Under500Forever

Chris Sale 2019 Outlook

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Just now, jfazz23 said:

 

the strikeouts are good....but everything else?  i think you are nuts to take him over German.  im not even sure id draft him as an SP2.

German? Really? Lol dude has over a 4 ERA and that’s considered a break out for him. I think you’re nuts to take German over Sale next year. To each his own.

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1 minute ago, hangin n wangin said:

German? Really? Lol dude has over a 4 ERA and that’s considered a break out for him. I think you’re nuts to take German over Sale next year. To each his own.

 

3.98

and several starts he got beat up he had a bad hip and went on the DL.  take those out hes closer to 3.  also  is 14-2 and the yanks offense/pen isnt going anywhere

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Just now, jfazz23 said:

 

3.98

and several starts he got beat up he had a bad hip and went on the DL.  take those out hes closer to 3.  also  is 14-2 and the yanks offense/pen isnt going anywhere

His ERA is 4.08. Take Sale’s bad starts out and he’s close to a mid 3 ERA or lower. It doesn’t work like that. I doubt many people are taking Herman over Sale next year. 

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1 minute ago, hangin n wangin said:

His ERA is 4.08. Take Sale’s bad starts out and he’s close to a mid 3 ERA or lower. It doesn’t work like that. I doubt many people are taking Herman over Sale next year. 

 

its 3.98 . baseballreference or whatever site you are using hasnt updated yet...

 

i wont argue facts with you.  he threw 7 innings 2 run ball today against a great boston lineup

Edited by jfazz23

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Yeah I’m also a first time Sale owner and he’s going to f--- me in the playoffs.  But I’m absolutely using a keeper slot on him.  He will rebound.

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4 minutes ago, jfazz23 said:

 

its 3.98 . baseballreference or whatever site you are using hasnt updated yet...

 

i wont argue facts with you.  he threw 7 innings 2 run ball today against a great boston lineup

My bad. My stance is still the same.

i see you have a Yankee sig. that’s all I needed to see.

Edited by hangin n wangin

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14 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

My bad. My stance is still the same.

i see you have a Yankee sig. that’s all I needed to see.

 

when it comes to fantasy im a (or at least want to be) a winner before im a Yankee fan.  its an honest question.  why would you take Sale before German? strikeouts? german was hurt and had 2 or 3 bad starts.  Sale is, apparently, healthy and has a near 5 era.  is he going to increase velocity?  what makes you think he is the Sale of the last 5 years and not the Sale of this year?

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When a player has an off season during what is supposed to be their prime they rarely recover their old form. 

I would draft him at a 10th round discount though but I know that will not happen.

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5 minutes ago, B&F said:

When a player has an off season during what is supposed to be their prime they rarely recover their old form. 

I would draft him at a 10th round discount though but I know that will not happen.

10th round lol wow... verlander had a mid 4 ERA in his age 31 season. Sale has a mid 4 ERA in his age 30 season. It happens. I think he will be good next year. I’m not even a Sale fan or a Red Sox fan either. This is just my opinion. I’m not saying he will be the Sale of old, but would I draft him over fuggin’ Herman if they both are around the same round? Easy yes. But again, to each his own.

Edited by hangin n wangin

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Guy wasn't getting calls today so threw a tantrum and tossed meatballs down the middle. 

 

Guess that'll just about put a wrap on my season. It was a run.

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28 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

10th round lol wow... verlander had a mid 4 ERA in his age 31 season. Sale has a mid 4 ERA in his age 30 season. It happens. I think he will be good next year. I’m not even a Sale fan or a Red Sox fan either. This is just my opinion. I’m not saying he will be the Sale of old, but would I draft him over fuggin’ Herman if they both are around the same round? Easy yes. But again, to each his own.

 

Verlander is a disingenuous comparison though. 9 times out of 10 when a pitcher goes into a Verlander-like slide they don’t just miraculously recover to dominance again. That’s the exception not the rule. I think there is a lot about Sale to be worried about even before this year began

That aside he obviously can miss bats and I can’t draft German (who has also been very spotty this year) over Sale next year. 

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2 minutes ago, merlin401 said:

 

Verlander is a disingenuous comparison though. 9 times out of 10 when a pitcher goes into a Verlander-like slide they don’t just miraculously recover to dominance again. That’s the exception not the rule. I think there is a lot about Sale to be worried about even before this year began

That aside he obviously can miss bats and I can’t draft German (who has also been very spotty this year) over Sale next year. 

Your last sentence is my main point. I never said Sale is going to be what he was before this year. I still think he will be good next year though and I definitely think he will be better than Herman.

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Sale has a top 5 Sierra and xfip. Much of his issues are luck related. He got singled to death today and squeezed by the ump. Then, he lost his cool and got tossed.  German has gotten hit before as well. It’s baseball. 

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1 hour ago, jfazz23 said:

 

when it comes to fantasy im a (or at least want to be) a winner before im a Yankee fan.  its an honest question.  why would you take Sale before German? strikeouts? german was hurt and had 2 or 3 bad starts.  Sale is, apparently, healthy and has a near 5 era.  is he going to increase velocity?  what makes you think he is the Sale of the last 5 years and not the Sale of this year?

And a xfip and Sierra that’s well below that. Luck evens out over a season. Sales issue is hr like Verlander and almost every power pitcher.  Trust the track record and skills.

Edited by Stoper54

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3 hours ago, jfazz23 said:

the strikeouts are good....but everything else?  i think you are nuts to take him over German.  im not even sure id draft him as an SP2.

 

@The Big Bat Theory - i know you are a big sox fan.  where are you drafting him next year?

Well I was out so missed his debacle today fortunately, hah.

I can't really answer you because I don't play in redraft leagues and have no feel for them like a redraft owner would.  I do own him in two of my four dynasty leagues and have since he was with the White Sox and have no intention of trying to trade him if that helps.

I mean I have no idea why he is having a season out of hell but then neither does he.  But I do think he will have things figured out eventually.  When is the question. 

He is indeed starting to go through the Verlander transformation from fireballer to pitcher.  I remember with Verlander it took two tries with some very early success out of the gate followed by a horrible period lasting nearly a full year while things fell apart again and people were giving up on him yet again during that transformation.  But then something clicked for him and the "perceived" second try came fairly quickly to fruit after the light switch went on.

I know Sale is trying to make his slider THE pitch and spot his fastball and throw in in more change-ups as well to vary speeds.  But it is a work in progress at this point.  Sometimes he has THE magic slider of all times and no one can touch him.  Sometimes he has no feel for it at all and disaster ensues.  So yeah he is working on changing himself.  But there seems to be other problems that crop up because of this change too like mechanics start to get off which in turn can lead to inflammation at times and decrease in velocity for awhile and stuff like that. 

Basically this is Sale's "lost year" at this point just like Verlander had a horrible one whatever year that was in the middle of his two part transformation.  Funny how people forget his first attempt started well but ended in a horror show for quite awhile before his second seemed to work right out of the gate instead of realizing it really was only one transformation process with a huge, l-o-n-g, bump in the middle.  I remember it because I took over a friend's team in a league for a year when he wanted to take a season's break and I had Verlander during that "bump" after he supposedly had transformed himself.  It was ugly.  My friend got his team back and Verlander performed great for him, humpt!  😫

Well, there you have it.  I never answered your question, hah.

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1 hour ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Well I was out so missed his debacle today fortunately, hah.

I can't really answer you because I don't play in redraft leagues and have no feel for them like a redraft owner would.  I do own him in two of my four dynasty leagues and have since he was with the White Sox and have no intention of trying to trade him if that helps.

I mean I have no idea why he is having a season out of hell but then neither does he.  But I do think he will have things figured out eventually.  When is the question. 

He is indeed starting to go through the Verlander transformation from fireballer to pitcher.  I remember with Verlander it took two tries with some very early success out of the gate followed by a horrible period lasting nearly a full year while things fell apart again and people were giving up on him yet again during that transformation.  But then something clicked for him and the "perceived" second try came fairly quickly to fruit after the light switch went on.

I know Sale is trying to make his slider THE pitch and spot his fastball and throw in in more change-ups as well to vary speeds.  But it is a work in progress at this point.  Sometimes he has THE magic slider of all times and no one can touch him.  Sometimes he has no feel for it at all and disaster ensues.  So yeah he is working on changing himself.  But there seems to be other problems that crop up because of this change too like mechanics start to get off which in turn can lead to inflammation at times and decrease in velocity for awhile and stuff like that. 

Basically this is Sale's "lost year" at this point just like Verlander had a horrible one whatever year that was in the middle of his two part transformation.  Funny how people forget his first attempt started well but ended in a horror show for quite awhile before his second seemed to work right out of the gate instead of realizing it really was only one transformation process with a huge, l-o-n-g, bump in the middle.  I remember it because I took over a friend's team in a league for a year when he wanted to take a season's break and I had Verlander during that "bump" after he supposedly had transformed himself.  It was ugly.  My friend got his team back and Verlander performed great for him, humpt!  😫

Well, there you have it.  I never answered your question, hah.

 

I think everything that you post here is very encouraging to me as a Sale owner in a keeper league.  I think what you're saying is to not overreact.

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3 hours ago, shakestreet said:

It is looking like Chris O’Leary was right about Chris Sale. 

Was he the nutcase that said his arm was going to fall off because it was an "M" (upside down W)?   Well if so it didn't so ... no.

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21 hours ago, Fuzzy_Slippers said:

The K% and BB% look great, but he can't stop throwing meatballs. Way too many homers allowed. 

 

could it be the baseball?

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46 minutes ago, jfazz23 said:

could it be the baseball?

Well that goes for all pitchers this season with the balls, heh.

But he is having trouble locating his fastball which is the pitch batters are hitting out the most.  Lack of command would most probably indicate mechanics getting messed up.  Something that is hard to correct in season let alone the second half of the season when pitchers don't want to -- and physically really can't -- tire their arms out further by working on same in the bullpen an extra lot. 

Then add in the headcase stuff that happens with pitchers (or hitters) desperate to try and correct their problems especially with their team counting on them in the stretch drive.  He is basically cooked for this season I think and the Red Sox certainly are now too. 

So I think he will figure it out by next year but this year just bench him the rest of the way in keeper/dynasty leagues unless you really really need those K's.

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1 hour ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Well that goes for all pitchers this season with the balls, heh.

But he is having trouble locating his fastball which is the pitch batters are hitting out the most.  Lack of command would most probably indicate mechanics getting messed up.  Something that is hard to correct in season let alone the second half of the season when pitchers don't want to -- and physically really can't -- tire their arms out further by working on same in the bullpen an extra lot. 

Then add in the headcase stuff that happens with pitchers (or hitters) desperate to try and correct their problems especially with their team counting on them in the stretch drive.  He is basically cooked for this season I think and the Red Sox certainly are now too. 

So I think he will figure it out by next year but this year just bench him the rest of the way in keeper/dynasty leagues unless you really really need those K's.

 

But at seems like a lot of his woes have been against the Yankees.  So as long as he's not pitching against the Yankees during fantasy playoffs, he should be a safe start.

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