Sign in to follow this  
Lifschitz

Alex Len 2017 - 2018 Season Outlook

Recommended Posts

The recent DNP for all the Suns centers seems to be a hot potato game. But I feel like of the three, Len has best chance moving forward, if owners have the patience to hold on to him. 

 

I feel like a second half turnaround from this kid, and he will get the most minutes out of the three. Fingers crossed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, NBA_OG said:

The recent DNP for all the Suns centers seems to be a hot potato game. But I feel like of the three, Len has best chance moving forward, if owners have the patience to hold on to him. 

 

I feel like a second half turnaround from this kid, and he will get the most minutes out of the three. Fingers crossed.

I don't think this is going to stop, frankly.  I understand the allure and I get even two (to say nothing of three) good games in a row are going to set people off.  But most of us are in leagues where they're either weekly or have weekly pickup limits in daily leagues and I honestly think if you pursue this you're going to be chasing your own tail all year long.  Just as many missed good games (as in, one center did have a rosterable game but you don't have him or worse, you have one of the others and you started them) as actually started good games.

 

As someone who suffered through the three-headed Knicks center thing at the end of last year in a weekly league (so I could usually get at least one good game out a week, sometimes two), this is not worth the headache.  I promise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Tom Chambers said:

I don't think this is going to stop, frankly.  I understand the allure and I get even two (to say nothing of three) good games in a row are going to set people off.  But most of us are in leagues where they're either weekly or have weekly pickup limits in daily leagues and I honestly think if you pursue this you're going to be chasing your own tail all year long.  Just as many missed good games (as in, one center did have a rosterable game but you don't have him or worse, you have one of the others and you started them) as actually started good games.

 

As someone who suffered through the three-headed Knicks center thing at the end of last year in a weekly league (so I could usually get at least one good game out a week, sometimes two), this is not worth the headache.  I promise.

 

The value of full 30 minutes to Len and the numbers he put up from those minutes, to me, is what makes him worth holding on to. Also factor in Chandler's number of games played last year (47), I am hoping for a Monroe buy-out or trade in the near future.

 

Only time will tell. I think some one mentioned a Mike James extension is coming and someone needs to be released. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, NBA_OG said:

 

The value of full 30 minutes to Len and the numbers he put up from those minutes, to me, is what makes him worth holding on to. Also factor in Chandler's number of games played last year (47), I am hoping for a Monroe buy-out or trade in the near future.

 

Only time will tell. I think some one mentioned a Mike James extension is coming and someone needs to be released. 

I mean, you're every Kyle O'Quinn owner last year saying every time he got minutes, he was good.  They weren't wrong.  The trick is figuring out when Len is gonna get the minutes and when he's not.  When you get it down to a science, you can make some money letting other people know because they'll win a lot of matchups with that info.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Tom Chambers said:

I mean, you're every Kyle O'Quinn owner last year saying every time he got minutes, he was good.  They weren't wrong.  The trick is figuring out when Len is gonna get the minutes and when he's not.  When you get it down to a science, you can make some money letting other people know because they'll win a lot of matchups with that info.

 

O'Quinn is the same case this year (but even more so), he's doing even better than at any point in his career when he's received big minutes. He just can't keep his fouls down. For me it's a toss up between he and Len for whom to replace Dedmon on my IL. I like both, but I took O'Quinn, he seems like he'd step into a major role if Kanter's back keeps flaring up, and he's providing nice floor value as well. He's their best defensive big men other than Porzingis. I just wish he'd receive 20+ minutes every game instead of going down to 15-16 (he's still producing even in limited minutes here, so the floor is relatively safe). 

 

Getting Len down to a science is tough  one game against Chicago he sucked, and then the next game he blew up, so he's not even matchup-proof. 

 

Edited by Lifschitz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Tom Chambers said:

I mean, you're every Kyle O'Quinn owner last year saying every time he got minutes, he was good.  They weren't wrong.  The trick is figuring out when Len is gonna get the minutes and when he's not.  When you get it down to a science, you can make some money letting other people know because they'll win a lot of matchups with that info.

 

Ofcourse, only the Suns management has the insight, I can only speculate. But we speculate with the information that is available and the rest is ofcourse, the need for a little luck and some risk taking. This is not to say one doesn't have a line drawn on when to cut the losses. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, NBA_OG said:

 

Ofcourse, only the Suns management has the insight, I can only speculate. But we speculate with the information that is available and the rest is ofcourse, the need for a little luck and some risk taking. This is not to say one doesn't have a line drawn on when to cut the losses. 

 

 

There are legitimate free agents that haven't been signed because of the way the new CBA is structured, the amount of talent in the league, and the new TV deal not being as lucrative as owners thought it would be. Even guys like Spencer Hawes are out there floating around. The reason I mention this is simple, no one is willing to take on Tyson Chandler until he becomes an expiring contract next year. What's more maddening is that they aren't even shutting this guy down or relegating him to a bench role and drawing a clear line in the sand that Len is the starter. The Suns just aren't centered around their bigs, they use them the way the Warriors use McGee, for rebounding / defense / garbage buckets - this is why they aren't making it a priority to start him, they know he's not a star talent.  

 

We've seen situations like Milwaukee and the Kings back court, it's often best to avoid committee approaches unless a guy is a head above everyone else talent wise. I'm not sure you can make the argument Len is even better than Chandler as of right now at his advanced age, and that's saying something. 

 

Until we see him at least string together 3-4 games where he's the unquestioned starter or get confirmation from Triano that it will be the case from here on out, then he'll continue doing what he's been doing up to now - being inconsistent, because he's not a special talent like I thought he was in College, he's a middle of the road big man who's an extremely adept rebounder with mechanical post skills. 

 

The one plus to stashing him away is what most have been saying here, he has season-long upside on a bad team where they could just run him out there 25 minutes a night solid as a starter with no more DNP-CDs or 15 minute games. Contrary to that, we could also keep seeing them do what Watson did last year even when they were tanking - play Chriss / Bender / Chandler a handful of minutes at C with Len in the mix as well. 

 

Edited by Lifschitz
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Len is by far the superior center, it's horrifying that he's not starting and averaging 30+ minutes a game.  Let's hope this drama comes to a conclusion by Dec 5th, I believe that's when the Suns need to trade/cut a player to add Mike James.. hopefully Monroe or Chandler is gone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can any actually Suns fans chime in with an opinion? I feel it's just people who see Len puts up stats when given minutes and assume he's a star who should be getting 30+ mins every night. I'm not gonna lie I haven't watched many Suns games recently and for all I know he could absolutely suck as an NBA caliber player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, gregoden said:

Can any actually Suns fans chime in with an opinion? I feel it's just people who see Len puts up stats when given minutes and assume he's a star who should be getting 30+ mins every night. I'm not gonna lie I haven't watched many Suns games recently and for all I know he could absolutely suck as an NBA caliber player.

 

A sucky NBA player doesn't get you close to double double with limited minutes. 

 

But does his game actually fit in with what Suns are trying to accomplish in terms of offense and defense? That would be another question. 

 

It's not easy to put up double doubles in the NBA. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Got him back. :ph34r:

If he has 4 games a week, sits one(lol), less than 20 min in another, but has two monster performances racking up 30-40 boards, 20pts, 2-4 blocks, and good %.... is that worth rostering? Any doubt there is in his minutes currently, seems to be negated by his hustle/energy when he actually get on the floor. And since boards are his strength, thats a little easier to pencil him in for, as opposed to penciling in a scorer for points & good % or a guard blowing up for assist - because shots have to actually fall to get value. With rebounding once he grabs it, we're golden. 

 

If you believe in his ROS outlook, and have space on the end of your roster (not including stream spot) he can be viewed as a basic FA like the rest of the wire, who could swing your matchup here and there, until he's in the position we believe he'll eventually be in.

 

I'm looking at my players' stats from each of the past weeks to see how his output (although sporadic) compares agaisnts other players on my team. I think it's good enough OVERALL (maybe not game to game) output, to warrant stashing until something stabilizes, or a trade goes down.

 

But like I said I already lost Warren to lack of patience here, and I'm in a DD league - so I'm coming from that perspective. 

 

MIN FGM/FGA FG% FTM/FTA FT% 3PM REB AST STL BLK DD PTS

Last 7

22.0 3.3/7.7 .435 0.7/1.3 .500 0.0 11.0 0.7 0.0 1.0 0.3 7.3

Last 15

23.5 3.8/7.7 .500 2.0/2.8 .706 0.0 12.0 1.0 0.0 1.0 0.3 9.7

Last 30 - 

23.1 2.9/6.1 .484 2.7/3.6 .741 0.0 9.8 0.9 0.3 1.0 0.2 8.5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we stop boiling this down to a science? We get it, the rotations are wonky. It's pretty simple, you hold him till the deadline of Dec 5th-7th and see if anything materializes.... he should be treated as a third-fourth string center on your squad, not your #2 source of production. Benching him here in a 12-league/9cat/weekly unless i got nobody to use, which then I'll fire him up and have little expectations. Worst comes to worst = drop city

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/28/2017 at 10:02 PM, affliction said:

We get it you think he sucks.

 

13/18

 

4 mins left


We get it you love him

 

4/3 on 2/7 shooting

 

Game over

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jake the snake said:


We get it you love him

 

4/3 on 2/7 shooting

 

Game over

1 game he played 17 mins the other 30.

 

We can probably play this game all year but I think you would enjoy it a little too much.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, affliction said:

1 game he played 17 mins the other 30.

 

We can probably play this game all year but I think you would enjoy it a little too much.

 

 

Well That's the point. One game he played 17 the other 30.... who TF has time to put up with that all year. Good luck y'all. If Chandler gets moved then I'll be back, until then not wasting my time and effort on Len.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, affliction said:

1 game he played 17 mins the other 30.

 

We can probably play this game all year but I think you would enjoy it a little too much.

 

 

 So much...the fact that you say we can play it all year says everything you need to know about Alex Len

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here are some positives I can take away from stashing Len:

 

1. Phoenix is a mediocre team. Monroe is more than likely to get traded and it feels like they're showcasing him right now, and Chandler will likely become bench fodder as the season progresses.

 

2. The league is thin on Centers, the value of Len as others have alluded to is being a per-minute double monster, decent efficiency for FG% / FT%, and some blocked shots. A lot of injuries are also happening to bigs right now, which only gives more value to guys like Len (Jokic going down, Griffin as a PF/C down, Dedmon down, Turner down, Embiid is likely one bad fall away from an injury, and so forth). 

 

C is the thinnest position on the wire, so that does give some serious value to him. We just want his DNP-CDs to disappear - as long as that happens I can live with him playing 15 minutes one game and 25 the next, the stats average out over the course of a weekly head to head matchup. 

 

3. He's the youngest Center with the most upside on the roster, they can't play Chriss out of position because he has a horrible BBIQ, and Bender isn't ready to be a moderate role player for at least 2 more years. He also fits a mobile small ball rebounding/defensive/low-key offensive guy. Let's say you run a Ulis / Booker / Josh Jackson / Warren type line up, well you can't have neither Chriss or Bender manning the middle there, but you can definitely argue for Len. 

 

Edited by Lifschitz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Jake the snake said:

 So much...the fact that you say we can play it all year says everything you need to know about Alex Len

Or it says everything you need to know about the Phoenix organization. It all depends on if you think he is garbage or actually has talent. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, affliction said:

Or it says everything you need to know about the Phoenix organization. It all depends on if you think he is garbage or actually has talent. 

 

Don't think anyone is questioning his talents, its whether he has the mental side of the game to deliver on that talent and physical attributes. Does he have Gasol type court smarts or Valanciunas type court smarts. There is a lot of data on this guy that says its the latter

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Tr3yball said:

When did he even injure his ankle?! From the 16 mins he had of being s---? This guy is the worst. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this