Smoketheclay

Kicker Strategy

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2 minutes ago, kraftwrk_5 said:

 

It has nothing to do with “competitive leagues”. Has to do with how your guys do on a given week vs. your opponents. Anything can happen on any given Sunday. Usually I’m either winning by more than 10 or losing by more than 10. As I said in my OP, if it looks like it’ll be close heading into sunday night / Monday, I’ll break down and pick up a kicker. I’m amazed this is even controversial. 😆

What's your points for and points against if you don't mind?

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2 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

Lol. I'd be unbeaten if I was getting guys like hyde in round 21. My league is fun and competitive. Yours seems weird. I hate kickers myself but I'm not leaving points off the board when games are often times decided by less than 5 points. 

 

I think we’ll just have to agree that our league settings are too different to make an apples to apples comparison. I’m also in a 10-teamer, so if you’re playing in a 16, 20-teamer, then yeah, the margin of error will be a lot smaller. Looks like I have more roster spots too, so kicker not as important. Also, when we had our draft, Hyde had just been traded from KC to Houston, for context. 22 total rounds in my draft. But again 6 or more of those spots will be taken up by IDP or D/ST. And most of us roster 3 QBs for the byes.

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That’s actually an interesting strategy.  I don’t think it’s THAT crazy

 

picking up a handcuff - then dropping him for a kicker for the 1pm+ games IF there are good later matchup kickers out on the wire.

 

For example, picking up L Murray for the early game...then finding out Kamara is done for the year.  In this case you’d keep Murray and drop someone else for a kicker

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3 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

What's your points for and points against if you don't mind?

 

Are you asking week-to-week or season long? Last week I lost 268.85-246.70. Kicker didn’t make the difference. I’d have won if I’d only flexed Lindsay instead of Shady, grrrrr. Season long, I’m 1273.30-1177.40. Currently in 6th place at 3-2. 5th in scoring so far.

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8 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

In competitive leagues, 5 points can make the difference between winning and losing...

 

I think your misunderstanding the strategy, sometimes 95% of the matchup's players are played on the 1pm-4pm Sunday games, for those weeks, you can easily tell if you are going to win or not before Sunday night's game even starts, if it's close, pick up a kicker playing Sunday night or Monday night, even 12-Team leagues have kickers on WW who can produce just as much as any of the top kickers on any given Sunday.

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One thing to note though, Kraftwerk, if you tried to pick up the Sunday night or Monday night kicker against me...I’d be picking them up and dropping them so you a sh** out of luck

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3 minutes ago, Smoketheclay said:

That’s actually an interesting strategy.  I don’t think it’s THAT crazy

 

picking up a handcuff - then dropping him for a kicker for the 1pm+ games IF there are good later matchup kickers out on the wire.

 

For example, picking up L Murray for the early game...then finding out Kamara is done for the year.  In this case you’d keep Murray and drop someone else for a kicker

 

Yup - I do this basically every week. Sometimes I’ll even get crazy and go into the week missing one or two IDPs (which I can quickly pick up if it looks like I need them). Rostering Chase Edmonds instead of a kicker for right now.

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2 minutes ago, AJx88x said:

 

I think your misunderstanding the strategy, sometimes 95% of the matchup's players are played on the 1pm-4pm Sunday games, for those weeks, you can easily tell if you are going to win or not before Sunday night's game even starts, if it's close, pick up a kicker playing Sunday night or Monday night, even 12-Team leagues have kickers on WW who can produce just as much as any of the top kickers on any given Sunday.

 

You got it.

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2 minutes ago, Smoketheclay said:

One thing to note though, Kraftwerk, if you tried to pick up the Sunday night or Monday night kicker against me...I’d be picking them up and dropping them so you a sh** out of luck

 

I’d love that. Bring it on. 😂

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22 minutes ago, Nyblazer11235 said:

 

For starters, kickers weekly output can vary anywhere between 0-20s 

 

Is it really that rare for you to have a matchup decided by less than 20 points?

 

Secondly, many leagues use points scored as the tiebreaker in playoff spots 

 

How many kickers this year would you say are absolute must own? Are there any that are a necessity to hold onto through their bye week? In my ten team league, what if they all were drafted before I felt comfortable taking them, or are otherwise owned by different teams? Then what do I do - make a trade for one? Or don't you think that it would be smarter at that point, especially if I had a bench that is full of assets that I'd rather not outright drop if it isn't required, just to stream them? And if I'm streaming, what's the hurry to pick one up that I know is going to be there if and when I need them?

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56 minutes ago, smeeze said:

8/10 teams making playoffs is hilarious


I play in a league where that is the system too.  Its a league with work mates and it’s a ton of fun.  The only prize is a crappy little trophy and it’s still really competitive.  
 

Not every league has to be a hardcore money league.  

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1 minute ago, lla887 said:


I play in a league where that is the system too.  Its a league with work mates and it’s a ton of fun.  The only prize is a crappy little trophy and it’s still really competitive.  
 

Not every league has to be a hardcore money league.  

 

I play FF because I like football, and some leagues I play in I play with friends.

I've played for money in the past and honestly I'd rather just lay some action on games or play DFS.  Year long money leagues are the pits IMO.

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13 minutes ago, AJx88x said:

 

I think your misunderstanding the strategy, sometimes 95% of the matchup's players are played on the 1pm-4pm Sunday games, for those weeks, you can easily tell if you are going to win or not before Sunday night's game even starts, if it's close, pick up a kicker playing Sunday night or Monday night, even 12-Team leagues have kickers on WW who can produce just as much as any of the top kickers on any given Sunday.

I'm not misunderstanding. It's a dumb strategy, plain and simple. OP asks for advice, not what someone who plays in a league that crowns 8 champions does. In a lot of leagues, two or three teams will finish with the same record and the one with the most points makes the playoffs. 

 

In a vacuum, sure, it's a fine strategy. But season long, it's not. And nobody is saying he can't do it or can't post like he claimed earlier. But he should have posted his league settings in his first post and we all could have avoided this mess.

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7 minutes ago, lla887 said:


I play in a league where that is the system too.  Its a league with work mates and it’s a ton of fun.  The only prize is a crappy little trophy and it’s still really competitive.  
 

Not every league has to be a hardcore money league.  

 

I’ve played in other leagues where less than half make the playoffs (e.g., where only 4/10 make it in). It’s seriously the pits. Half the guys stop doing anything to their team by about week 8, not making any moves or even setting their lineup week-to-week. Redraft would be even worse, because there’s absolutely nothing to look forward to if you’re out of contention. In contrast, mine is exciting from wire to wire.

Sounds like our leagues are similar in that regard. Mine isn’t for money either, just bragging rights. I actually think that makes it a lot more fun too. People get all bent out of shape and bitter when money is involved. Friendships can and have been lost over it. In contrast, our friendships have gotten stronger.

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10 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

I'm not misunderstanding. It's a dumb strategy, plain and simple. OP asks for advice, not what someone who plays in a league that crowns 8 champions does. In a lot of leagues, two or three teams will finish with the same record and the one with the most points makes the playoffs. 

 

You also don't have to check on the score to make the move on picking up the kicker, you could just wait to see if your extra bench stash worked out during his 1pm game, if not, drop and pick up a kicker, and still fight for those extra points. I'm in multiple leagues, in one league, the settings won't allow it, but in another 12-Team money league, it does. It's a move that I usually see made early in the season, when there's a lot of uncertain bench stashes that are quickly answered within the first two weeks, it's a lot less done later during the season when most bench stashes are solidified.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

I'm not misunderstanding. It's a dumb strategy, plain and simple. OP asks for advice, not what someone who plays in a league that crowns 8 champions does. In a lot of leagues, two or three teams will finish with the same record and the one with the most points makes the playoffs. 

 

In a vacuum, sure, it's a fine strategy. But season long, it's not. And nobody is saying he can't do it or can't post like he claimed earlier. But he should have posted his league settings in his first post and we all could have avoided this mess.

 

Lol, we have one champion, not eight, but I get it. Sorry I touched such a nerve. 😂 I would hate to play in a league where kickers made such a difference. FF should be about QBs, WRs, RBs, and yes DEFENSE. Not kickers (IMO). Unless you’ve got Legatron, they’re just far too random from week to week.

The NFL doesn’t even take kickers seriously. That’s why extra points are now basically field goals.

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47 minutes ago, kraftwrk_5 said:

 

Try again. It’s actually a lot more challenging (and fun IMHO) to play with defensive players. Requires you to do more research, watch more games, and above all use your brain.

 

Sorry had to reply. As you likely know there is a lot of luck in football.  It's a funny oblong shaped thing and if you've ever chased after one as it's bouncing around or even seen this happen you know what kind of crazy bounces it can take. Then consider all the other variables throughout a game that can come into play and I'm 100% OUT on IDP.  The player you expect to make tackles/sacks is game-planned to clog up an interior gap and require 2 blockers to contain him or does end up getting to the QB but because of the double-team his teammate gets there first and records the sack. Or CB provides great coverage and is there to make the pick but because of a deflection your teammate gets it. Or you're about to make the pick but get interfered with so don't get it. Etc.  Yes there is similar risk in all fantasy but the offensive players production provides less volatility.  Not dissing ya as if you have time to research and you enjoy it to each his own.  Just don't feel the juice is worth the squeeze. 

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2 minutes ago, AJx88x said:

 

You also don't have to check on the score to make the move on picking up the kicker, you could just wait to see if your extra bench stash worked out during his 1pm game, if not, drop and pick up a kicker, and still fight for those extra points. I'm in multiple leagues, in one league, the settings won't allow it, but in another 12-Team money league, it does. It's a move that I usually see made early in the season, when there's a lot of uncertain bench stashes that are quickly answered within the first two weeks, it's a lot less done later during the season when most bench stashes are solidified.

 

 

 

Well said. I think the guys fighting so hard against this don’t really understand how this works and what we’re doing. 😆 This shouldn’t be controversial at all IMO. It’s smart.

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1 minute ago, bigpoppy said:

Sorry had to reply. As you likely know there is a lot of luck in football.  It's a funny oblong shaped thing and if you've ever chased after one as it's bouncing around or even seen this happen you know what kind of crazy bounces it can take. Then consider all the other variables throughout a game that can come into play and I'm 100% OUT on IDP.  The player you expect to make tackles/sacks is game-planned to clog up an interior gap and require 2 blockers to contain him or does end up getting to the QB but because of the double-team his teammate gets there first and records the sack. Or CB provides great coverage and is there to make the pick but because of a deflection your teammate gets it. Or you're about to make the pick but get interfered with so don't get it. Etc.  Yes there is similar risk in all fantasy but the offensive players production provides less volatility.  Not dissing ya as if you have time to research and you enjoy it to each his own.  Just don't feel the juice is worth the squeeze. 

 

I get it, and it’s definitely more challenging. I think it adds a fun dimension that you could still win your league on the backs of your defense if you weren’t lucky enough to get a Kamara or CMC. One interesting wrinkle is safetys and linebackers who consistently rack up tackles are more valuable than a shutdown corner (who may not get thrown to much, and only get INTs here and there) or a pass rusher (same inconsistency, but with sacks). Similarly teams with horrible defenses usually have better IDPs than good defenses since they’re out there more (for instance Jordan Hicks of the Cardinals is killing it for me this year). It definitely requires more roster maintenance, as it’s harder to find more info on these guys since not every league has IDPs. But to each his own.

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32 minutes ago, stigmatadiacory said:

 

How many kickers this year would you say are absolute must own? Are there any that are a necessity to hold onto through their bye week? In my ten team league, what if they all were drafted before I felt comfortable taking them, or are otherwise owned by different teams? Then what do I do - make a trade for one? Or don't you think that it would be smarter at that point, especially if I had a bench that is full of assets that I'd rather not outright drop if it isn't required, just to stream them? And if I'm streaming, what's the hurry to pick one up that I know is going to be there if and when I need them?

 

Nothing wrong with streaming kickers. I was speaking to the point of simply not using a kicker ever which is what was said originally 

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6 minutes ago, kraftwrk_5 said:

 

Lol, we have one champion, not eight, but I get it. Sorry I touched such a nerve. 😂 I would hate to play in a league where kickers made such a difference. FF should be about QBs, WRs, RBs, and yes DEFENSE. Not kickers (IMO). Unless you’ve got Legatron, they’re just far too random from week to week.

The NFL doesn’t even take kickers seriously. That’s why extra points are now basically field goals.

You didn't touch a nerve. You just make no sense. Hell, kickers outscore 2nd and 3rd tier tight ends on a regular. In a game where points are king, you're intentionally leaving points off the board. I hate kickers too and wish they weren't part of it, but they are so I'm starting one. If coaches had roster spots, I'd draft and play a coach, too.

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43 minutes ago, Smoketheclay said:

That’s actually an interesting strategy.  I don’t think it’s THAT crazy

 

picking up a handcuff - then dropping him for a kicker for the 1pm+ games IF there are good later matchup kickers out on the wire.

 

For example, picking up L Murray for the early game...then finding out Kamara is done for the year.  In this case you’d keep Murray and drop someone else for a kicker

 

This is actually a good strategy for platforms that allow bench drops after a guy has played.

 

I just think it’s extremely foolish to bypass ever having a kicker during the regular season because you think minimal points can’t make a difference 

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2 minutes ago, Mest30 said:

You didn't touch a nerve. You just make no sense. Hell, kickers outscore 2nd and 3rd tier tight ends on a regular. In a game where points are king, you're intentionally leaving points off the board. I hate kickers too and wish they weren't part of it, but they are so I'm starting one. If coaches had roster spots, I'd draft and play a coach, too.

 

Bingo

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