smeeze

Miles Sanders 2019 Outlook

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23 minutes ago, wideopen21 said:

 

I've said this before, but this is a really simplistic analysis of the situation and I REALLY hope the owners in my leagues feel the same way. 

If the Eagles drafted Saquon Barkley would you say he wouldn't get 250 touches because Doug Pederson didn't give JAG RBs like Adams or Smallwood 250 carries?
Pederson was the OC in KC when Jamal Charles had nearly 2k yards of total offense. Then Charles went south and he was rotating in guys like West and Ware because they were Jags. 

Pederson has done the same in Philly because his RBs have been average.

Sanders could just be another OK RB that gets a job share, but don't assume that. Sanders was taken in the 2nd round. He has looked great in camp. There is reason to believe he is really good and you have no idea how Pederson would use a really good RB in Philly because they have never had a really good RB in philly under Pederson. 

 

 

So your point is that you just hope, or wish, that things could go this way, despite ALl evidence? Wtf?

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32 minutes ago, wideopen21 said:

 

I've said this before, but this is a really simplistic analysis of the situation and I REALLY hope the owners in my leagues feel the same way. 

If the Eagles drafted Saquon Barkley would you say he wouldn't get 250 touches because Doug Pederson didn't give JAG RBs like Adams or Smallwood 250 carries?
Pederson was the OC in KC when Jamal Charles had nearly 2k yards of total offense. Then Charles went south and he was rotating in guys like West and Ware because they were Jags. 

Pederson has done the same in Philly because his RBs have been average.

Sanders could just be another OK RB that gets a job share, but don't assume that. Sanders was taken in the 2nd round. He has looked great in camp. There is reason to believe he is really good and you have no idea how Pederson would use a really good RB in Philly because they have never had a really good RB in philly under Pederson. 

 

 

wishful delusional thinking ... I admire your enthusiasm but you will be disappointed  

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7 minutes ago, elroypedro said:

 

So your point is that you just hope, or wish, that things could go this way, despite ALl evidence? Wtf?

 

Yeah, if that is what you get out of my post then sure go with that. In your world, Sanders is just another JAG like Smallwood and Blount so please draft accordingly. Good luck!

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4 minutes ago, LivingOnTheEdge said:

 

wishful delusional thinking ... I admire your enthusiasm but you will be disappointed  

 

Please list all of the really talented RBs that Pederson has platooned in Philly.....

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20 minutes ago, wideopen21 said:

 

Yeah, if that is what you get out of my post then sure go with that. In your world, Sanders is just another JAG like Smallwood and Blount so please draft accordingly. Good luck!

 

Is this just a joke? I don’t get it

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31 minutes ago, wideopen21 said:

 

Please list all of the really talented RBs that Pederson has platooned in Philly.....

 

doesn't matter, he will not change his system or his mindset for a first year player ... He is NOT a savior

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14 minutes ago, whoopsie said:

Someone sell me on Miles Sanders

He's fast. Like really, really fast

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1 hour ago, elroypedro said:

 

So your point is that you just hope, or wish, that things could go this way, despite ALl evidence? Wtf?

 

What evidence is there against his success?

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Just now, Gootz said:

 

What evidence is there against his success?

Ample. It has been posted in depth, and my response above is to an idiotic post ignoring all of the evidence because of his feelings and hopes.

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24 minutes ago, elroypedro said:

Ample. It has been posted in depth, and my response above is to an idiotic post ignoring all of the evidence because of his feelings and hopes.

 

Assuming he will be great is as foolish as assuming he is just like Corey Clement, Smallwood, Blount etc..

I see the downside if he isn't good, a pure platoon guy. I also see the upside if he is as good as they hoped (you know, taking him in the 2nd) and he emerges as an elite RB that many passed on because "um, he platooned Corey Clement and Smallwood therefore he will always platoon his RBs no matter how good they are."

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1 hour ago, elroypedro said:

Ample. It has been posted in depth, and my response above is to an idiotic post ignoring all of the evidence because of his feelings and hopes.

 

You just posted the split of three very mediocre RBs in the past three years and ran with it as "proof" how Pederson uses RBs in his system. Not to mention that you like to ignore the fact what Pederson does in his system when he has a competent RB. I have no irons in this Eagles RB fire but you are in full troll mode vs people not directly agreeing with your post. Grow up.

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Doug Pederson as OC of the Chiefs:

2013: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 259 carries for 1287 yds, 12 rush TD; 70 rec for 693 yds, 7 rec TDs, and made the probowl and was 1st team all-pro

2014: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 206 carries for 1033 yds, 9 rush TD; 40 rec for 291 yds, 5 rec TDs and made the probowl

2015: Jamaal Charles tore his ACL in week 5 and Charcandrick West and Spencer Ware ended up sharing the load for the most part.

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1 hour ago, smeeze said:

Doug Pederson as OC of the Chiefs:

2013: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 259 carries for 1287 yds, 12 rush TD; 70 rec for 693 yds, 7 rec TDs, and made the probowl and was 1st team all-pro

2014: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 206 carries for 1033 yds, 9 rush TD; 40 rec for 291 yds, 5 rec TDs and made the probowl

2015: Jamaal Charles tore his ACL in week 5 and Charcandrick West and Spencer Ware ended up sharing the load for the most part.

 

FYI Reid was the play caller during those years. Reid ABSOLUTELY uses a bellcow. In his last 15 years coaching, he has had a bellcow RB every single one of those years that averaged 17+ touches per game, and more than half of his starting RBs during that decade-and-a-half span averaged over 20+ touches per game.

 

 

Pederson, on the other hand, didn’t call plays OR do player substitutions in KC, Reid did. And like Reid, Pederson does both now in Philly. He is in full control of who is on the field at any given time, and his philosophy is 100% RBBC, by both proclamation and repeated and consistent action.

 

 

Here is Pederson in the past, talking about his personal RB philosophy: “The way it is set up is by design, by scheme design, a particular back might be good at a certain run scheme, so we put that back in on that particular play.” 

 

 

And more Pederson on the subject: “It’s game plan specific. We go into each game — and of course, injury, obviously plays a part into that as we get going. [It’s] by game plan and how we want to utilize our running backs. It’s week-to-week.”

 

 

And here is Pederson on the current RB room, specifically Howard and Sanders: 

"Jordan has kind of been one of those running backs in Chicago that was very productive," Pederson said. "Then Matt Nagy took over and things changed just a little bit. I'm not going to, I don't know all the ins and outs there, but we were fortunate enough to pick him up to bring him into Philadelphia. I've always liked Jordan Howard and what he's done in his young career. He's one of the top running backs, when you look at some of the production numbers. He's one of the top guys, he's up there with some of those big-time running backs. So, he's going to bring stability. He's a big, powerful back, he's a downhill runner.

"I'm excited about his opportunity here in Philadelphia, and then we addressed with Miles Sanders in the draft. We felt real comfortable with him, we liked everything about him, great kid. Again, great production. He sat behind Saquon Barkleythere at Penn State and really learned from him, and when he had an opportunity to produce, he did. It really gives us a little more stability now going into this season with those two guys."

 

 

Here is Philly RB coach Deuce Staley on this current RB room: “To have the type of backfield we have now, we’re going to share the ball and these guys understand that.”

 

 

More Staley: “We talk about if you’re going out there and your number is called, you just go out there and do the best you can during that play. Don’t worry about the course of the game … just take advantage of your number being called during that time ... These guys understand. It’s something we’ve been doing for a while.”

 

 

And the man himself, Miles Sanders, with his thoughts: “Nobody’s really going to be the star running back, I think. I think the ball’s going to be spread out a lot, and that’s what I kind of like, too."

 

 

 

 

I feel like I’m taking crazy pills conversing with some of the more whacked out(maybe drunk or on pills?) posters here who are just living in la la land and refuse to discuss real facts in good faith.

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4 hours ago, elroypedro said:

Ample. It has been posted in depth, and my response above is an idiotic post ignoring all of the evidence because of my feelings and hopes.

FTFY

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14 minutes ago, elroypedro said:

I feel like I’m taking crazy pills conversing with some of the more whacked out(maybe drunk or on pills?) posters here who are just living in la la land and refuse to discuss real facts in good faith.

lol @ coachspeak = facts :lol:  You're the one who refuses to discuss, or even provide, facts. If you want to hate on Sanders go for it, but pretending it's anything else is hilariously weak. This season could go any number of ways but to act like Sanders couldn't become the man because "that's not how Pederson does things" and throw out some vague, meaningless quotes as if it backs your view in any way is not even a house of cards because a house of cards is stronger than that. What did you expect him to say?  "Howard sucks, I can't believe we signed him?"

And lmao @ another person on here who thinks disagreeing with him = stupid or drunk or whatever. As Itsame said, stop acting so childish. Spitting at people doesn't do your viewpoint or your credibility any favors. 

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My approach to Miles. He's gonna be a flex play with reasonable upside. Ppr leagues I think he is a solid pick at current adp, if you've noticed the pickings past Philip Lindsay range are extremely slim this year. So ideally your rb3.

He's gonna get vultured by at least Howard, possibly at times Clement and/or Sproles, so he's more of a floor play with passing game work. Not to mention they have Ertz, Goedert, JJAW, Alshon. Pederson is a tricky *********** at the GL. Wentz is gonna have an excellent year.

By the fantasy playoffs, Miles' talent could earn him a 15-20 touch floor, and he ends up an Rb2.

Edited by the Ghost of Joe Webb

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So hard to constitute the ADP with so many mouths to fees on the birds this year. I mean if talent was the only thing that mattered, I would draft Miles in round 3, but round 6 may even be a little too rich for me right now

 

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15 hours ago, smeeze said:

Doug Pederson as OC of the Chiefs:

2013: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 259 carries for 1287 yds, 12 rush TD; 70 rec for 693 yds, 7 rec TDs, and made the probowl and was 1st team all-pro

2014: Jamaal Charles started 15 games, had 206 carries for 1033 yds, 9 rush TD; 40 rec for 291 yds, 5 rec TDs and made the probowl

2015: Jamaal Charles tore his ACL in week 5 and Charcandrick West and Spencer Ware ended up sharing the load for the most part.

I hear ya man....but it just hasn’t happened in his HC stint.  I’ve heard no indication they are intent on finding a workhorse.   Same way they run other position groups like DL.  Many fresh bodies, smart schemes, no over-reliance on any one guy.  

 And Miles Sanders is no JC.  

Sanders is a total flyer imo-  in desperate need of injury to his competition.   Not touching Eagles backs personally.  In mid to later rounds I’d rather go with a backfield likely to see only 2 contributors.  There’s many to choose from.   

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1 minute ago, oresteszero said:

Did he play last night?

No carries.   Clement and Adams did the work 

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1 minute ago, oresteszero said:

Did he play last night?

Nope. Sanders and Howard did not play.

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His ADP is way too high. You can convince yourself that Howard is some JAG all you want but it doesn't change the fact that he averages 1,100 yards per season over his 3 year career or that he was one of the most elusive RBs over his first two seasons. He's also one of the best zone running backs in the NFL (something Nagy used ZERO of). The Eagles will use the zone plenty. 

I just don't see it for Sanders this year. 8-12 touches a game with very limited GL work if any means his ceiling is very low. He's pushing into the Ingram, Michel, Lindsay, and Coleman range. These guys actually have some sort of stability and set role in the backfields. 

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I think on Sanders in a keeper league I am going to take him.  Howard is a UFA next year and this could be ALL Sanders next year.

I agree with the argument in re-draft it might be tough to get touches, but I think by year end he is the guy.  Things change over the season.  NOW it might not look good, but in 3 months how does that backfield look.  Next year I think it's all his and he is a high 3rd Rd pick.


ADP update, in the last week on NFC i see him at 62.  So high stakes cash guys are taking him there as of this writing in redraft

Edited by tdfxman
ADP update

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