JFS179

Mar/April Closer Thread 2018

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Post Hype Sleeper Alert:  

Bruce Rondon, RP Chw

A blast from the past re-emerging on the closer radar????

 

This could just be early optimism, but Bruce Rondon has looked really sharp to start the 2018 season.  Though it seems like he has been around forever (since 2013 to be exact), he is still somehow only 27 years old.  However, could this be the season he finally puts it together?  He is displaying the same howitzer fastball (98.4 last time out; topping out at 100.1 mph), an improved command (0BB; 6K between AAA & MLB), along with a more versatile mix of pitches ( utilizing his change-up a bit more).  The slider has looked fantastic, with 3 swinging strikes of 9 sliders in his first outing against Detroit.  With aging Joakim Soria and walking infirmary Nate Jones the only obstacles between himself and a ninth inning role in a wide-open Chicago bullpen, could he finally realize the potential that many of us got behind a half decade ago.

 

  

 

 

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39 minutes ago, handyandy86 said:

I'm no medical expert, but a stem cell injection for Melancon seems like a desperation move.  Basically Andrews said there is nothing wrong with his ligaments and that the pronator muscle is just not responding or growing.  As far as I can tell, a stem cell injection is just trying to spark off some kind of life or growth in that muscle.  Does anyone know the success rate of something like that?

 

Either way, it seems like Melancon is going to need some sort of medical miracle to have that muscle strong enough to pitch anytime soon.

I can't find anything on stem cell.  But I did notice this note from last year:

 

'Frighteningly, this is the same condition that former Giants’ starting pitcher Noah Lowery was diagnosed with, an issue which essentially ended his career after undergoing surgery in 2008. On the other hand, former Cardinals pitcher Kyle Lohse also had the procedure done in 2010, and was able to bounce back with four solid seasons where he posted a combined ERA of 3.28 with St. Louis and Milwaukee."

 

http://www.knbr.com/2017/09/04/mark-melancon-confirms-hell-undergo-surgery-for-rare-muscular-syndrome-report/

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12 hours ago, bigbossman said:

How close is Vizcaino from losing his job? 

 

Covered in detail a few pages back.  Again, the red dot/star next to the thread is your friend.

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1 hour ago, handyandy86 said:

I'm no medical expert, but a stem cell injection for Melancon seems like a desperation move.  Basically Andrews said there is nothing wrong with his ligaments and that the pronator muscle is just not responding or growing.  As far as I can tell, a stem cell injection is just trying to spark off some kind of life or growth in that muscle.  Does anyone know the success rate of something like that?

 

Either way, it seems like Melancon is going to need some sort of medical miracle to have that muscle strong enough to pitch anytime soon.

 

I think he's cooked ... I've thought that for a while.  Again, the Chronicle article which I posted either at the start of this thread or the end of the offseason thread had specific quotes from Melancon about the muscle being gray and sort of dead, and the surgeon being "shocked."  

 

They're putting lipstick on a pig here and trying to tell a happy story, but I'll be floored if this ends well.  I could see him trying to make it back, having setback after setback, and ultimately getting bombed in middle relief if he does make it.

 

It's sad for the guy's career to end like this, but that article talked about the blood supply to the muscle effectively being pinched and shut off, which caused the muscle to die.  I'm not a medical expert, but I also can't see it just coming back to life with stem cells.

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What is everyone's thoughts on Barraclough?  Could he replace Ziegler soon? 

 

I've always like Barraclough's stuff and he has K upside so if he is able to supplant Ziegler I think he would have sneaky value.

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4 minutes ago, Zig Zag said:

What is everyone's thoughts on Barraclough?  Could he replace Ziegler soon? 

 

I've always like Barraclough's stuff and he has K upside so if he is able to supplant Ziegler I think he would have sneaky value.

They have been talking up Barraclough for 2 years now. I think he walks too many guys to be successful. 

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7 minutes ago, Zig Zag said:

What is everyone's thoughts on Barraclough?  Could he replace Ziegler soon? 

 

I've always like Barraclough's stuff and he has K upside so if he is able to supplant Ziegler I think he would have sneaky value.

 

I think Drew Steckenrider has as good a chance as BearClaw at taking over the closer role for the Marlins.

 

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I too see Steckenrider as next in line in Miami even though most websites have Barraclough as the next man up. Barraclough does walk too many batters to be a successful closer 

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1 hour ago, Zig Zag said:

What is everyone's thoughts on Barraclough?  Could he replace Ziegler soon? 

 

I've always like Barraclough's stuff and he has K upside so if he is able to supplant Ziegler I think he would have sneaky value.

I too agree, as I posted on this thread earlier in the week, that Steckenrider will be next man up.  

 

Barraclough's looked very pedestrian thus far.  His command has always wavered, but most alarming behind his auspicious 2018 numbers,  is a noticeable velocity decrease (93.7 down from 95.2).  

 

On the other hand, "Steck" has been near flawless with a 8:1 K/BB ratio, 0.00 ERA & a 0.75 WHIP.  Its also worth noting that Mattingly chose Steckenrider to close a game during spring, perhaps foreshadowing the future.

 

Theres no doubt that Ziegler's hold on the Marlins closer gig will be short lived, and I suspect Drew to separate himself in the battle of heir to the first chair.

 

 

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1 hour ago, JFS179 said:

 

I think he's cooked ... I've thought that for a while.  Again, the Chronicle article which I posted either at the start of this thread or the end of the offseason thread had specific quotes from Melancon about the muscle being gray and sort of dead, and the surgeon being "shocked."  

 

They're putting lipstick on a pig here and trying to tell a happy story, but I'll be floored if this ends well.  I could see him trying to make it back, having setback after setback, and ultimately getting bombed in middle relief if he does make it.

 

It's sad for the guy's career to end like this, but that article talked about the blood supply to the muscle effectively being pinched and shut off, which caused the muscle to die.  I'm not a medical expert, but I also can't see it just coming back to life with stem cells.

 

He's done imo.  At least for this season. What I'm really trying to figure out now is who's next in line if Strickland starts to struggle.  

 

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12 minutes ago, F@ndemonium said:

I too agree, as I posted on this thread earlier in the week, that Steckenrider will be next man up.  

 

Barraclough's looked very pedestrian thus far.  His command has always wavered, but most alarming behind his auspicious 2018 numbers,  is a noticeable velocity decrease (93.7 down from 95.2).  

 

On the other hand, "Steck" has been near flawless with a 8:1 K/BB ratio, 0.00 ERA & a 0.75 WHIP.  Its also worth noting that Mattingly chose Steckenrider to close a game during spring, perhaps foreshadowing the future.

 

Theres no doubt that Ziegler's hold on the Marlins closer gig will be short lived, and I suspect Drew to separate himself in the battle of heir to the first chair.

 

 

 

This. 

 

Streckenrider has clearly been better.   Only issue is if they decide to make him their "Miller".  But if I'm saves speculating I'm going with Streckenrider.

 

This Miami team is horrific but they should still generate 40ish save opps over the course of the year. 

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What are everyone's thoughts on Greg Holland?   He has looked pretty terrible so far in the short sample size, but if you take into consideration his 2nd half last year as well his numbers are just awful.   Certainly not someone you can have much faith/confidence in.

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9 minutes ago, Zig Zag said:

What are everyone's thoughts on Greg Holland?   He has looked pretty terrible so far in the short sample size, but if you take into consideration his 2nd half last year as well his numbers are just awful.   Certainly not someone you can have much faith/confidence in.

 

He wasn’t terrible for the entire second half last year. He lost feel for his slider for a little more than two weeks and it scorched his second half ratios. Then he found it again and had a fine September. I don’t see any carry-over issue then. Still could be bad control after no spring training.

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48 minutes ago, Zig Zag said:

What are everyone's thoughts on Greg Holland?   He has looked pretty terrible so far in the short sample size, but if you take into consideration his 2nd half last year as well his numbers are just awful.   Certainly not someone you can have much faith/confidence in.

 

I was actually just laughing at how ridiculous his peripherals look right now. Obviously they're useless numbers from 1.1 ip, but absurd nonetheless. That said, I think he'll be fine

 

LGQqfU4.png

 

 

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KC going no where . With all the teams in need of a closer sooner than later think they trade Herrera before the deadline? 

Who takes over if and when they do ? 

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6 minutes ago, motown magic said:

KC going no where . With all the teams in need of a closer sooner than later think they trade Herrera before the deadline? 

Who takes over if and when they do ? 

 

Yes.

 

I think Maurer will settle down by the time Herrera is traded. If he does I think it will be him. If he doesn't I think it will be Grimm.

 

Edit: I didn't realize how bad Maurer was last year. He has been pretty bad for a while now. Maybe it is all Grimm if/when Herrera is traded?

Edited by fletch44

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18 minutes ago, motown magic said:

KC going no where . With all the teams in need of a closer sooner than later think they trade Herrera before the deadline? 

Who takes over if and when they do ? 

Most likely but maybe ..... let’s not get ahead of ourselves just yet. 

 

This is not one of those the early bird gets the worm scenarios 

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what are peoples thoughts on soria/jones?  i own them both and would love to free up a roster slot, but guessing there is no clearly defined role here?

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2 hours ago, F@ndemonium said:

I too agree, as I posted on this thread earlier in the week, that Steckenrider will be next man up.  

 

Barraclough's looked very pedestrian thus far.  His command has always wavered, but most alarming behind his auspicious 2018 numbers,  is a noticeable velocity decrease (93.7 down from 95.2).  

 

On the other hand, "Steck" has been near flawless with a 8:1 K/BB ratio, 0.00 ERA & a 0.75 WHIP.  Its also worth noting that Mattingly chose Steckenrider to close a game during spring, perhaps foreshadowing the future.

 

Theres no doubt that Ziegler's hold on the Marlins closer gig will be short lived, and I suspect Drew to separate himself in the battle of heir to the first chair.

 

 

 

It's not as if Steckenrider has had good command throughout his professional career. And Barraclough has looked just fine outside of one outing. Which one will replace Ziegler? I don't know nor do I care, but I don't think it's fair to call out Barraclough's command when Steck's hasn't been better...or to read too much into the first two weeks of the season. 

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1 hour ago, fletch44 said:

 

Yes.

 

I think Maurer will settle down by the time Herrera is traded. If he does I think it will be him. If he doesn't I think it will be Grimm.

 

Edit: I didn't realize how bad Maurer was last year. He has been pretty bad for a while now. Maybe it is all Grimm if/when Herrera is traded?

Royals optioned RHP Brandon Maurer to Triple-A Omaha.

Maurer holds an 8.88 ERA across 31 relief appearances since the Royals acquired him last July, including a 12.46 mark in his first five outings this season. Kevin McCarthy has replaced him in the bullpen.
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15 minutes ago, Flyman75 said:

 

It's not as if Steckenrider has had good command throughout his professional career. And Barraclough has looked just fine outside of one outing. Which one will replace Ziegler? I don't know nor do I care, but I don't think it's fair to call out Barraclough's command when Steck's hasn't been better...or to read too much into the first two weeks of the season. 

Fair enough....  I'm sure one can make valid arguments for both sides of the "whose next debate", however the current sample size statistically favors Steckenrider; albeit marginally:

 

Barraclough

1.31 WHIP (Minors)

1.28 WHIP (MLB-career)

2.90 ERA (MLB-career)

2018 BB/9: 3.86 (Career Average: 5.48)

 

Steckenrider

1.21 WHIP (Minors)

1.28 WHIP (MLB-career)

1.96 ERA (MLB-career)

2018 BB/9: 1.35 (Career Average of 4.14)

 

The one thing that most of us can agree on, universally, is that Brad Ziegler is certainly not the answer....current, nor future.  So you roster KB, I'll take DS and one of us should emerge with bragging rights in the not-so-distant future :) 

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5 minutes ago, F@ndemonium said:

Fair enough....  I'm sure one can make valid arguments for both sides of the "whose next debate", however the current sample size statistically favors Steckenrider; albeit marginally:

 

Barraclough

1.31 WHIP (Minors)

1.28 WHIP (MLB-career)

2.90 ERA (MLB-career)

2018 BB/9: 3.86 (Career Average: 5.48)

 

Steckenrider

1.21 WHIP (Minors)

1.28 WHIP (MLB-career)

1.96 ERA (MLB-career)

2018 BB/9: 1.35 (Career Average of 4.14)

 

The one thing that most of us can agree on, universally, is that Brad Ziegler is certainly not the answer....current, nor future.  So you roster KB, I'll take DS and one of us should emerge with bragging rights in the not-so-distant future :) 

While Ziegler is definitely not the best option, the Marlins would love nothing more than for him to keep closing the 50-60 games they’re going to win, keeping their more talented arms also less expensive. This is important. I think it’s very likely Ziegler is this year’s Jim Johnson, aka older, bad closer who holds the job on a team that’s not going anywhere. 

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Viz retired the side in a non save situation.  Although the Bryant & Contreras outs were very hard hit.

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I'm not as pessimistic on Melancon.   If I recall correctly, he pitched reasonably well when he came back last year.  Again, I could be wrong, but I thought the reason he didn't close was that Dyson was on a streak before Melancon decided to shut it down.  I thought it was crazy of Melancon and the Giants given that they were out of the race.  I guess my point is that, notwithstanding dire medical news, Melancon pitched and wasn't always awful.  I think he's still worth a DL-slot in save hungry leagues.  Please feel free to correct my rose-colored memories of Melancon's September.  :-)

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