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So I am in a h2h categories league that is 7x7. Pitching categories are QS, IP, K, SV, W, ERA, and WHIP... we have a cap of 15 starts (starting roster is 7sp and 2rp)...

 

In order to maximize the categories every year I always keep 2-3 Long relievers with SP elig (last year, Devenski, Chad Green, Hader and Bradley). This worked beautifully as I won IP and K every week as well as ERA and WHIP (got lucky with those relievers and had jansen and kimbrel). People in my league were slow to get on this and didn't realize this loophole until one person finally picked up Bud Norris... 


Now this year onwards, it will be a race for the person who finds the next Devenski or Hader (all the pitchers above are now only RP). Any guesses on who long relievers we can fall into that is SP elig?

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14 minutes ago, illasakhil said:

So I am in a h2h categories league that is 7x7. Pitching categories are QS, IP, K, SV, W, ERA, and WHIP... we have a cap of 15 starts (starting roster is 7sp and 2rp)...

 

In order to maximize the categories every year I always keep 2-3 Long relievers with SP elig (last year, Devenski, Chad Green, Hader and Bradley). This worked beautifully as I won IP and K every week as well as ERA and WHIP (got lucky with those relievers and had jansen and kimbrel). People in my league were slow to get on this and didn't realize this loophole until one person finally picked up Bud Norris... 


Now this year onwards, it will be a race for the person who finds the next Devenski or Hader (all the pitchers above are now only RP). Any guesses on who long relievers we can fall into that is SP elig?

 

 

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A while back in this thread I mentioned that I'm all about the quantity over quality strategy of SPs, where I make sure I leave the draft with as many SP as possible (going light on bench bats and RP for a while) and then slowly thin the herd as guys either show promise or look droppable.

 

Well, it occurred to me recently that I'm sort of simulating this in my dynasty league this year, because I traded/dropped RPs to stream starters last year in a futile attempt to catch up to the eventual championship winner, so I entered the season with six or seven more arms than I could possibly keep on my roster this season, and just one closer.  It turns out that some of the late-season grabs ended up becoming pretty sought after in drafts this season, including guys like Bauer, Anderson, and Lamet.  All of these guys could be great, but there's certainly risk, so I'm hoping to use one or two as trade chips to upgrade elsewhere.  It's so rare that any of these guys turns into a fantasy ace quickly -- ace status needs to be earned over a lengthy period of time.

 

Is there a chance I'll give up early on the next Thor or Severino?  Perhaps, but there's no way all of these guys are going to pan out, so I think it makes sense to capitalize on the trade value that comes with owners in dynasty leagues looking to invest in upside at the beginning of the season.

 

The other thing I'm doing in that league -- I'm pretty much going stars and scrubs on the SP side.  I moved Arrieta, CarMart, and Samardzija in a big deal to get Chris Sale and some other pieces back -- my thinking on the pitching side of the deal was that none of those three guys is likely to be a fantasy ace this year -- CarMart could take the step forward, but we've been waiting a while, and it seems like he might just be a high-floor guy.  Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I like my chances better of identifying SP6s who can play as SP3s than I do knowing which SP2s will become SP1s each year.  Better to package a bunch of SP2/3 guys to get a true ace back.  A Chris Sale on your roster can cover for a lot of mistakes elsewhere.

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4 hours ago, handyandy86 said:

 

IP is the worst pitching category I've ever used.  Honestly it only benefits those who sit online all day and can stream to the max, and there's not a lot of talent or skill involved.  Load up on SP, use your max number of weekly adds on SP, and wrack up the IP.  Especially in today's game where starters are going fewer and fewer innings and bullpens are bigger and better than ever, IP is not hugely indicative of quality.  

 

I know QS has some flaws and is somewhat "arbitrary" in some people's minds, but I find it to be the best and fairest counting stat to use for SP.  And I know I've read people on here that used a 'modified' QS stat where they could select other circumstances it counted as a QS, such as 7+ IP and no more than 4 ER, 5 IP and no more than 2 ER, etc.  I would much rather pursue something along those lines than IP, personally.

 

Also I'm not sure if this was intentional or accidental, but you only have 4 pitching cats listed there - I'm assuming K or K/9 would be the 5th one.

No, were wanting to remove K's to reward good pitching regardless of how it gets done. We have no bench and a rule that must keep a pitcher 14 days before you can drop him, to prevent streaming. 

 

Racking up hollow innings would kill you in ratios, so I thought IP would be good in that it means you have to have good starters, or you'd be killing your ratios. Punting IP wouldn't be wise either, as it's now one of only 8 categories, so we wouldn't have any crazy 9RP rosters. 

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2 hours ago, mavsfan23 said:

No, were wanting to remove K's to reward good pitching regardless of how it gets done. We have no bench and a rule that must keep a pitcher 14 days before you can drop him, to prevent streaming. 

 

Racking up hollow innings would kill you in ratios, so I thought IP would be good in that it means you have to have good starters, or you'd be killing your ratios. Punting IP wouldn't be wise either, as it's now one of only 8 categories, so we wouldn't have any crazy 9RP rosters. 

Not a big fan of that at all. K's are an integral part of the game like a pitchers 'home run'. Should be a counting statistic.

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I'm drafting first overall in a 12 team standard 5x5 roto league.  Any suggestions on draft strategy, especially when it comes to finding starting pitchers?  In the mocks I've done, I'm finding it difficult to consistently get a couple good starters without having to reach for them.  Of course I'm not going to get any of the top four guys unless I want to go for one with my first pick, which I don't think is wise.

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I drafted verlander and archer as my aces, as well as Samardzija for his k’s and durability. Im a bit worried about my ratios, so I’m thinking of grabbing three elite middle relievers to help balance out my era and whip. I figure three guys like chad green, betances, and devenski that pitch 60 innings each should give my about 180 total innings of 2-3 era, 1.0 whip and some solid k’s throughout the year.

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1 hour ago, ktierne3 said:

I drafted verlander and archer as my aces, as well as Samardzija for his k’s and durability. Im a bit worried about my ratios, so I’m thinking of grabbing three elite middle relievers to help balance out my era and whip. I figure three guys like chad green, betances, and devenski that pitch 60 innings each should give my about 180 total innings of 2-3 era, 1.0 whip and some solid k’s throughout the year.

But that's also taking up 3 extremely valuable roster slots. Unless you have a deep league of course. 

 

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2 hours ago, rc10 said:

I'm drafting first overall in a 12 team standard 5x5 roto league.  Any suggestions on draft strategy, especially when it comes to finding starting pitchers?  In the mocks I've done, I'm finding it difficult to consistently get a couple good starters without having to reach for them.  Of course I'm not going to get any of the top four guys unless I want to go for one with my first pick, which I don't think is wise.

 

 

It shouldn't be that hard... you won't get one of the big 4 (probably.... they are typically all gone by middle of the 2nd) but you have a bunch of good options.  

 

In all honesty I probably wouldn't take one on the 2/3 turn but if you wanted say Bumgarner / Syndergard / Strasburg it wouldn't' be a colossal reach.  Having said that I'm basically always taking 2 bats.

 

On the 4/5 turn you should be looking at some combination of Verlander / Ohtani / Ray / Greinke / Severino / Darvish...   I'd be happy to own any, but if I could nab Severino or Verlander as my #1 I feel good about that.  

 

I would want 1 SP (maybe 2...no more than 2) by the end of round 5 at a minimum and you should be fine.

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On 3/12/2018 at 1:49 PM, handyandy86 said:

 

IP is the worst pitching category I've ever used.  Honestly it only benefits those who sit online all day and can stream to the max, and there's not a lot of talent or skill involved.  Load up on SP, use your max number of weekly adds on SP, and wrack up the IP.  Especially in today's game where starters are going fewer and fewer innings and bullpens are bigger and better than ever, IP is not hugely indicative of quality.  

 

I know QS has some flaws and is somewhat "arbitrary" in some people's minds, but I find it to be the best and fairest counting stat to use for SP.  And I know I've read people on here that used a 'modified' QS stat where they could select other circumstances it counted as a QS, such as 7+ IP and no more than 4 ER, 5 IP and no more than 2 ER, etc.  I would much rather pursue something along those lines than IP, personally.

 

Also I'm not sure if this was intentional or accidental, but you only have 4 pitching cats listed there - I'm assuming K or K/9 would be the 5th one.

That is false. We have IP and it works well because we have acq limit of 3 and Start limit of 15 per week.

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1 hour ago, LJJr said:

 

 

It shouldn't be that hard... you won't get one of the big 4 (probably.... they are typically all gone by middle of the 2nd) but you have a bunch of good options.  

 

In all honesty I probably wouldn't take one on the 2/3 turn but if you wanted say Bumgarner / Syndergard / Strasburg it wouldn't' be a colossal reach.  Having said that I'm basically always taking 2 bats.

 

On the 4/5 turn you should be looking at some combination of Verlander / Ohtani / Ray / Greinke / Severino / Darvish...   I'd be happy to own any, but if I could nab Severino or Verlander as my #1 I feel good about that.  

 

I would want 1 SP (maybe 2...no more than 2) by the end of round 5 at a minimum and you should be fine.

Thanks for the reply.  And yeah, the top four (and sometimes others) are always gone by my 2nd pick.  And I've been going with bats for my first three picks.  On my fourth/fifth pick, sometimes one of those starters I'm willing to get is available, and sometimes not.  In one mock I was able to get Ray, which I'd be pretty happy with.

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As I mock more I am personally noticing where im shifting to going all bats with maybe one SP then as we get around picks 75-100 just go all SP and get the guys you want (castillo godley weaver ohtani whoever it may be) so by the time your getting into the 110+ picks you have your bat core nailed down with 4 SP's you feel good about with one being your ace

 

 

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13 minutes ago, kmoore1521 said:

As I mock more I am personally noticing where im shifting to going all bats with maybe one SP then as we get around picks 75-100 just go all SP and get the guys you want (castillo godley weaver ohtani whoever it may be) so by the time your getting into the 110+ picks you have your bat core nailed down with 4 SP's you feel good about with one being your ace

 

 

 

This. I usually go hitter heavy every year anyway, but the talk so far has been that pitching is so scarce, you can’t wait.

 

I personally think you can still wait this season. But then again I’m a bigger believer in Nola, Paxton, Castillo than others. I’d be perfectly happy missing out on top 10 SPs and having those three as my trio starting rd 6. I think those guys have a chance at finishing inside top 10-15 if you don’t believe they aren’t there already.

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2 minutes ago, UberRebel said:

 

This. I usually go hitter heavy every year anyway, but the talk so far has been that pitching is so scarce, you can’t wait.

 

I personally think you can still wait this season. But then again I’m a bigger believer in Nola, Paxton, Castillo than others. I’d be perfectly happy missing out on top 10 SPs and having those three as my trio starting rd 6. I think those guys have a chance at finishing inside top 10-15 if you don’t believe they aren’t there already.

 

Yea ive noticed myself when i dont grab one of the big 5 SP

 

that ill snag like archer (rays homer here) or someone around that tier as my ace then grab all of castillo nola godley ohtani when possible once the hitter drop off (we all can kind of tell a point in the draft where we are like "meh" to EVERY bat left) happens which is usually toward the 75-90 range overall

 

id still want an "ace" so id recommend still grabbing a SP within the first 5 rounds 6th at the latest but you just gotta find the SP bargain because someone WILL fall and then boom theres your ace haha

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In h2h 5x5 if I grab Trea Turner in rnd 1, I'm considering Dee Gordon in rnd 2 then pitching early and often. In mocks my teams end up looking amazing in the 8 categories I concentrate on.

 

 

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Just now, turner46 said:

In h2h 5x5 if I grab Trea Turner in rnd 1, I'm considering Dee Gordon in rnd 2 then pitching early and often. In mocks my teams end up looking amazing in the 8 categories I concentrate on.

 

 

 risky to punt hitting like that mainly the RBI - HR cats

 

thats like punting rebounds and assists in basketball, verrry risky punting main stream categories

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2 hours ago, CrypTviLL said:

But that's also taking up 3 extremely valuable roster slots. Unless you have a deep league of course. 

 

I agree but it depends on which you think will be more valuable - Those three roster spots, or 180 innings pitched of elite k’s and ratios. Honestly I think both have a good case to be made and depend on your team and how you drafted. If you got chris sale and Carlos carrasco I don’t know that this is super useful. If you went heavy bats then I think this starts to look More attractive, especially as the season goes on and you know which of your sleepers broke out and which turned out to be busts. I also like this because it decreases risk in the sense that even if one guy goes down, you can pretty easily replace them with another good reliever on the wire. If one starter goes down, he’s much much harder to replace. 

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50 minutes ago, kmoore1521 said:

 risky to punt hitting like that mainly the RBI - HR cats

 

thats like punting rebounds and assists in basketball, verrry risky punting main stream categories

 

I'm gonna continue to do some mocks, but only works with a early to mid pick or if Trea falls but then grabbing Dee earlier in the 2nd doesnt make much sense.

 

Draft is Sunday for me so have time to mock.

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2 hours ago, illasakhil said:

That is false. We have IP and it works well because we have acq limit of 3 and Start limit of 15 per week.

 

To each their own, but I still don't see the 'skill' and predictability of IP as a category.  You can make any category work if you introduce enough controls around it, like you seem to have, but a stat like QS means a lot more about the effectiveness of the pitching, to me.  I guess that's what makes fantasy baseball interesting, there are an almost unlimited number of stat combinations you can count in your league.

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2 hours ago, kmoore1521 said:

As I mock more I am personally noticing where im shifting to going all bats with maybe one SP then as we get around picks 75-100 just go all SP and get the guys you want (castillo godley weaver ohtani whoever it may be) so by the time your getting into the 110+ picks you have your bat core nailed down with 4 SP's you feel good about with one being your ace

 

 

 

I did this in a H2H 5x5 I recently drafted for.  I didn't take a pitcher until pick 81, loaded up on hitters, and then did a mini run on SP's to build what I felt like was a fairly strong staff.  I ended up with Alex Wood, G. Cole, K. Hendricks, L. Weaver, D. Duffy, and C. Anderson.  Obviously there is some risk in these pitchers, which is why they're going where they are, but I feel pretty good about ending up with some solid pitching out of a few of them.  

 

I honestly don't feel any less certain about these guys than I would about the tier above, with pitchers like Archer, Ohtani, C-Mart, etc. and at their draft prices I won't feel too bad if they bomb.

 

1 hour ago, turner46 said:

In h2h 5x5 if I grab Trea Turner in rnd 1, I'm considering Dee Gordon in rnd 2 then pitching early and often. In mocks my teams end up looking amazing in the 8 categories I concentrate on.

 

 

 

That's an interesting strategy, and I wouldn't even necessarily call it "punting" HR and RBI since you can usually get good value there later.  I can't remember who it was, but there was a guy on here last year in this thread that talked about using early picks on pitching and speed guys, and then he was able to get cheap power in the mid to late rounds.

 

It kind of made sense to me because there has been such a power surge recently.  I don't think you'll finish as a top performer in those categories, but you can still be middle of the pack in power stats if everything breaks right when just taking power bats later.  Consider where guys like Gallo, or even Trumbo or Chris Davis are going in drafts.

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12 minutes ago, handyandy86 said:

 

I did this in a H2H 5x5 I recently drafted for.  I didn't take a pitcher until pick 81, loaded up on hitters, and then did a mini run on SP's to build what I felt like was a fairly strong staff.  I ended up with Alex Wood, G. Cole, K. Hendricks, L. Weaver, D. Duffy, and C. Anderson.  Obviously there is some risk in these pitchers, which is why they're going where they are, but I feel pretty good about ending up with some solid pitching out of a few of them.  

 

I honestly don't feel any less certain about these guys than I would about the tier above, with pitchers like Archer, Ohtani, C-Mart, etc. and at their draft prices I won't feel too bad if they bomb.

 

 

That's an interesting strategy, and I wouldn't even necessarily call it "punting" HR and RBI since you can usually get good value there later.  I can't remember who it was, but there was a guy on here last year in this thread that talked about using early picks on pitching and speed guys, and then he was able to get cheap power in the mid to late rounds.

 

It kind of made sense to me because there has been such a power surge recently.  I don't think you'll finish as a top performer in those categories, but you can still be middle of the pack in power stats if everything breaks right when just taking power bats later.  Consider where guys like Gallo, or even Trumbo or Chris Davis are going in drafts.

 

Power is cheaper these days and in greater supply. But I’m personally not comfortable counting on the guys that only last year hit 35+ HRs. You never know if the juice ball era is here to stay. 

 

This is is why I’m going (reliable and proven) Power/AVG early and not SB/AVG.

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9 minutes ago, UberRebel said:

 

Power is cheaper these days and in greater supply. But I’m personally not comfortable counting on the guys that only last year hit 35+ HRs. You never know if the juice ball era is here to stay. 

 

This is is why I’m going (reliable and proven) Power/AVG early and not SB/AVG.

IF the juiced ball isn't here to stay all power hitters should go down the same amount (discounting Stanton and a few others) so it shouldn't make a difference. It is the launch angle group that I would worry more about as I think a lot of the newer power numbers are due to the ball being juiced.

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13 minutes ago, Low and Away said:

IF the juiced ball isn't here to stay all power hitters should go down the same amount (discounting Stanton and a few others) so it shouldn't make a difference. It is the launch angle group that I would worry more about as I think a lot of the newer power numbers are due to the ball being juiced.

 

My logic works kinda the opposite way. I would think if the balls were "de-juiced" then the ones losing more HRs will be the ones who made no adjustments to their swing to explain the extra HRs. These will be the guys still hitting at sub optimal LA's and missing the extra pop off the bat to make up for it. 

 

The LA guys made a measurable change to their swing and saw good results. Regardless of the juice level of the balls, ideal launch angles will always be more conducive to HRs. 

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Another Reason it works is because we have QS as well.

15 hours ago, handyandy86 said:

 

To each their own, but I still don't see the 'skill' and predictability of IP as a category.  You can make any category work if you introduce enough controls around it, like you seem to have, but a stat like QS means a lot more about the effectiveness of the pitching, to me.  I guess that's what makes fantasy baseball interesting, there are an almost unlimited number of stat combinations you can count in your league.

 

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I am new to Roto 5x5. 

 

In order to well in stolen bases is it necessary to draft a player with a higher stolen base total or can I spread out the total with players that steal 6-10?  If I want to do well in stolen bases what should I expect my highest total for stolen bases by a player be?

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