K197040 2,412 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 53 minutes ago, CroNY said: Meh Marcus Peters is a Jekyll and Hyde type of corner spectacular interception followed up by allowing a 80 yard touchdown.. Not sure what your point is but he doesn't exactly instill fear... and yes Cleveland is playing Buffalo so I'm kinda lost to where this was going lol.. My point was that their defense is better than it was at the beginning of the season. Imo. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Members_Only_76 7,249 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Fire up the Bills DST, 6 INT's incoming!! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CroNY 264 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Members_Only_76 said: Fire up the Bills DST, 6 INT's incoming!! Eh I don't see that at all obviously you're kidding in regards to 6 INT's lol...but the Eagles ran for 200 yards on them ( the last real offense they played) in the last 4 games, not to say the Browns are a real offense with Kitchens calling the plays lolol I'm basically contradicting myself ugh Browns are so aggravating. Not to mention Baker needs to announce he wants to target Beckham early and often and what is this double coverage nonsense he keeps spewing out of his mouth. Julio and other receivers have had safety help and bracketed their entire careers and still go off for 200 yards its a joke of an excuse. To go along with the fact the whole shutdown corner aspect of being scared to play a guy is overblown as well.. If you have an all world receiver and your QB is competent he is going to win his fair share of the time a good QB will be able to fit the ball just over the CB with the safety help over the top regardless. Point is Baker is incompetent and can't make these throws until we see otherwise thats why you see the dink and dunk 23 targets for Jarvis Landry to comparison to Odell 13 the last two games. Edited November 7, 2019 by CroNY Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gootz 131 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 OBJ will hopefully be traded to a team that has a real quarterback who can make throws. What a bust of a 2nd round draft pick... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kramjam24 223 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Eli isnt looking so bad now huh OBJ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fantasy Gooroo 1,434 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 Looking forward to the upcoming OBJ tear. Fasten your seatbelts! 4 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PisEdiRin 450 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 On 11/7/2019 at 6:34 PM, Fantasy Gooroo said: Looking forward to the upcoming OBJ tear. Fasten your seatbelts! Ah, hanging on to "name value". One of the FF Don'ts OBJ is an average WR. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jsch08 267 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: Ah, hanging on to "name value". One of the FF Don'ts OBJ is an average WR. Oh boy. What have you seen on tape from him that makes you think his skills have declined and he is just average? Please do not use box score arguments, thanks. I still see a superstar once he gets the ball in his hands. A couple of sick plays last week against the Broncos. The issue is he is on a broken offense with a quarterback playing very poorly and not getting OBJ the ball enough. OBJ could continue to be a bust for 2019 fantasy football because of the offense he is in, but I’m still seeing a superstar. Edited November 9, 2019 by jsch08 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PisEdiRin 450 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, jsch08 said: Oh boy. What have you seen on tape from him that makes you think his skills have declined and he is just average? Please do not use box score arguments, thanks. PFF grades his tape. You know where PFF has OBJ rated? The 35th best WR in football. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jsch08 267 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: PFF grades his tape. You know where PFF has OBJ rated? The 35th best WR in football. I can look at pff grades myself. That doesn’t constitute as analysis and didn’t answer the question. It could also drastically change in 2 weeks time and isn’t predictive of the future. Anyway the question was what are you seeing that leads you to say he is an average receiver? Edited November 9, 2019 by jsch08 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PisEdiRin 450 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, jsch08 said: Oh boy. What have you seen on tape from him that makes you think his skills have declined and he is just average? Please do not use box score arguments, thanks. I still see a superstar once he gets the ball in his hands. A couple of sick plays last week against the Broncos. The issue is he is on a broken offense with a quarterback playing very poorly and not getting OBJ the ball enough. OBJ could continue to be a bust for 2019 fantasy football because of the offense he is in, but I’m still seeing a superstar. - can't beat press coverage - can't win contested 50-50 balls - lacks burst and explosiveness - doesn't have Eli Manning as his QB, under whom he produced historic per-game numbers over a 5 year stretch. Eli maximized OBJ as a football player. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K197040 2,412 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: PFF grades his tape. You know where PFF has OBJ rated? The 35th best WR in football. As an OBJ owner, that seems too high. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jsch08 267 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: - can't beat press coverage - can't win contested 50-50 balls - lacks burst and explosiveness - doesn't have Eli Manning as his QB, under whom he produced historic per-game numbers over a 5 year stretch. Eli maximized OBJ as a football player. I disagree with every point you make but I respect your opinion. I hope OBJ gets undervalued in 2020 and I’d for sure take the risk on him everywhere if he’s cheap which he is shaping up to be depending on what happens in the 2nd half. Edited November 9, 2019 by jsch08 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LuckyLukas 104 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, jsch08 said: I disagree with every point you make but I respect your opinion. I hope OBJ gets undervalued in 2020 and I’d for sure take the risk on him everywhere if he’s cheap which he is shaping up to be depending on what happens in the 2nd half. if Kitchen is the coach, take him ..you seems to be in love with OBJ no matter the circumstances.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K197040 2,412 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 6 minutes ago, jsch08 said: I disagree with every point you make but I respect your opinion. I hope OBJ gets undervalued in 2020 and I’d for sure take the risk on him everywhere if he’s cheap which he is shaping up to be depending on what happens in the 2nd half. I don’t think you’ll get that opportunity. If he has a good rest of season, he’ll get the hype next year. And I’m sure they’ll address the O line which will go into the hype. On the other hand, if he continues to suck, you’ll have to take a chance on him without having seen it yet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vercrazy 970 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: - can't beat press coverage 31 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: - can't win contested 50-50 balls 31 minutes ago, PisEdiRin said: - lacks burst and explosiveness He's a diva, his new QB has regressed heavily, and his coaching staff is a joke—but OBJ is a talented WR and pretending otherwise is difficult to defend position. Edited November 9, 2019 by vercrazy 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dashoe 6,462 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, vercrazy said: He's a diva, his new QB has regressed heavily, and his coaching staff is a joke—but OBJ is a talented WR and pretending otherwise is ignorant. I have no hard view on OBJ's talent except that I think he is talented however I do have a problem with people who use stats out of context to support their arguments 1. Your Press stat is based on his average from 2016 to 2018 seasons. he was not a Brown so the relevant stat would be how he plays against the press this season 2. The next gen stat is based on his rookie combine score. he has had multiple injuries since then which could affect his agility. Edited November 9, 2019 by dashoe Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vercrazy 970 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 21 minutes ago, dashoe said: I have no hard view on OBJ's talent except that I think he is talented however I do have a problem with people who use stats out of context to support their arguments 1. Your Press stat is based on his average from 2016 to 2018 seasons. he was not a Brown so the relevant stat would be how he plays against the press this season 2. The next gen stat is based on his rookie combine score. he has had multiple injuries since then which could affect his agility. Totally fair, my presumption on #1 is that him beating press coverage has nothing to do with the team he's on (obviously getting a catch after beating the coverage is a different story, but the sheer act of competing against a corner is team agnostic). #2 is a valid counter, though I still don't think his season-ending injury last year was nearly as bad as he played it up to be 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fantasy Gooroo 1,434 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, dashoe said: I have no hard view on OBJ's talent except that I think he is talented however I do have a problem with people who use stats out of context to support their arguments 1. Your Press stat is based on his average from 2016 to 2018 seasons. he was not a Brown so the relevant stat would be how he plays against the press this season 2. The next gen stat is based on his rookie combine score. he has had multiple injuries since then which could affect his agility. These stats are relevant as the OP of this debate stated that "OBJ is an average receiver". Maybe if he qualified that with "HIS PERFORMANCE THIS YEAR WITH THE BROWNS" we can begin to examine with "relevant" stats. But to act like OBJ is average is ridiculous and you know it. I don't care how he has performed in 2019. I can't imagine ANYONE in the league agreeing with that stupid statement and they know a lot more about the guy than some middle aged fake football guys posting in forums. For the record, I just moved OBJ so I no longer have a horse in this race. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shakennbakee 108 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 We do know there are 8 more games to be played right? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jsch08 267 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, K197040 said: I don’t think you’ll get that opportunity. If he has a good rest of season, he’ll get the hype next year. And I’m sure they’ll address the O line which will go into the hype. On the other hand, if he continues to suck, you’ll have to take a chance on him without having seen it yet. Min your 2nd point, I’d definitely take that chance. Someone mentioned Hopkins back in 2016 and that’s a great point. I took Hopkins in 2017 everywhere I could at his price and would gladly do the same for OBJ in 2020. Mid he’s nearly the same adp as this year and Kitchens is still the coach, I’d pass for sure. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SharkSwimmer 4,788 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Talent usually overcomes situation. I think it will for Beckham, too. Possibly even starting tomorrow. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K197040 2,412 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 18 hours ago, SharkSwimmer said: Talent usually overcomes situation. I think it will for Beckham, too. Possibly even starting tomorrow. In general I agree but sometimes I question how true it is. Would the right situation have made guys like Corey Davis or even D Parker top level WRs? There are probably other examples as well. Is it possible that there are elite talents in situations so bad that we never see how good they are? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
affliction 2,137 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 The best got damn wr3 in the game hell yeah 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nonstopfan 4,586 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 1 minute ago, affliction said: The best got damn wr3 in the game hell yeah Definitely. You can't beat his consistency. 5 for 50 every game. What a legit WR3. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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