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Minnesota Vikings 2018 Outlook

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27 minutes ago, South Carolina said:

 

Nope, missed that one to. How did he do?

 

Liar. You're an Eagles fan. Of course you saw that game...you were bragging about it all over these forums. 

 

Try the truth next time. 

 

 

 

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27 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

 

Then you should ask the HC because he has been telegraphing since Bradford went down that Keenum wasn't the right fit for his offense and proved it by signing Kirk Cousins.

 

He signed Cousins because he's a better QB. Nothing more. 

 

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The biggest indicator that Keenum was subpar was at the end of the season which everyone claims was amazing, he had 3500yds and only 21 tds. He played 14.5 games. Those stats are awful for the "3rd best passing offense". 21tds is what Deshaun Watson had in 6 games. I'll give Keenum credit where due, he's a decent game manager but he's a terrible qb

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28 minutes ago, joshua18 said:

 

He signed Cousins because he's a better QB. Nothing more. 

 

 

Stop. The HC was signaling all season Keenum wasnt his guy and if he thought he was he would have kept him.  The Vikings made it to the NFC championship with keenum if the HC had confidence in him he would have not let him go.  obviously he believes better QB play is what they need to win a SB.

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25 minutes ago, Peaceout72 said:

The biggest indicator that Keenum was subpar was at the end of the season which everyone claims was amazing, he had 3500yds and only 21 tds. He played 14.5 games. Those stats are awful for the "3rd best passing offense". 21tds is what Deshaun Watson had in 6 games. I'll give Keenum credit where due, he's a decent game manager but he's a terrible qb

 

 

 

 

In 2017, Minnesota’s Case Keenum (58.5) and New England’s Tom Brady (54.0) led all quarterbacks in QBR under pressure with marks that rank among the top 10 in all seasons tracked since 2009.

 

...

 

Keenum also led all quarterbacks in Football Outsiders’ passing Defense-adjusted Value Over Average metric, which measures efficiency, and he may just be the least likely quarterback to do so since 1986.

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-tom-brady-and-case-keenum-do-better-than-anyone-else/

 

 

 

Keenum so far this season ranks No. 6 in Total QBR among all NFL QBs. He’s No. 5 in DYAR and No. 4 in DVOA. There are only three QBs in the NFL who are in the top six in all three categories: Tom Brady, DeShaun Watson and Keenum.

 

http://m.startribune.com/case-keenum-is-having-the-best-year-by-a-vikings-qb-since-brett-favre-in-2009/454483333/

 

 

 

Only a year removed from a disastrous stint with the Los Angeles Rams, Keenum finished the 2017 regular season with a league-high 28.2% DVOA. He had other great stats as well, finishing ninth with 7.03 adjusted net yards per attempt and fourth with a 1.46 percent interception rate. By many statistical measures, Keenum was a superb quarterback, but the film did not always show him to be the core of Minnesota's offense.

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/index.php?q=film-room/2018/film-room-case-keenum

 

 

 

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51 minutes ago, joshua18 said:

 

Liar. You're an Eagles fan. Of course you saw that game...you were bragging about it all over these forums. 

 

Try the truth next time. 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, you threw me a softball there. No Keenum hate here, I just don't get the praise. He did what he was supposed to do. Nothing special. 

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53 minutes ago, joshua18 said:

 

He signed Cousins because he's a better QB. Nothing more. 

 

 

Agree, but now we see what Cousins is made of. Is anything less than a Superbowl appearance acceptable?

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3 minutes ago, South Carolina said:

 

Agree, but now we see what Cousins is made of. Is anything less than a Superbowl appearance acceptable?

 

he's not gonna win one, so don't worry about it

 

 

26 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

Stop. The HC was signaling all season Keenum wasnt his guy and if he thought he was he would have kept him.  The Vikings made it to the NFC championship with keenum if the HC had confidence in him he would have not let him go.  obviously he believes better QB play is what they need to win a SB.

 

I'm sure giving up first round picks for both Bradford and Bridgewater had nothing to do with that at all

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24 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

 

 

 

 

In 2017, Minnesota’s Case Keenum (58.5) and New England’s Tom Brady (54.0) led all quarterbacks in QBR under pressure with marks that rank among the top 10 in all seasons tracked since 2009.

 

...

 

Keenum also led all quarterbacks in Football Outsiders’ passing Defense-adjusted Value Over Average metric, which measures efficiency, and he may just be the least likely quarterback to do so since 1986.

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-tom-brady-and-case-keenum-do-better-than-anyone-else/

 

 

 

Keenum so far this season ranks No. 6 in Total QBR among all NFL QBs. He’s No. 5 in DYAR and No. 4 in DVOA. There are only three QBs in the NFL who are in the top six in all three categories: Tom Brady, DeShaun Watson and Keenum.

 

http://m.startribune.com/case-keenum-is-having-the-best-year-by-a-vikings-qb-since-brett-favre-in-2009/454483333/

 

 

 

Only a year removed from a disastrous stint with the Los Angeles Rams, Keenum finished the 2017 regular season with a league-high 28.2% DVOA. He had other great stats as well, finishing ninth with 7.03 adjusted net yards per attempt and fourth with a 1.46 percent interception rate. By many statistical measures, Keenum was a superb quarterback, but the film did not always show him to be the core of Minnesota's offense.

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/index.php?q=film-room/2018/film-room-case-keenum

 

 

 

In that case, I would have to say DVOA might not be the most useful metric.  I saw a quarterback out there lobbing balls in the general direction of his receivers.  Even Matt Leinert completed some passes to Larry Fitzgerald.  But when Kurt Warner took over the job, Warner was hitting Fitz in stride with pinpoint passes.  Going from Keenum to Cousins is going to be like that for Minnesota's pass catchers.  It will be glorious!  You heard it here first. :D

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you are the most biased person in this thread, nobody cares what you saw. numbers don't lie

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2 hours ago, Sternes said:

 

 

Who is running around saying he is elite or an MVP?  Also, when did the Vikings WR suddenly become Randy Moss and Cris Carter?  I keep hearing how elite they are, now, after the season. I didn't hear anyone say that before the season.  Now, they apparently carried Keenum through the season who is, listening to people, Kizer-lite.

 

I'm also baffled by this whole magical "elite" QB who runs around winning games for people.  A great QB can do that.  It doesn't just happen because he is elite.  How many of those are there in the league?  There are a lot of guys who are PAID like it.  I'd say Brady, Rodgers, and Brees are there.

 

People act like Keenum to Cousins is Hundley to Rodgers.  The curious attitude that seems to prevail right now is that Keenum was somehow holding the team back.  That is the part I don't understand.

 

I'd put Russell Wilson in that list...what he has done with probably the worst offensive line in the leagues is pretty amazing.  Beyond Doug Baldwin..his wide receivers have been pretty average as well.

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6 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

you are the most biased person in this thread, nobody cares what you saw. numbers don't lie

Numbers lie all the time.  I think Minnesota's numbers are going to be much better in 2018 because Cousins is miles better than Keenum at throwing the football to receivers.  And your argument is that...Keenum was really good?  Speilman and Zimmer did not think so, apparently.  Maybe they are biased.

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2 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

Numbers lie all the time.  I think Minnesota's numbers are going to be much better in 2018 because Cousins is miles better than Keenum at throwing the football to receivers.  And your argument is that...Keenum was really good?  Speilman and Zimmer did not think so, apparently.  Maybe they are biased.

 

can't wait to hear you crying about Cousins re: Diggs inefficiency next season

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1 hour ago, dashoe said:

 

 

Then you should ask the HC because he has been telegraphing since Bradford went down that Keenum wasn't the right fit for his offense and proved it by signing Kirk Cousins.

 

I don't think it had much to do with what Zimmer thought of Keenum as a QB.  His point was basically why does he have to name Keenum his starting QB for the rest of the season, the media doesn't ask him every week if any other player on the team is the starter for the rest of the season at their respective position.  

 

They also hired a new offensive coordinator this offseason, my guess is he had as much if not more say in who he wanted at QB than Zimmer does,=.  Zimmer has been known to not have much input on the offensive side of the ball, that's why he's typically hired experienced offensive coordinators.

 

 

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1 minute ago, SharkSwimmer said:

Numbers lie all the time.  I think Minnesota's numbers are going to be much better in 2018 because Cousins is miles better than Keenum at throwing the football to receivers.  And your argument is that...Keenum was really good?  Speilman and Zimmer did not think so, apparently.  Maybe they are biased.

 

 

I don't know how you can argue with the fact that they let the QB who helped them get to the NFC title game walk and signed a QB who has never won a playoff game to a $84mm guaranteed.  Keenum was not the QB they wanted or they believe is good enough to get them a title. it's really that simple, no need to talk about his QBR and stats. The money is doing all of the talking

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2 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

 

can't wait to hear you crying about Cousins re: Diggs inefficiency next season

I will be singing.  It's not too late for you to board the train with me.  Diggs is going to be NFC Antonio Brown.  We'll both laugh all the way to the bank.

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1 minute ago, murraygd13 said:

 

I don't think it had much to do with what Zimmer thought of Keenum as a QB.  His point was basically why does he have to name Keenum his starting QB for the rest of the season, the media doesn't ask him every week if any other player on the team is the starter for the rest of the season at their respective position.  

 

They also hired a new offensive coordinator this offseason, my guess is he had as much if not more say in who he wanted at QB than Zimmer does,=.  Zimmer has been known to not have much input on the offensive side of the ball, that's why he's typically hired experienced offensive coordinators.

 

 

 

 

Dude keenum is gone that says everything about how the organization viewed him as the piece of their SB aspirations. I'm not sure what guys are defending about Keenum here. he is a good QB but not good enough for the vikings.

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2 minutes ago, SharkSwimmer said:

I will be singing.  It's not too late for you to board the train with me.  Diggs is going to be NFC Antonio Brown.  We'll both laugh all the way to the bank.

 

he'll be lucky to break the top 20 (again). I owned Diggs his rookie year, I've been on that train. but the hype is out of control

 

3 minutes ago, dashoe said:

 

 

I don't know how you can argue with the fact that they let the QB who helped them get to the NFC title game walk and signed a QB who has never won a playoff game to a $84mm guaranteed.  Keenum was not the QB they wanted or they believe is good enough to get them a title. it's really that simple, no need to talk about his QBR and stats. The money is doing all of the talking

 

let's just go ahead and forget about that "elite" defense that gave up 62 points in the playoffs

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2 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

 

 

 

 

let's just go ahead and forget about that "elite" defense that gave us 62 points in the playoffs

 

 

Didn't they just sign Sheldon Richardson?:D

 

Vikings are shooting for this SB making serious FA signings

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5 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

let's just go ahead and forget about that "elite" defense that gave up 62 points in the playoffs

 

The horrible pick-six Keenum threw against Philly accounted for some of those points.  Here we see a nice example of how numbers can lie.  You are blaming all of the points on Minny's D, yet they weren't even on the field for Patrick Robinson's game-changing, back-breaking touchdown.  Your boy Case Keenum was, though.

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1 minute ago, SharkSwimmer said:

 

The horrible pick-six Keenum threw against Philly accounted for some of those points.  Here we see a nice example of how numbers can lie.  You are blaming all of the points on Minny's D, yet they weren't even on the field for Patrick Robinson's game-changing, back-breaking touchdown.  Your boy Case Keenum was, though.

 

congrats, your amazing defense only gave up 56 points in the playoffs

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Just now, dashoe said:

 

Eagles were not favored either but they won. I don't put much weight into paper forecasts aside from enteratining reading material.

 

I don't even like Florio, but I think the takeaway of tempering your expectation could not be more relevant than it is now for this team. Minnesota should know how this story goes by now

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23 minutes ago, lolcopter said:

 

I don't even like Florio, but I think the takeaway of tempering your expectation could not be more relevant than it is now for this team. Minnesota should know how this story goes by now

Minnesota had no business defeating New Orleans or any other playoff caliber team with Keenum at the helm.  They did beat the Saints, but it took a miracle.  Then they got wood-shedded in Philly.  I believe the main thing holding them back has now been swapped out for a much better player.  So my expectations for Minnesota in 2018 are quite high.

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