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Bledsoe-Brady-Cassell-Garrappolo-Brisset  all started or came in as replacements in games under Hoodie and all won games for hoodie.

 

if some of you do't think that hoodie runs a system that makes his QB's winners you are delusional.

 

Tom Brady is a great winning QB and you can't take his talent and ability and success away from him; he earned it every game he played.

 

I just think Peyton is better.

Peyton is the SYSTEM

Edited by dashoe

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6 hours ago, My Dinner With Andre said:

 

I hope Brady breaks Manning's career passing TD and passing yardage records. No, I really do. Only then will we really never need to have this debate again

 

Brady will probably not break either of those records.  He's currently behind Manning by 83 TDs and just over 10,000 yards.  He'd have to play at his current level for three more seasons to break either record, and he turns 40 next August.  Brees (age 38 next season) is actually ahead of him in both categories, and since I think they're likely to retire around the same time, Brady could finish his career at number 4 in both categories.

 

Since some people only look at counting stats, I think there's always going to be a pro-Peyton contingent.  But the consensus will shift further to Brady the longer he continues playing and piling up great stats and postseason wins (possibly another SB) while Peyton does DirecTV commercials.

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53 minutes ago, dashoe said:

Bledsoe-Brady-Cassell-Garrappolo-Brisset  all started or came in as replacements in games under Hoodie and all won games for hoodie.

 

if some of you do't think that hoodie runs a system that makes his QB's winners you are delusional.

 

Tom Brady is a great winning QB and you can't take his talent and ability and success away from him; he earned it every game he played.

 

I just think Peyton is better.

Peyton is the SYSTEM

 

That's just false.  Cassel played a year in which the schedule was GARBAGE.  Brady would have went 16-0 that year.  And the whole Jimmy G/Brisset stuff....come on man.  They lost against the Bills 16-0.  Do you think Jimmy G and Brisset would have won against teams like Cowboys, Packers, Falcons?  The AFC is trash this year besides the Chiefs.  Oakland would have been a force had Carr not been injured.  Peyton might be the system, but Brady is the system is well.  The system doesn't work without Brady unless you have the luxury of playing in a garbage division the entire hoody career.  The Jets were the only team for maybe 2-3 years tops that had some good years.

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13 hours ago, LeeVanCleef said:

Why has every coach that was under BB that went on to be a HC essentially failed? 

 

Because they didn't have Tom Brady. Pretty obvious to figure out. Since you like soda references so much, here you go. You have the recipe for Coca Cola and you can create your own soda company, so you write down the ingredients and the process to create Coca Cola (that's the system). You start the process, add water, high fructose corn syrup, etc, but oh crap! You're missing ingredient x, which is THE key to creating Coca Cola. Ingredient X is Tom Brady. And since you don't have Ingredient X, you don't accomplish your goal. 

 

Brady's first few years in the league were a product of the system and having dominate defenses. He really didn't come into his own until around 2006 or so, when he led the Pats to the AFC Championship Game with Reche Caldwell as his top WR. That timeframe was when Brady started elevating the players around him, and the great statistical seasons started to happen. The success he and Belichick have had is a product of a Hall of Fame coach getting hooked up with a Hall of Fame QB. It's been the perfect storm.

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For those of you saying that Manning "is his own coach" or "is the system by himself" you are forgetting one person and that man's name is Tom Moore.

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12 minutes ago, KuNiT21 said:

 

That's just false.  Cassel played a year in which the schedule was GARBAGE.  Brady would have went 16-0 that year.  And the whole Jimmy G/Brisset stuff....come on man.  They lost against the Bills 16-0.  Do you think Jimmy G and Brisset would have won against teams like Cowboys, Packers, Falcons?  The AFC is trash this year besides the Chiefs.  Oakland would have been a force had Carr not been injured.  Peyton might be the system, but Brady is the system is well.  The system doesn't work without Brady unless you have the luxury of playing in a garbage division the entire hoody career.  The Jets were the only team for maybe 2-3 years tops that had some good years.

 

 

Itt's nice that u dismiss  the pats 11-6  2008 record winning with cassell was due to a garbage schedule.  i'm sure if u ask hoodie or any NFL coach/player if going 11-6 in the NFL is garbage because of the schedule. I'm sure that 2008 pats team that busted their humps every week  looked at their opponents as garbage.

 

So Bledsoe was garbage too when Brady replaced him? he didn't win any games?

 

Point is hoodie has created a winning system regardless of who the QB is. He prepares his teams to win.

Fact still remains pats win lots of games without Brady and every QB I named under belichick as a pats HC won games. Thats' a fact. 

Edited by dashoe

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The division thing is funny. Like the Jaguars, Titans and Texans over the years were juggernaut teams Peyton had to deal with every year. 

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9 minutes ago, mrblonde1984 said:

The division thing is funny. Like the Jaguars, Titans and Texans over the years were juggernaut teams Peyton had to deal with every year. 

 

Seems like we've been around this block before, eh?

Both had their share of weak divisions and opponents

Both had stellar coaches involved somewhere

Both have had HOF teammates, and varying skill of defense throughout years.

Both have redefined what we thought was possible from a qb. 

 

It comes down to what you view as more important: 

Championships

or

Individual Stats

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3 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

 

Seems like we've been around this block before, eh?

Both had their share of weak divisions and opponents

Both had stellar coaches involved somewhere

Both have had HOF teammates, and varying skill of defense throughout years.

Both have redefined what we thought was possible from a qb. 

 

It comes down to what you view as more important: 

Championships

or

Individual Stats

 

Brady has the rings, in 2 yrs he will have more yards and in 3 will have more TDs despite having far less offensive talent, better defenses (means not as many shootouts), and being outdoors the equivalent of 6 more seasons than Peyton. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Impreza178 said:

 

Seems like we've been around this block before, eh?

Both had their share of weak divisions and opponents

Both had stellar coaches involved somewhere

Both have had HOF teammates, and varying skill of defense throughout years.

Both have redefined what we thought was possible from a qb. 

 

It comes down to what you view as more important: 

Championships

or

Individual Stats

 

 

 i dont it boils down to a pure quantitative determination. Some look at qualitative criteria as well. No different than when a team drafts or invites a college player to camp, the quantitave puts them on the radar but the qualitative finalizes the decision.

 

No one argues if peyton or Brady are great, the debate is over who is the greatest and that is purely subjective.

 

As a matter of fact i have an uncle who will debate to no end that Dan marino was the greatest QB to play the game but he is a Miami fan'

 

Peyton is THE GOAT!

Edited by dashoe
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1 minute ago, joshua18 said:

 

Brady has the rings, in 2 yrs he will have more yards and in 3 will have more TDs despite having far less offensive talent, better defenses (means not as many shootouts), and being outdoors the equivalent of 6 more seasons than Peyton. 

 

Wandering back into "mitigating or aggravating circumstances"

PM didn't have the same team his whole career, or the same coach.  He also basically invented the modern passing/motion/audible offense. 

 

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This conversation is irrelevant, earl morrall and bob griese are the GOAT 17-0 Super Bowl victors.  Neither manning nor Brady can pull that off.

 

#72perfect

Edited by 1972Miamidolphins
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I mean come the Peyton Mastercard commercials are some of the best ever created in television history. That alone gets him the GOAT

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3 minutes ago, 1972Miamidolphins said:

This conversation is irrelevant, earl morrall and bob griese are the GOAT 17-0 Super Bowl victors.  Neither manning nor Brady can pull that off.

 

#72perfect

 

 

Are u my Uncle?

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2 hours ago, dashoe said:

Bledsoe-Brady-Cassell-Garrappolo-Brisset  all started or came in as replacements in games under Hoodie and all won games for hoodie.

 

if some of you do't think that hoodie runs a system that makes his QB's winners you are delusional.

 

Tom Brady is a great winning QB and you can't take his talent and ability and success away from him; he earned it every game he played.

 

I just think Peyton is better.

Peyton is the SYSTEM

 

"The System"

 

That would have been a good nickname for Peyton.

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1 hour ago, mrblonde1984 said:

 

since you don't have Ingredient X, you don't accomplish your goal. 

Ingredient X is belichick.

He has proven on several occasions that he doesn't need tom or gronk or big names to win.  Does tom make the system better? Yeah he does because he's been in it for over a decade but the system can be just as good without him.  I think there's like a 3-4% statistical difference in games with Brady vs. games without in terms of winning percentage.  I really can't wait till Tom retires and Belichick (if he doesn't leave too) takes a no name to the playoffs.

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1 minute ago, My Dinner With Andre said:

 

"The System"

 

That would have been a good nickname for Peyton.

 

The Sheriff was pretty cool, IMO.

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1 minute ago, LeeVanCleef said:

Ingredient X is belichick.

He has proven on several occasions that he doesn't need tom or gronk or big names to win.  Does tom make the system better? Yeah he does because he's been in it for over a decade but the system can be just as good without him.  I think there's like a 3-4% statistical difference in games with Brady vs. games without in terms of winning percentage.  I really can't wait till Tom retires and Belichick (if he doesn't leave too) takes a no name to the playoffs.

 

How many titles would Brady have won if he played for the Colts and Manning played for the Patriots?

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Just now, mrblonde1984 said:

 

How many titles would Brady have won if he played for the Colts and Manning played for the Patriots?

How many RBs would have over 1000 yards and double digit tds running behind the Dallas oline? 

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13 minutes ago, mrblonde1984 said:

 

How many titles would Brady have won if he played for the Colts and Manning played for the Patriots?

 

hard to say for brady when peyton had 4 different coaches as a colt but  I would speculate peyton would have jad 6 rings with belichek.  4 the pats currently own and 2 more that they lost to the giants. . .  Eli would have choked going against his big brother and I like Eli.

 

Also don't forget Peyton took over a terrible colts team and took alot of hits his first few years. Brady inhereited a playoff ready pats team from Bledsoe and he never had to go throught the bottom of the barrell team and basically 4 coach rebuilds. 

Edited by dashoe

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22 minutes ago, LeeVanCleef said:

How many RBs would have over 1000 yards and double digit tds running behind the Dallas oline? 

 

Good example. The Dallas o-line (system) made Darren McFadden an RB1 last year. A supremely talented back (Zeke) was put in that system and won the rushing title. Your examples are making a great case for Brady, keep up the good work Lee!

Edited by mrblonde1984

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21 minutes ago, dashoe said:

Also don't forget Peyton took over a terrible colts team and took alot of hits his first few years. Brady inhereited a playoff ready pats team from Bledsoe

 

The Patriots were 5-11 in 2000 and had gotten embarrassed Week 1 at Cincy to open 2001 before Brady came in vs the Jets in Week 2 when Mo Lewis murdered Bledsoe. That 2001 team was not expected to do anything.

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4 minutes ago, mrblonde1984 said:

 

Good example. The Dallas o-line (system) made Darren McFadden an RB1 last year. A supremely talented back (Zeke) was put in that system and won the rushing title. Your examples are making a great case for Brady, keep up the good work Lee!

How is that a case for Brady? A system makes good players better (as I've been saying...Brady is good but the system makes him much better) which is the case with the Dallas Oline and Belichicks system. 

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Just now, LeeVanCleef said:

How is that a case for Brady? A system makes good players better (as I've been saying...Brady is good but the system makes him much better) which is the case with the Dallas Oline and Belichicks system. 

 

So Brady is just good? There's a difference between being good and one of the greatest of all time. The vibe you're giving off is that any QB put in Brady's position would have had similar success. But just like DMC vs Zeke, there's a huge difference because one player is elite and the other isn't. 

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