yes his fg% doesn't help you as much as someone who scores 2-3 times as much but it still helps you. 7.5 attempts on 53.5-54.5% fg is a lot more valueable than you are giving credit for.

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That's not even true, yes his fg% doesn't help you as much as someone who scores 2-3 times as much but it still helps you. 7.5 attempts on 53.5-54.5% fg is a lot more valueable than you are giving credit for.

I guess you didn't completely read what I posted. The low volume scoring is not going to help a team that has other players that do not contribute in field goal percentage. Having Ibaka go 3-5 in a game and then having someone like Joe Johnson go 4-11 is going to completely negate the "value" Ibaka's field goal percentage gives you.

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Why on earth would you ever pair Ibaka with a team with low fg%? Why would you tank fg% to begin with even if you didn't pick Ibaka? It's one of the best cats to try and win by far because most noobs ignore/devalue it.

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He's more than a specialist, more like a Blocks God with a very clean line for a big man.

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Why on earth would you ever pair Ibaka with a team with low fg%? Why would you tank fg% to begin with even if you didn't pick Ibaka? It's one of the best cats to try and win by far because most noobs ignore/devalue it.

Are you going to counter my argument with something or are you just going to keep asking questions? My argument is that while his FG% is high it doesn't help you because it's such a low volume. However,it doesn't hurt you (obviously). He won't win you FG% but he'll help you maintain it. Ibaka essentially is amazing at blocks and turnovers, decent in boards, ok in FG% and FT%, (only ok because of low volume), not good in points, steals, assists, and threes. Not exactly a game changer, but he's a good cog to have if you can surround him with the right players.

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Why on earth would you ever pair Ibaka with a team with low fg%? Why would you tank fg% to begin with even if you didn't pick Ibaka? It's one of the best cats to try and win by far because most noobs ignore/devalue it.

Are you going to counter my argument with something or are you just going to keep asking questions? My argument is that while his FG% is high it doesn't help you because it's such a low volume. However,it doesn't hurt you (obviously). He won't win you FG% but he'll help you maintain it. Ibaka essentially is amazing at blocks and turnovers, decent in boards, ok in FG% and FT%, (only ok because of low volume), not good in points, steals, assists, and threes. Not exactly a game changer, but he's a good cog to have if you can surround him with the right players.

I mean this is just wrong. Ibaka was like the 27th best player in fg% last year. If you shot 50.1% on 14.1 attempts like Pau Gasol did last season you were worse in FG% than Ibaka was.

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How can you fault Ibaka for not having steals, assists and 3s ? How many PF/C do you know that give you those stats? I play in larger leagues 16-20 teams and his value is great bc he's one of the few players that will win you a cat weekly all by himself.

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Rondo literally only helps you in steals and assists. He legit hurts you in ft%, fg%, turnovers (this one is huge), and 3s (again huge for a perimiter player), blocks (expect no blocks from a pg tho).

In short Rondo legit hurts you in 6 out of 9 cats!!!

That's gotta be one of the most misleading, thinly veiled ways of trying to make your point look stronger than it actually is. Why the hell would you bring up blocks for Rondo? Why even bring that into the conversation other than artificially supporting your point? That's like saying Ibaka legit hurts you in assists and steals. Come on man, you're better than that.

And why are people saying Rondo hurts you on REBs and FG%???? He rebounds very well for a guard, especially if your league rewards offensive rebounds. And historically, his FG% has been very good for a guard. Last year was a low for him, so I'd bet that % regresses to the mean.

So Rondo really only hurts you in 4 categories (FT%, 3's, PTs, TO's), while is at least good for a guard in FG% and REBS, while providing excellent ASTs and STLs.

Sure, Rondo sucks when you plug him into any random team. But he's not the team sinker that some of you are making him out to be when he's used right. Anyone who drafts Rondo when they want to compete for 3's and PT's is stupid anyway. The bottom line is that Rondo is incredibly valuable in some builds while incredibly invaluable in others.

Rondo is an abnormal player and is difficult to use. Guys like Rondo, Howard, Griffin, etc shouldn't be drafted unless you are absolutely positive how to use them. If you don't have an acute understanding of how Rondo/Howard/Griffin changes your strategy for winning then you are dead in the water and should attempt a strategy with more margin for error. But the answer to your question is no, and your mindset is fundamentally wrong for owning Rondo. You're shouldn't be trying to "overcome" anything about Rondo, just focus on what makes him great. Utilize the edges he gives you in assists, steals, and relatively high rebounds and FG% for a guard. And make sure to have a sources of threes from outside of your guard corps, because at least 1 of them isnt going to be hitting treys. If you're trying to insert Rondo into a team that's not tailored specifically for him, its almost like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. You're better off just going with a different piece. Don't fight the Rondo, embrace it.

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For anyone who doesn't understand why Rondo is fantasy garbage (for his ADP), just go to BBM and check out his rankings, or read rico's posts. If you still aren't convinced, you'll probably never be enlightened.

Dynasty999's post about Ibaka > Gasol in FG% impact was actually pretty mind-blowing, but this is confirmed by BBM and sort of makes mathematical sense to me. I think the FG% that BM considered average for 2011-12 is 46.3%. Pau was 50.1% at 14.1 FGA, Ibaka was at 53.5% at 7.4 FGA. Roughly speaking, Pau put up twice as many shots as Ibaka, but Ibaka's FG% had twice as much impact (7.2% above the average, as opposed to 3.7%). This evens up to pretty much equal impact (although Ibaka had the slight upper hand), and I'd agree with the sentiment that Ibaka's FG% impact is very underrated.

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Rondo literally only helps you in steals and assists. He legit hurts you in ft%, fg%, turnovers (this one is huge), and 3s (again huge for a perimiter player), blocks (expect no blocks from a pg tho).

In short Rondo legit hurts you in 6 out of 9 cats!!!

That's gotta be one of the most misleading, thinly veiled ways of trying to make your point look stronger than it actually is. Why the hell would you bring up blocks for Rondo? Why even bring that into the conversation other than artificially supporting your point? That's like saying Ibaka legit hurts you in assists and steals. Come on man, you're better than that.

And why are people saying Rondo hurts you on REBs and FG%???? He rebounds very well for a guard, especially if your league rewards offensive rebounds. And historically, his FG% has been very good for a guard. Last year was a low for him, so I'd bet that % regresses to the mean.

So Rondo really only hurts you in 4 categories (FT%, 3's, PTs, TO's), while is at least good for a guard in FG% and REBS, while providing excellent ASTs and STLs.

Sure, Rondo sucks when you plug him into any random team. But he's not the team sinker that some of you are making him out to be when he's used right. Anyone who drafts Rondo when they want to compete for 3's and PT's is stupid anyway. The bottom line is that Rondo is incredibly valuable in some builds while incredibly invaluable in others.

Rondo is an abnormal player and is difficult to use. Guys like Rondo, Howard, Griffin, etc shouldn't be drafted unless you are absolutely positive how to use them. If you don't have an acute understanding of how Rondo/Howard/Griffin changes your strategy for winning then you are dead in the water and should attempt a strategy with more margin for error. But the answer to your question is no, and your mindset is fundamentally wrong for owning Rondo. You're shouldn't be trying to "overcome" anything about Rondo, just focus on what makes him great. Utilize the edges he gives you in assists, steals, and relatively high rebounds and FG% for a guard. And make sure to have a sources of threes from outside of your guard corps, because at least 1 of them isnt going to be hitting treys. If you're trying to insert Rondo into a team that's not tailored specifically for him, its almost like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. You're better off just going with a different piece. Don't fight the Rondo, embrace it.

There are basically two ways of describing value relative to average. One is to compare to the hypothetical player who is the average among all positions, who puts up the average number in each category. This player would have BBM values of 0.00 in every category, and finish with a BBM score of 0.00, exactly average among the pool of owned players, and would rank about 65th last year. If you're plugging, say, Rondo into your util spot or can rearrange your lineup so that you are, the roster spot you're using for him could be used for a player with any position, so it makes sense to compare him to that entire group. Last year, that average player would average 13.7/5.2/3.1, get .9 threes, 1.0 steals, and 0.7 blocks, shoot .463 from the field and .780 from the line, and turn the ball over 1.9 times. Then we can assess how a guy does relative to this player, and say that Rondo was below-average in seven categories, and that he was about 8.5 assists above average but 1.7 TOs worse than average, to go with .7 threes below average, .6 blocks below average, and about .183 below average in FT% on 3.4 attempts, so that when you compute how many standard deviations that is, Rondo comes out a decent amount behind this 65th-ranked guy.

The alternate approach is to compare to the "average PG" a guy with the same overall value, but with an average PG line. This guy might average 14/3.5/7 with 1.5 threes/1.4 steals/.2 blocks shooting .437/.830 with 2.6 TOs (these are just guesstimates, not actual numbers) and finish with a BBM value of 0.00, just like the other guy. By that measure, yes, Rondo's blocks are neutral, his rebounds and FG% are above average and his TOs are closer to average; on the flip side of that, though, if you're comparing to the average PG, his assists are only about 4.5 above average instead of 8.5, his steals are closer to average than they used to be, and his threes and FT% are substantially bigger negatives than they were before. If you're comparing someone with a BBM value of -0.11 to someone with a value of 0.00, no matter how their value is distributed, whether they're specialists or well-rounded studs, the guy who's at -0.11 will be an average of 0.11 standard deviations below the guy at 0.00. Either Rondo's .7 threes and .6 below average, or he's 1.3 threes and .1 blocks below average; either way, he's still a -0.11 player overall.

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Rondo literally only helps you in steals and assists. He legit hurts you in ft%, fg%, turnovers (this one is huge), and 3s (again huge for a perimiter player), blocks (expect no blocks from a pg tho).

In short Rondo legit hurts you in 6 out of 9 cats!!!

That's gotta be one of the most misleading, thinly veiled ways of trying to make your point look stronger than it actually is. Why the hell would you bring up blocks for Rondo? Why even bring that into the conversation other than artificially supporting your point? That's like saying Ibaka legit hurts you in assists and steals. Come on man, you're better than that.

And why are people saying Rondo hurts you on REBs and FG%???? He rebounds very well for a guard, especially if your league rewards offensive rebounds. And historically, his FG% has been very good for a guard. Last year was a low for him, so I'd bet that % regresses to the mean.

So Rondo really only hurts you in 4 categories (FT%, 3's, PTs, TO's), while is at least good for a guard in FG% and REBS, while providing excellent ASTs and STLs.

Sure, Rondo sucks when you plug him into any random team. But he's not the team sinker that some of you are making him out to be when he's used right. Anyone who drafts Rondo when they want to compete for 3's and PT's is stupid anyway. The bottom line is that Rondo is incredibly valuable in some builds while incredibly invaluable in others.

Rondo is an abnormal player and is difficult to use. Guys like Rondo, Howard, Griffin, etc shouldn't be drafted unless you are absolutely positive how to use them. If you don't have an acute understanding of how Rondo/Howard/Griffin changes your strategy for winning then you are dead in the water and should attempt a strategy with more margin for error. But the answer to your question is no, and your mindset is fundamentally wrong for owning Rondo. You're shouldn't be trying to "overcome" anything about Rondo, just focus on what makes him great. Utilize the edges he gives you in assists, steals, and relatively high rebounds and FG% for a guard. And make sure to have a sources of threes from outside of your guard corps, because at least 1 of them isnt going to be hitting treys. If you're trying to insert Rondo into a team that's not tailored specifically for him, its almost like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. You're better off just going with a different piece. Don't fight the Rondo, embrace it.

First off I put in parenthesis that I expect no blocks from a pg so it wasn't really bashing Rondo there. However you ignored his ppg hurting you, so it's really 5 cats he hurts you in (6 if you count blocks since occasionally guards do get blocks like Drose/Wall/Wade etc).

Didn't see anyone hate on his rebounding, hes a good rebounder for a guard. Also I think his fg% will hover around what it was last season because he is being a) asked to run the offense/create more B) he is taking more midrange jump shots which is huge. The reason his fg% was so high before is because he'd rarely takes those super low% midrange shots. However hes taking more of them so his fg% will naturally be worse.

Rondo is almost always going to be a bad pick because he is super overrated by almost every single person who plays fantasy which results in him going far earlier than he should. If you can get Rondo in the 5th round that would be a good pick...the problem is he goes in the 2nd-3rd rounds.

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I think you can build a team around him in H2H, that's how good he is -- your 1st round pick is just gravy. Rondo should not be compared to Ibaka because Rondo is better IRL, Serge is a fantasy beast and a beast IRL!

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Preseason, yet Ibaka has been 1/2 in the last game and currently 2/2 (midway through the 3rd) from deep. Anything to read into?

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That the Thunder don't care whether Ibaka shoots 3-pointers in the preseason?

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Preseason, yet Ibaka has been 1/2 in the last game and currently 2/2 (midway through the 3rd) from deep. Anything to read into?

Kevin Love reincarnated with a blocking ability :rolleyes:

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Rondo - you either need to be running a punt strat, getting ready to make a heavy investment compensating for his weakness or don't draft him at all. Still, if you want him get ready to invest a 2nd round pick into him

Ibaka - if he gets regular starter minutes this year he will offer first round value.

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He is truly going to be a rare breed if he can knock down even 0.5 3ptm per game and block shots at the same rate.

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just drained another one. he actually looks pretty comfortable out there.

Wow. He shot 2 3s and made 1. What the heck is going on.

I drafted him last year.. 3s in his game is insane.

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This guy is my favorite player. No way would i pass up on him. Win you blocks and contribute in threes too?! :wub:

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Whenever I see this guy's name, I think of Baraka from Mortal Kombat. Is the nickname "Blade" taken yet? It sounds better than "Air Africa."

Baraka_Shaolin_Monks.jpg

I miss my childhood. :lol:

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With Harden gone, could this possible mean more shots for Ibaka? Martin isn't anywhere the threat that Harden is. Someone will have to step up and replace some of the points lost with Harden. This could be a great opportunity to integrate some inside scoring. Then again, this could just mean more Westbrook and Durant.

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