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Jimmy Garoppolo 2019 Outlook

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16 minutes ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

I'd take him over Lamar Jackson for the next 10 years without a single ounce of hesitation.

 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, Ryansm11 said:

 

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I prefer more quarterbacking out of my quarterbacks.  LJ seems like a fluke without staying power.  Great athlete, but that style does not lend to longevity or championships.  See the past 50 years of the NFL for reference.

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4 hours ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

I prefer more quarterbacking out of my quarterbacks.  LJ seems like a fluke without staying power.  Great athlete, but that style does not lend to longevity or championships.  See the past 50 years of the NFL for reference.

 

On the flip side of the argument, I'd contend there hasn't been a player that is easily comparable to Lamar Jackson in the last 50 years of the NFL to point at.

Some might say Michael Vick, but Lamar is a more accurate and better pocket passer. Some might say Randall Cunningham, but Lamar is much faster and more agile. You could throw up Steve Young/Fran Tarkenton, but again Lamar Jackson is much faster, stronger, and more agile than both.

I've been watching football for over 40 years, and I honestly have never seen a QB quite like Lamar Jackson - with that perfect blend of arm strength, speed, accuracy, agility, pocket awareness, and slippery elusiveness.

I say this as someone that likes Jimmy Garoppolo and what he brings to the table, but Lamar Jackson is a different animal altogether.

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12 hours ago, Bingo Bandanas said:

 

On the flip side of the argument, I'd contend there hasn't been a player that is easily comparable to Lamar Jackson in the last 50 years of the NFL to point at.

Some might say Michael Vick, but Lamar is a more accurate and better pocket passer. Some might say Randall Cunningham, but Lamar is much faster and more agile. You could throw up Steve Young/Fran Tarkenton, but again Lamar Jackson is much faster, stronger, and more agile than both.

I've been watching football for over 40 years, and I honestly have never seen a QB quite like Lamar Jackson - with that perfect blend of arm strength, speed, accuracy, agility, pocket awareness, and slippery elusiveness.

I say this as someone that likes Jimmy Garoppolo and what he brings to the table, but Lamar Jackson is a different animal altogether.

 

Respect the argument, but disagree with the comparisons.  I don't think Lamar is a good passer at all, he faces nothing but 1 on 1s and hits his first read in the RPO.  Same product, different package as all those guys.  They were all revolutionary, but really did the same thing, and were better runners than passers and ultimately became mediocre when they could no longer run like they once did.  I won't include Young on that, because he was a hall of fame passer.  Lamar is a big dude, so lets say he's a faster Cam Newton.  Does that excite anyone long term?  Newton is kind of trash now that all those hits have taken their toll.  QB in the NFL always comes down to your ability to read a difference, make the right decision, and make a good throw.  Any success that skirts that is sure to be short term, which I feel Lamar will inevitably fall into.

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2 hours ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

Respect the argument, but disagree with the comparisons.  I don't think Lamar is a good passer at all, he faces nothing but 1 on 1s and hits his first read in the RPO.  Same product, different package as all those guys.  They were all revolutionary, but really did the same thing, and were better runners than passers and ultimately became mediocre when they could no longer run like they once did.  I won't include Young on that, because he was a hall of fame passer.  Lamar is a big dude, so lets say he's a faster Cam Newton.  Does that excite anyone long term?  Newton is kind of trash now that all those hits have taken their toll.  QB in the NFL always comes down to your ability to read a difference, make the right decision, and make a good throw.  Any success that skirts that is sure to be short term, which I feel Lamar will inevitably fall into.

 

This^

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On 12/3/2019 at 8:31 AM, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

Respect the argument, but disagree with the comparisons.  I don't think Lamar is a good passer at all, he faces nothing but 1 on 1s and hits his first read in the RPO.  Same product, different package as all those guys.  They were all revolutionary, but really did the same thing, and were better runners than passers and ultimately became mediocre when they could no longer run like they once did.  I won't include Young on that, because he was a hall of fame passer.  Lamar is a big dude, so lets say he's a faster Cam Newton.  Does that excite anyone long term?  Newton is kind of trash now that all those hits have taken their toll.  QB in the NFL always comes down to your ability to read a difference, make the right decision, and make a good throw.  Any success that skirts that is sure to be short term, which I feel Lamar will inevitably fall into.

 

Completely disagree with you.

Lamar Jackson was learning and using pro concepts since his time in Louisville under Petrino's offense. I saw Lamar making passes in college that half the QB's in the NFL couldn't make right now. Same thing with reads and progression.

I've seen nothing but steady improvement since he's arrived in the league, and he's always looking to improve and refine his mechanics. He's a good passing QB, especially if you've watched him since his college days. It's not like he just completely came out of left field, and there was a reason that he won the Heisman Trophy, as the youngest player ever no less.

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On 12/3/2019 at 8:31 AM, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

Respect the argument, but disagree with the comparisons.  I don't think Lamar is a good passer at all, he faces nothing but 1 on 1s and hits his first read in the RPO.  Same product, different package as all those guys.  They were all revolutionary, but really did the same thing, and were better runners than passers and ultimately became mediocre when they could no longer run like they once did.  I won't include Young on that, because he was a hall of fame passer.  Lamar is a big dude, so lets say he's a faster Cam Newton.  Does that excite anyone long term?  Newton is kind of trash now that all those hits have taken their toll.  QB in the NFL always comes down to your ability to read a difference, make the right decision, and make a good throw.  Any success that skirts that is sure to be short term, which I feel Lamar will inevitably fall into.

 

Also, I don't think you understand what I said prior: I wasn't comparing him to any of those QB's, and said that he's not comparable to any of the other QB's the NFL has seen.

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16 hours ago, Bingo Bandanas said:

 

Completely disagree with you.

Lamar Jackson was learning and using pro concepts since his time in Louisville under Petrino's offense. I saw Lamar making passes in college that half the QB's in the NFL couldn't make right now. Same thing with reads and progression.

I've seen nothing but steady improvement since he's arrived in the league, and he's always looking to improve and refine his mechanics. He's a good passing QB, especially if you've watched him since his college days. It's not like he just completely came out of left field, and there was a reason that he won the Heisman Trophy, as the youngest player ever no less.

 

We can agree to disagree.  Every time one of these freak athlete QBs takes the league by storm, the league counters, and counters hard.  And every one of them morphed into essentially a pure passer or they were out of the league.  Taking nothing away from his excellent season, just saying his style of play has little chance of longevity either by league design against him or injury.

 

Vick, RGIII, Kapernick were all guys that had immense early success and everyone said the league has never seen anything like them.  Jackson will be the next in that group X years from now and it will seem obvious at that time that a QB who can barely speak intelligible English didn't last 7 years in the league.  Just my opinion, and I understand its not popular in the absolute apex of Jackson's success.  But my take on Damien Williams was similarly scoffed at and was also sourced by the entire history of the NFL.  If I'm proven wrong by essentially the outlier of modern history I can live with myself.

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He has yet to have back-to-back big fantasy performances this year.  This seems like the week to buck the trend.  Any reason not to feel confident in him at home vs. ATL?

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On 12/9/2019 at 8:19 AM, The_Truth_Returns said:

Bump.  Leads the NFL in TD passes since the Emmanuel Sanders trade and is on pace to blow away the stats that Brady had in 09 when he returned from his ACL injury.

I really hope they keep him (Manny) around. This situation is setting up so nicely for SF and Jimmy G long-term.

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1 hour ago, Haverchuck said:

He has yet to have back-to-back big fantasy performances this year.  This seems like the week to buck the trend.  Any reason not to feel confident in him at home vs. ATL?

They run for 250 yards and 4 touchdowns on the ground. Stifle the birds. Win like 38-21 and Jimmy G only attempts 28 passes with no touchdowns. That’s only if I start him though. 

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1 hour ago, Haverchuck said:

He has yet to have back-to-back big fantasy performances this year.  This seems like the week to buck the trend.  Any reason not to feel confident in him at home vs. ATL?

 

Run game dominates, defense scores on turnovers, no need to throw for 400yds and 3 td's

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1 hour ago, dashoe said:

 

Run game dominates, defense scores on turnovers, no need to throw for 400yds and 3 td's

Yupppp. I see this happening sadly. Defense is banged up at least... 

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2 hours ago, ST. STEVEN said:

I really hope they keep him (Manny) around. This situation is setting up so nicely for SF and Jimmy G long-term.

 

... plus they will get Hurd back, as well - by all accounts that kid has been nothing short of jaw dropping impressive - a cotdamn freeek. 

toss him up in the hopper wif Manny and Deebo and Kibbles n' Bits and those RBs?  whoa.  we lookin' at the best offense of 2020. 

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Bump for respect.

 

All his naysayers said "lets see him complete a full season".  He was 13-3, now 20-5 career, and essentially had 4,000 yards and a 70% completion rate, while being 5th in the league in TD passes, while playing in two unthrowable monsoons to boot.  "It's all the defense, he's just a game manager" they said.  The defense gave up 20+ points in 8 of the last 9 weeks while Garoppolo outdueled Rodgers, Brees, and Wilson.

 

The only thing he really doesn't do is end up with the TD in the red-zone.  For as great as Shanahan is as a play caller, he doesn't design a ton of goalline pass plays like a Sean Payton does for Drew Brees where its a glorified handoff.  All his other metrics are elite.

 

This Niners team is dangerous, and will be for a while as they continue to just add talent around the core youth on the team.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

Bump for respect.

 

All his naysayers said "lets see him complete a full season".  He was 13-3, now 20-5 career, and essentially had 4,000 yards and a 70% completion rate, while being 5th in the league in TD passes, while playing in two unthrowable monsoons to boot.  "It's all the defense, he's just a game manager" they said.  The defense gave up 20+ points in 8 of the last 9 weeks while Garoppolo outdueled Rodgers, Brees, and Wilson.

 

The only thing he really doesn't do is end up with the TD in the red-zone.  For as great as Shanahan is as a play caller, he doesn't design a ton of goalline pass plays like a Sean Payton does for Drew Brees where its a glorified handoff.  All his other metrics are elite.

 

This Niners team is dangerous, and will be for a while as they continue to just add talent around the core youth on the team.

 

 

Hes' still fantasy trash though, regardless of his real life value.

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In 1 QB leagues he's not on my radar and I like to take QB's very late.

 

I think he finished this season in the range of Rivers/Carr/Goff type guys. He's probably not going to change much going forward, not like he's on a pass heavy team.

 

As @FitzMagic stated, this is about fantasy football. 

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2 hours ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

Bump for respect.

 

All his naysayers said "lets see him complete a full season".  He was 13-3, now 20-5 career, and essentially had 4,000 yards and a 70% completion rate, while being 5th in the league in TD passes, while playing in two unthrowable monsoons to boot.  "It's all the defense, he's just a game manager" they said.  The defense gave up 20+ points in 8 of the last 9 weeks while Garoppolo outdueled Rodgers, Brees, and Wilson.

 

The only thing he really doesn't do is end up with the TD in the red-zone.  For as great as Shanahan is as a play caller, he doesn't design a ton of goalline pass plays like a Sean Payton does for Drew Brees where its a glorified handoff.  All his other metrics are elite.

 

This Niners team is dangerous, and will be for a while as they continue to just add talent around the core youth on the team.

 

 

 

He finished as a QB 14 which is QB2 for fantasy purposes. Which makes him a streaming waiver wire QB, So everything you stated about his accomplishments is useless for fantasy purposes. Ryan Fitzpatrick with fewer games as a starter was a much superior QB 😉

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On 12/2/2019 at 11:59 AM, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

I prefer more quarterbacking out of my quarterbacks.  LJ seems like a fluke without staying power.  Great athlete, but that style does not lend to longevity or championships.  See the past 50 years of the NFL for reference.

 

You mean like RG3?

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13 hours ago, dashoe said:

 

He finished as a QB 14 which is QB2 for fantasy purposes. Which makes him a streaming waiver wire QB, So everything you stated about his accomplishments is useless for fantasy purposes. Ryan Fitzpatrick with fewer games as a starter was a much superior QB 😉

 

It's only useless because the season is over.  For next year its the basis of his projections.  His TD rate is bound to increase, and his numbers ballooned when Emmanuel Sanders joined the team.  If Sanders resigns, and other guys get healthy you'd be crazy to think he isn't a lock to improve next year, which puts him square in QB1 territory.  

 

16 hours ago, Members_Only_76 said:

In 1 QB leagues he's not on my radar and I like to take QB's very late.

 

I think he finished this season in the range of Rivers/Carr/Goff type guys. He's probably not going to change much going forward, not like he's on a pass heavy team.

 

As @FitzMagic stated, this is about fantasy football. 

 

Not going to change much?  He was without half his O-Line most of the year, is barely 1 year removed from an ACL tear, played in two unthrowable monsoons, and was a QB1 from the point Sanders joined the team.  They had about 20 rushing TD, which is likely to regress.  The defense gave up 20+ in 8 of the last 9 games and showed signs of weakness.  All that points to a very strong likelihood he improves into QB1 territory next year.  Matt Ryan won league MVP in year 2 of Shanahan's offense.  Next year will for all intents and purposes be year 2 for Garoppolo.

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23 minutes ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

Not going to change much?  He was without half his O-Line most of the year, is barely 1 year removed from an ACL tear, played in two unthrowable monsoons, and was a QB1 from the point Sanders joined the team.  They had about 20 rushing TD, which is likely to regress.  The defense gave up 20+ in 8 of the last 9 games and showed signs of weakness.  All that points to a very strong likelihood he improves into QB1 territory next year.  Matt Ryan won league MVP in year 2 of Shanahan's offense.  Next year will for all intents and purposes be year 2 for Garoppolo.

 

Sounds like excuses ;)

 

But hey, maybe you're on to something and Jimmy will be my late round QB pick next year.

 

 

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I am def on board with Jimmy taking another step forward next year. It is a great system for him and hopefully they bring back Manny Sanders and maybe even draft another weapon for him, being an insanely deep WR draft. I will def have Jimmy as a major early season Best Ball target.

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50 minutes ago, The_Truth_Returns said:

 

It's only useless because the season is over.  For next year its the basis of his projections.  His TD rate is bound to increase, and his numbers ballooned when Emmanuel Sanders joined the team.  If Sanders resigns, and other guys get healthy you'd be crazy to think he isn't a lock to improve next year, which puts him square in QB1 territory.  

 

 

Not going to change much?  He was without half his O-Line most of the year, is barely 1 year removed from an ACL tear, played in two unthrowable monsoons, and was a QB1 from the point Sanders joined the team.  They had about 20 rushing TD, which is likely to regress.  The defense gave up 20+ in 8 of the last 9 games and showed signs of weakness.  All that points to a very strong likelihood he improves into QB1 territory next year.  Matt Ryan won league MVP in year 2 of Shanahan's offense.  Next year will for all intents and purposes be year 2 for Garoppolo.

 

He can improve but that does not mean he will be a QB1 for fantasy purposes. Interesting how you look at the passing game in isolation to the makeup of the entire team. SF likes to run the ball and they have a strong defense that gives them good field position to run the ball and no need to make a ton of passes.

An improving QB does not mean a QB who throws more TD's an improving QB means one who makes the right decisions on the field and executes the offense in order to score points.  Shanny needs a QB who has the ability to run the offense for the run game to be established. 

You also conveniently forget that the SF defense had a bunch of key injuries after their bye and Jimmy's 3 best fantasy games were afte the bye against pass heavy offenses  that the Niners had to throw to compete AZ-AZ-NO. 

This team is built to run the ball and not for the QB to be a pass happy stud. This team is built on the zone run and then when defenses stop the zone run the offense switches to gap run and keeps running at will until you stop that and then if you are over committed to the run they move it through the air to the stud TE or any available wr and then when they get in the redzone they run it down your throat again.

Yes you love Jimmy G and yes he is a good QB but for fantasy purposes in this offense he is a streamer until the defense falls and 10 rotating rb's are on IR🤣

 

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