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TheJRod2006

This reeks of collusion

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Im in a pretty competitive 10 team league. 2 of the owners are brothers, who I will refer to as team A and team B. Team A is in first place, with an overall really good team. Team B is in last place with arguably the saddest team I have ever seen assembled. Both teams have made trades between each other 4 other times this season

This trade happened 2 months ago before the regular season even started(Sept 5), but the deal was fair at best. Received 1 veto.

Team A received Bulger, Burress, Westbrook, and Brandon Jones

Team B received Brees, H. Ward, Benson, and J. Lewis

This one happened after week 2 (Sept 25), 3 team deal. Received 1 veto. Consider this was before Deuce and Marvin got hurt.

Team A received Harrison, McAllister, and H. Ward (gave up Darrell Jackson, Kevin Jones, and Plax)

Team B received Kevin Jones and Darrell Jackson (gave up Hines Ward and Jamal Lewis)

This one went through right before Week 5 (Oct 6). Received 2 vetos. At the time Bulger was terrible, so its debatable which team got the better end of the deal, although I lean towards team B just because a kicker was involved.

Team A received Roy Williams and Kaeding

Team B received Bulger and Coles

This one went through Oct 14th, right at Week 6. Received 3 vetos.

Team A received Darrell Jackson, Brees, and Ravens D

Team B received Young, Engram, and Chargers D

This one went through today. Currently in the veto process with 2 votes, one of which is me.

Team A received Bulger, M. Turner, and Colts D

Team B received Branch, Vernon Davis, and Ravens D

This one really irritates me because I just tried to deal for Bulger (I lowballed with Clemens and Taylor for Bulger), but it annoys the crap out of me that my deal gets rejected, gets publicly called a 'sucky offer' and then this one gets accepted. I know it sounds like sour grapes, but I dont see how you can call my offer sucky and then accept this one (keep in mind this is NOT a keeper league) unless youre working together. Team A can argue that he has LT and is protecting him acquiring Turner (who was a FA hours ago, but was picked up for this deal).

I dont want to have to be the guy who uses the word 'collusion' because it is a good group of guys and I really enjoy playing in this league. And throwing accusations like that around ruins reputations, not to mention breaks leagues apart, but I feel like something has to be said on the matter. And I really dont want to have to be that guy because it does look bad coming from me with my offer being rejected, but I doubt anyone else in the league has the balls to speak up about it.

Bottom line, should I bluntly call them out in front of everyone since it does feature the classic signs of collusion (swapping players back and forth, one team seemingly getting the better end of it)? Or should I just voice my displeasure with this trade without mentioning collusion?

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the way you stop this kind of stuff is to punish the last place team. for example, buy-in is $50/person. last place finisher contributes an additional $10 or $15. this gives the last place team incentive to not be in last place when the playoffs start.

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the way you stop this kind of stuff is to punish the last place team. for example, buy-in is $50/person. last place finisher contributes an additional $10 or $15. this gives the last place team incentive to not be in last place when the playoffs start.

yeah, good luck having that guy join the league the next year. punish the last place team??

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yeah, there is collusion going on here bro...honestly, you should get out of the league next year if the same brothers are in it. not sure if they are close friends of yours, but you need to speak out here for the integrity of the league...

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Back to the main point (I dont care much for punishing anyone other than vetoing the trade)

1. Is this collusion? (or am I overreacting)

2. Should I be 'that guy' can call them out? (or just post why I dont like this particular trade)

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yeah, there is collusion going on here bro...honestly, you should get out of the league next year if the same brothers are in it. not sure if they are close friends of yours, but you need to speak out here for the integrity of the league...

Im good friends with the owner of 'Team A'. Known him for a couple years, used to play poker every week, etc. I played in this league last year (which the owner of Team A won because he had LT), but his bro wasnt in it then.

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Im good friends with the owner of 'Team A'. Known him for a couple years, used to play poker every week, etc. I played in this league last year (which the owner of Team A won because he had LT), but his bro wasnt in it then.

well, since you have played poker with him, im sure you've picked up a tell ot 2 on him....simply ask him straight up in person if these trades were made fairly...you'll be able to tell if hes lying...

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well, since you have played poker with him, im sure you've picked up a tell ot 2 on him....simply ask him straight up in person if these trades were made fairly...you'll be able to tell if hes lying...

Cant really do that since he lives too far away. Im not gonna see him tomorrow and if its not vetoed by tomorrow night it goes through

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None of those deals strike me as being greatly uneven. If Team A is getting the better of any those deals, it certainly isn't that significant. It's not like he's packaging Jay Cutler and Justin Fargas in exchange for Tom Brady. I think you're overreacting.

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Yeah I don't really see these trades being uneven all to one team so I think you're overreacting but that's just my opinion.

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I dont think its bad enough to call them out on... A trade went through between a dad and a son last year in one of the leagues im in.. the son was in second place going to the playoffs and the dad was in last... The dad gave Willie parker to the son for Caddy.... I was then sent an offer from the same dad selling off his players, he wanted 20 bucks for Chad Johnson.... I wasnt in the playoffs but was in the hunt and got so pissed when stuff like this started going on... I got out of that league real quick... sad part was it was a league a few people I knew were in and they were doing the same thing between each other....

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yeah, good luck having that guy join the league the next year. punish the last place team??

everyone puts down a last place deposit that is returned to everyone but the last place team of course.

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everyone puts down a last place deposit that is returned to everyone but the last place team of course.

i dont like that at all....again, good luck having that team come back the next year. thats embarassing having to pay more money on top of having a miserable season. there are other ways to create a good, fair league - and it all starts with the people you let in.

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Yeah I don't really see these trades being uneven all to one team so I think you're overreacting but that's just my opinion.

the real issue here is that a last place bad team in making deals to a first place team...and it so happens to be his brother. team b never got better....thats bs. the red flags are way up here. 4 trades in 1 season???!! thats a joke...

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These deals don't seem that unbalanced. You, yourself, said that you made a low-ball offer for Bulger, so why be pissed that he took a better deal?

He's in last place and he's still involved; better than having a dead team in the league. None of those trades (based on when they took place) seem to be stacking one team or another. I wouldn't even have vetoed it, let alone consider raising hell over it.

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None of those trades are vetoable IMO. Now if you have a problem with a last place team dealing with a first place team, move the trade deadline up. And of course brothers are going to trade more with each other, they probably talk to each other more than the other guys. I have no problem with any of these deals.

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i dont like that at all....again, good luck having that team come back the next year. thats embarassing having to pay more money on top of having a miserable season. there are other ways to create a good, fair league - and it all starts with the people you let in.

If they don't come back, so what? You lose a last place team and get a new owner that's possibly more competitive. Luck plays a part, but I've never come even close to last place. Last place is for losers. In some ways, you're weeding out the losers (unless you're afraid of the competition).

And if they stay and pay - Excellent! Thanks for the donation.

There are obviously other variations that may be "less embarassing." For example, if you have an in person draft - last place buys the beer (they may prefer the flat fee).

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I was all set to agree with the people who said the deals weren't that bad and therefore, not vetoable, until I looked at them as a whole and saw the same players being exchanged over and over again. That seems a little fishy. I might make that your point of emphasis if you decide to confront them rather than their personal relationship outside of the league as brothers. That shouldn't be relevant if you have a real case for veto.

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If they don't come back, so what? You lose a last place team and get a new owner that's possibly more competitive. Luck plays a part, but I've never come even close to last place. Last place is for losers. In some ways, you're weeding out the losers (unless you're afraid of the competition).

And if they stay and pay - Excellent! Thanks for the donation.

There are obviously other variations that may be "less embarassing." For example, if you have an in person draft - last place buys the beer (they may prefer the flat fee).

i play my leagues with all friends at live drafts, so i guess thats why it would be funny asking them to pay money on top of the normal fee.

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I wouldn't wanna lose a friend over fantasy sports, talk to him.

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None of the trades look that terribly uneven, but it does look like A is essentially using B to give him more bench spots and waiver pickups. It's a type of collusion, and one I wouldn't necessarily be comfortable with in a paid league, but I've heard of worse. If you feel comfortable talking to A about it, do so, but otherwise I wouldn't expect too much, and I'd definitely think twice about playing with these two next year.

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i play my leagues with all friends at live drafts, so i guess thats why it would be funny asking them to pay money on top of the normal fee.

I play with friends too. And in most cases, the extra $'s they might have to pony up is nothing compared to the ribbing they take for coming in last.

And why would you feel funny? Do you feel funny taking the money you win on th "normal fee?" They can easily avoid it. It's not like you're suggesting the bottom half of the league pays. If you end up in last, you should expect the hazing.

But to the original message - I agree with those that raise th eyebrow at the number of times the same players are going back and forth. I'm against vetos, but when players are going back and forth like that it's hard to rationalize trading someone, then thinking more highly of them 2 weeks later. Maybe with 1 player, but the 3 or 4 involved here is either collusive or schizophrenic. Either way, they need help.

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I play with friends too. And in most cases, the extra s they might have to pony up is nothing compared to the ribbing they take for coming in last.

And why would you feel funny? Do you feel funny taking the money you win on th "normal fee?" They can easily avoid it. It's not like you're suggesting the bottom half of the league pays. If you end up in last, you should expect the hazing.

But to the original message - I agree with those that raise th eyebrow at the number of times the same players are going back and forth. I'm against vetos, but when players are going back and forth like that it's hard to rationalize trading someone, then thinking more highly of them 2 weeks later. Maybe with 1 player, but the 3 or 4 involved here is either collusive or schizophrenic. Either way, they need help.

tell you what, try and implement your idea, and come back to me with what happens...i almost gurantee that team would quit the league, or give the commish problems with paying the "last place fee."

no, they cant easily avoid it....sometimes you have an off year, players get hurt etc...

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I wouldn't wanna lose a friend over fantasy sports, talk to him.

Absolutely! If fantasy football starts breaking up friendships you may be taking it too seriously.

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Absolutely! If fantasy football starts breaking up friendships you may be taking it too seriously.

Whenever a team is in last, they get chirped beyond reason in my dynasty league. Its part of the fun of it. I've never been in dead last overall yet, but the guys that have been in last have taken a rough message board beating. Believe me, you don't want to be that guy there.

I would use the same tactics in your brother-brother trading scenerio. Just chirp these guys until the point of embarassment if they only deal with each other. Of course it depends if they can take a good natured ribbing or not, but it will put the spotlight on them for the rest of the league to see (if they havent already picked up on the trend).

No need to lose friends over this either.

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