TheWrightStuff

Joey Lucchesi 2018 Outlook

Recommended Posts

20 minutes ago, Sidearmer said:

SO what I'm getting from this thread is that he's a lefty who relies on deception, not stuff. Should be intersting to see how he starts. He could be Alex Wood and survive, but he could also be Tony Cingrani and be nothing noteworthy. Both were lefties with elite minor league numbers who relied on deceptiveness and not stuff.

 

At this point its just a wait and see game. Deep leagues he's worth a shot if you have an open roster spot, but not worth dropping anyone who might provide value.

Cingrani has a power fastball and a wipe out slider, he just couldnt locate.  He didnt rely on deception.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He throws a mid-90s heater with sharp downward plane.  He’s not a pure-“deception” guy.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cingrani when he first came up was all about deception.  All he threw were fast balls

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, ccsae said:

Cingrani when he first came up was all about deception.  All he threw were fast balls

 

He did throw almost all fastballs, but he didn’t rely on a deceptive delivery.  It was the extreme movement on the FB that led to his success.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, BMcP said:

 

He did throw almost all fastballs, but he didn’t rely on a deceptive delivery.  It was the extreme movement on the FB that led to his success.

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/reds-tony-cingrani-scouting-report/

 

Paragraphs two and three 

 

Fastball lack of movement but can spot it to either side of the plate.

Deceptive delivery from a 3/4 slot hides the ball as long as possible

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When he first came up it was all about his delivery being deceptive.  That article is from 2014, he came up 2 years before that.

Either way this is Lucchesi thread, sorry for the off topic. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree here.  Let’s move on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

who is thinking of starting him tonight against the Brewers? Or is everyone going with a wait and see approach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Flippped said:

who is thinking of starting him tonight against the Brewers? Or is everyone going with a wait and see approach.

 

<----- this guy is

 

why not? risk it for the biscuit 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

his next start would be at home, against the Rockies. after that his next start is also against the Rockies, in Colorado.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stashing him in dynasty leagues just in case.  Starting him in one deep redraft league as a what the heck.  Might as well have fun with fantasy baseball....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think he is ready.  Promising pitcher but I would expect a rough go around in his first month filling in (or at least uneven).  Stash but do not start in my books

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Professor Turgeson said:

What does he need to work on? 

 

his only weakness is that sometimes hes just too good

 

and that he cares too much

 

 

Edited by Golden Spikes
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Golden Spikes said:

 

his only weakness is that sometimes hes just too good

 

and that he cares too much

 

 

My wife wishes this was my scouting profile.  Unfortunately it isn’t.  

  • Like 2
  • Haha 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Sidearmer said:

SO what I'm getting from this thread is that he's a lefty who relies on deception, not stuff. Should be intersting to see how he starts. He could be Alex Wood and survive, but he could also be Tony Cingrani and be nothing noteworthy. Both were lefties with elite minor league numbers who relied on deceptiveness and not stuff.

 

At this point its just a wait and see game. Deep leagues he's worth a shot if you have an open roster spot, but not worth dropping anyone who might provide value.

 

Cingrani didn't have enough variety of pitches.   That was his undoing.  He was essentially a fastball only guy. 

 

Wood is a decent comp.   I think Wood's stuff is better but I suspect JL's command is better. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If he has better command than Wood, he is a must-own in all leagues immediately 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, BMcP said:

If he has better command than Wood, he is a must-own in all leagues immediately 

 

Really don't know honestly.   I'm just going on scouting reports.   Looking forward to watching him tonight. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

just got to the park will have an analysis later probably tomorrow, wasn't planning on going initially till I saw Lucchesi called up

 

 

Edited by Golden Spikes
  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, BMcP said:

https://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2014/3/11/5493594/tony-cingrani-and-dominating-with-the-four-seam-fastball

 

His delivery may have been somewhat deceptive, but it was the late movement on the FB that contributed most to his effectiveness.

 That article is making an assumption on the results because it did move. His delivery was for sure one of the more deceptive out there in the day.  

 

It was why he could throw the ball up in the zone so often. They were usually late when he went up the ladder.  It made him LOOK like he was throwing 96-98 MPH when he was only throwing 92-93. So the truth is in the middle.

 

Here were the guys in 2013 with H-Movement within .5 of Cingrani's

 

Cingrani  10.5   SwStr 92.9 MPH (9.2 VM)

Price  8.3  SwStr   94.6 MPH (8.3 VM)

Moore 6.8 SwStr  93.3 MPH   (11.0 VM)

Corbin 6.5 SwStr   93.0 MPH  (9.5 VM)

Holland 5.8 SwStr  94.6 MPH   (10.0 VM)

Locke 4.1 SwStr   91.3 MPH  (9.9 VM)

 

Which the exception of Holland and Cingrani the SwStr laddar correlates with Velo. (Probably because Holland/Locke lived down in the zone instead of up) Nor did he have the secondary pitches some of these guys had to keep hitters off-balance.. I also just realized all these guys are LHP.

 

This research also lead to a separate question, are southpaws more naturally adept at H-Movement? or does the Pitch FX have a bias/error and inflates Southpaws?

 

What does this mean for Lucchesi? Well if he has deception, he may have higher perceived velocity and he already throws Mid-90s. Sounds great, however he really needs to throw up the ladder often to really make the most of it like Cingrani did.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/29/2018 at 11:28 AM, SpecialFNK said:

he had 10.87 K9 in A+ and that fell to 7.91 in AA. any reason for the drop?

better hitters?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like virtually all pitchers who experience success at the ML level (save rare exceptions, like someone with a Chapman FB), Lucchesi incorporates elements of deception into his delivery.  But just to be perfectly clear, he doesn’t “rely” on an unorthodox delivery for his success.  He has a varied, above-average arsenal with solid command of all offerings.  Anytime you find a lefty who can ramp up a FB into the mid-90s, he has the potential to be special - and you can say with certainty he is much more than just a deception artist.

 

Seriously, my last word on this - let’s just enjoy watching this kid pitch.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.