RMJ_12

2018 Biggest Busts

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6 minutes ago, cohenstantinople said:

 

+ his ability to gain separation

+ his reliable hands

 

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Man gets so little credit considering his performances.

He's good don't get me wrong, but we're talking about a 27 year old with 2 decent seasons.  He's not as talented as Diggs if that's the argument we're still having.

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9 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

He's good don't get me wrong, but we're talking about a 27 year old with 2 decent seasons.  He's not as talented as Diggs if that's the argument we're still having.

Why is only two decent seasons a ding on Thielen, but not Diggs? And 91/1300/4 is better than decent.

Edited by hoppychokes

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5 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

He's good don't get me wrong, but we're talking about a 27 year old with 2 decent seasons.  He's not as talented as Diggs if that's the argument we're still having.

 

No desire to argue. The point GoHawks made was that #19 ran safe routes, and that's why Keenum threw Thielen the ball. I find that statement underdeveloped, and it fails to give Thielen the credit he's earned through solid football.

 

I like the talent of the duo here, and of Cook and Rudolph. Love the D-line. Looking forward to seeing what happens August.

 

And talent aside---as we're seeing Thielen and Diggs exchange places / ADPs depending on if your drafting under a waxing or waning moon---it's noteworthy to consider that Thielen has not missed a game during his four seasons, whereas Diggs has missed games each of his three seasons.

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4 minutes ago, hoppychokes said:

Why is only two decent seasons a ding on Thielen, but not Diggs? And 91/1300/4 is better than decent.

Diggs has yet to have a bad season considering he's never played a full 16 games.  Diggs is also 24 years old.

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1 minute ago, RMJ_12 said:

Diggs has yet to have a bad season considering he's never played a full 16 games.  Diggs is also 24 years old.

Yeah, but why hold two decent seasons against Thielen in a comparison where the best that can be said about Diggs is he hasn't had a bad season? Age I understand, but that shouldn't be a factor for another couple years.

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1 minute ago, hoppychokes said:

Yeah, but why hold two decent seasons against Thielen in a comparison where the best that can be said about Diggs is he hasn't had a bad season? Age I understand, but that shouldn't be a factor for another couple years.

By not bad I mean his per game averages are better than Thielen every year except for 2017.  One year doesn't make you better.  Thielen also basically stole the slot position from Diggs.  I'm not so sure he'd even be good if he wasn't in the slot.

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10 minutes ago, hoppychokes said:

Age I understand, but that shouldn't be a factor for another couple years.

I wasn't saying Thielen was too old.  I was saying Diggs was good when he was 21 years old.  Thielen wasn't good until he was 26 years old.

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2 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

By not bad I mean his per game averages are better than Thielen every year except for 2017.  One year doesn't make you better.  Thielen also basically stole the slot position from Diggs.  I'm not so sure he'd even be good if he wasn't in the slot.

This starts comparing hypothetical vs reality. Diggs could be better if he had a full season, Thielen is only better because he has the slot, etc. In reality, I would rather have owned Thielen last year and it was close to a wash the year before. At a certain point, proven value has to beat out potential ceiling.

 

Thielen also didnt get a shot until he was 26. He had to work and work to prove his worth, that kind of work ethic has value to CS. I would assume that he only continues that trend.

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2 minutes ago, hoppychokes said:

Thielen also didnt get a shot until he was 26. He had to work and work to prove his worth, that kind of work ethic has value to CS. I would assume that he only continues that trend.

That would depend on his play in practice.  Diggs didn't get on the field as a rookie just because he was drafted in the 5th round.

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Just now, RMJ_12 said:

That would depend on his play in practice.  Diggs didn't get on the field as a rookie just because he was drafted in the 5th round.

So being drafted in the 5th round, makes it okay for Diggs to not make the field as a rookie but Thielen going undrafted means he shouldn't have sat two seasons?

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7 minutes ago, hoppychokes said:

So being drafted in the 5th round, makes it okay for Diggs to not make the field as a rookie but Thielen going undrafted means he shouldn't have sat two seasons?

You're reading it incorrectly.  Diggs did get on the field as a rookie and I was saying he didn't get there because of draft capital since he was only a 5th round pick.  He was only 21 years old and started 9 games and played in 13 games.

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Just now, RMJ_12 said:

You're reading it incorrectly.  Diggs did get on the field as a rookie and I was saying he didn't get there because of draft capital since he was only a 5th round pick.  He was only 21 years old and started 9 games and played in 13 games.

Got ya, I was confused and figured I was looking at stats wrong lol. I'll admit a bias, I own chunks of Thielen everywhere and like the undrafted storyline. 

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On 6/22/2018 at 6:35 PM, Axe Elf said:

 

In statistics, it's called "baselining" and "standard deviation."

 

I don't think the argument is that an outlier season CAN'T happen; just that it's unlikely to happen.

Sure, but that's only when you have a decent sample size. Cousins has only been a starter for three seasons on three very mediocre teams. He has never had a good supporting cast from top to bottom until this season. I would argue that Cousins not having a top 10 fantasy receiver is a pretty big outlier given his passing stats when you compare his numbers to other QB's with similar stats. Given his production over his short time starting I would say it's only a matter of time for him to have a WR with top 10 numbers. Minnesota gives him by far the best chance to put a WR in the top 10 in terms of fantasy production.

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2 hours ago, munde53 said:

Sure, but that's only when you have a decent sample size. Cousins has only been a starter for three seasons on three very mediocre teams. He has never had a good supporting cast from top to bottom until this season. I would argue that Cousins not having a top 10 fantasy receiver is a pretty big outlier given his passing stats when you compare his numbers to other QB's with similar stats. Given his production over his short time starting I would say it's only a matter of time for him to have a WR with top 10 numbers. Minnesota gives him by far the best chance to put a WR in the top 10 in terms of fantasy production.

 

Cousins?  Who said anything about Cousins?  You were axing about the argument that just because something hasn't happened before means that it will never happen.  I gave you the statistical basis for the argument that because something hasn't happened before means that it is UNLIKELIER to happen than things that have--but I don't think anyone is making the argument that just because something hasn't happened before means that it can NEVER happen.

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4 hours ago, munde53 said:

Sure, but that's only when you have a decent sample size. Cousins has only been a starter for three seasons on three very mediocre teams. He has never had a good supporting cast from top to bottom until this season. I would argue that Cousins not having a top 10 fantasy receiver is a pretty big outlier given his passing stats when you compare his numbers to other QB's with similar stats. Given his production over his short time starting I would say it's only a matter of time for him to have a WR with top 10 numbers. Minnesota gives him by far the best chance to put a WR in the top 10 in terms of fantasy production.

I would argue the Redskins have a top 10 receiving corp.  They just don't have a true #1.

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14 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

I would argue the Redskins have a top 10 receiving corp.  They just don't have a true #1.

Top 10??  Saints, Pats, Pitt, Denver, Chargers, NYG, Atl, Packers, Seattle, Tampa, Cle, KC, Houston, Eagles, Lions, Min and Rams.  Thats 17 right there and you could argue about 5 to 6 other teams have better receiving weapons.   

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9 minutes ago, youngrice said:

Top 10??  Saints, Pats, Pitt, Denver, Chargers, NYG, Atl, Packers, Seattle, Tampa, Cle, KC, Houston, Eagles, Lions, Min and Rams.  Thats 17 right there and you could argue about 5 to 6 other teams have better receiving weapons.   

Are you including TE?  Also you might be forgetting they had DeSean Jackson and Pierre Garcon until last season.

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33 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

Are you including TE?  Also you might be forgetting they had DeSean Jackson and Pierre Garcon until last season.

Yes I'm including TE.  Whens the last time Reed stayed healthy??  Not forgetting about Desean or Garcon. I don't really think the duo was anywhere close to top `10 WR duo at any point.  All give you in 15 they might have had a top 10 core but thats one year and their top target Reed only started 9 games

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8 minutes ago, youngrice said:

Yes I'm including TE.  Whens the last time Reed stayed healthy??  Not forgetting about Desean or Garcon. I don't really think the duo was anywhere close to top `10 WR duo at any point.  All give you in 15 they might have had a top 10 core but thats one year and their top target Reed only started 9 games

We're not talking about duos.  At one points Cousins actually had Jackson, Garcon, Crowder, and Reed to throw the ball to.  That's probably top 5 in league as a group.

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7 hours ago, RMJ_12 said:

We're not talking about duos.  At one points Cousins actually had Jackson, Garcon, Crowder, and Reed to throw the ball to.  That's probably top 5 in league as a group.

 

Are you trolling?

Edited by Winky

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1 hour ago, Winky said:

 

Are you trolling?

Let's hear 5 that were better?

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1 hour ago, RMJ_12 said:

Let's hear 5 that were better?

That year in 15.  NE, Pit, Det, Oak and Bengals.  Quick 5 I know there are more.  

Edited by youngrice

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13 minutes ago, youngrice said:

That year in 15.  NE, Pit, Det, Oak and Bengals.  Quick 5 I know there are more.  

You can say that, but that doesn't make it true.

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21 minutes ago, RMJ_12 said:

You can say that, but that doesn't make it true.

 

Back at ya.

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3 minutes ago, Winky said:

 

Back at ya.

Seeing how Cousins was 3rd in the league in passing yards in 2016 (500 more than Rodgers).  I'd say I know what I'm talking about.

 

F.Y.I. with the same # of yards he would have been #1 overall in passing yards in 2017.

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