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New York Yankees 2020 Outlook

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13 minutes ago, smeeze said:

Bird, Sheffield, Florial, Fowler, Medina, etc etc etc... are you implying the Yankees haven’t had prospects bust?

Why would we be discussing prospects that are no longer with the Yankees? Yankees currently have a plethora of prospects that any team would love to have.

Edited by Dirty Little Birdie

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20 minutes ago, Dirty Little Birdie said:

Why would we be discussing prospects that are no longer with the Yankees? Yankees currently have a plethora of prospects that any team would love to have.

Outside of Jasson, who exactly?

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They should just feel lucky the commissioner premitively prepared for this with 8 playoff teams in case one of the "flagship" teams had injuries. Because in the old format this team would be very likely sitting at home.

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2 hours ago, smeeze said:

Bird, Sheffield, Florial, Fowler, Medina, etc etc etc... are you implying the Yankees haven’t had prospects bust?

Greg Bird has been with Texas all year long.  Currently demoted by them too and at their alt team site as a reserve.  Yankees did promote Florial probably hoping to showcase him though.

If Stanton and Judge hadn't decided to make their new home almost permanently on the IL list I could see Clint Frasier going back to the Indians but the Yankees actually need him now.

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15 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Greg Bird has been with Texas all year long.  Currently demoted by them too and at their alt team site as a reserve.  Yankees did promote Florial probably hoping to showcase him though.

Yep, I’m aware. He definitely qualifies as a Yankee’s busted prospect. He got no shortage of hype on these boards and the general fantasy community and IMO a lot of that was because his shirt and pants happened to have pinstripes. 

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6 minutes ago, smeeze said:

Yep, I’m aware. He definitely qualifies as a Yankee’s busted prospect. He got no shortage of hype on these boards and the general fantasy community and IMO a lot of that was because his shirt and pants happened to have pinstripes. 

Yeah I remember when he was suppose to be pushing Luke Voit aside.  Hahaha.

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So are the Yankees trying to break last year's record for injuries or what?  Got to hand it to them they are doing remarkable on that front given such a short season.

Quote

Aaron Hicks left Sunday's game against the Mets due to an apparent injury.

Hicks appeared to twist his ankle on a swing during a fifth-inning plate appearance that ultimately led to a walk. Brett Gardner entered the game to run for him. Look for an update soon from New York.

Source: Lindsey Adler on Twitter               Aug 30, 2020, 6:47 PM ET

 

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6 hours ago, Dirty Little Birdie said:

So disappointing. What the hell. 

Not like Cashman had much of a choice imo.  Never been a fan of his, but outside of Clevinger and Lynn, there was not a lot there worth trading for.  In the former case, the man is of questionable character and not really a good fit for the clubhouse imo (to say nothing of needing a hair cut if he came over lol).  In the latter case, we went that way with Lynn before and he was not that great.  You could argue he improved since going to Texas, but I would not want to trade for him to watch him pull another Sonny Gray on us and Texas, like usual, was asking for too much by all accounts.

They have a glut of OFs so getting Marte did not make any sense.  It is not like they do not have quality OFs in bulk...they have quality OFs that can't stay on the field.  At this point, with 16 teams in the playoffs they are almost guaranteed a spot barring a complete implosion (though it has not looked good lately) and they are going nowhere anyway if they continue to have most of their key players perpetually hurt.  Even Clevinger would not make a difference if if Judge, Stanton and Torres all remain out, Sanchez is hitting the temperature, Hicks (when he is not hurt) and Gardner are hitting their weight, Urshella is scuffling\hurt,  Paxton is hurt (again), etc. Something is fundamentally wrong with this team's conditioning\training to continue to get hurt to this level over the course of 2 seasons now imo. 

 

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On 8/30/2020 at 7:24 PM, The Big Bat Theory said:

So are the Yankees trying to break last year's record for injuries or what?  Got to hand it to them they are doing remarkable on that front given such a short season.

 

Easy when you have the Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig and Whitey Ford of injuries on your roster in the form of Stanton, Judge and Paxton.  To say nothing of honorable mention\single season injury MVP types like Hicks.

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2 hours ago, secretagentman said:

Not like Cashman had much of a choice imo.  Never been a fan of his, but outside of Clevinger and Lynn, there was not a lot there worth trading for.  In the former case, the man is of questionable character and not really a good fit for the clubhouse imo (to say nothing of needing a hair cut if he came over lol).  In the latter case, we went that way with Lynn before and he was not that great.  You could argue he improved since going to Texas, but I would not want to trade for him to watch him pull another Sonny Gray on us and Texas, like usual, was asking for too much by all accounts.

They have a glut of OFs so getting Marte did not make any sense.  It is not like they do not have quality OFs in bulk...they have quality OFs that can't stay on the field.  At this point, with 16 teams in the playoffs they are almost guaranteed a spot barring a complete implosion (though it has not looked good lately) and they are going nowhere anyway if they continue to have most of their key players perpetually hurt.  Even Clevinger would not make a difference if if Judge, Stanton and Torres all remain out, Sanchez is hitting the temperature, Hicks (when he is not hurt) and Gardner are hitting their weight, Urshella is scuffling\hurt,  Paxton is hurt (again), etc. Something is fundamentally wrong with this team's conditioning\training to continue to get hurt to this level over the course of 2 seasons now imo. 

 

Clevinger was the guy to get and the fact that Cash could have had him from reports if he included Frazier and 1 of Garcia or Schmitt is inexcusable 

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What is up with this team's conditioning? Do you think it's luck of the draw that they got a bunch of guys who happen to lack durability? Or is it systemic? It's not even like it's the occasional DL stint and guys come back. Guys go on the DL and then stay there for huge spans of time a la Stanton last year and Judge this year.

 

Alternatively, do you think they're bubble wrapping guys like Judge that they think aren't durable and saving them for the playoffs kind of like "load management" for kawhi leanord in the NBA?

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37 minutes ago, Triple Short Of a Cycle said:

Clevinger was the guy to get and the fact that Cash could have had him from reports if he included Frazier and 1 of Garcia or Schmitt is inexcusable 

Yeah if you want another selfish moron on your team and want to overpay to get him.  And as I noted, they are not going to win with or without another SP if their entire squad is on the IL and they have enough to win it all in theory already if they actually managed to get everyone on the field for an extended period of time.  Why should they massively overpay with their top pitching prospect and a MLB ready OF that should probably be starting for them every day as it is to get another SP that is such a selfish moron he risked his team mates season and health to go out on the town with his equally stupid buddy?

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36 minutes ago, ktierne3 said:

What is up with this team's conditioning? Do you think it's luck of the draw that they got a bunch of guys who happen to lack durability? Or is it systemic? It's not even like it's the occasional DL stint and guys come back. Guys go on the DL and then stay there for huge spans of time a la Stanton last year and Judge this year.

 

Alternatively, do you think they're bubble wrapping guys like Judge that they think aren't durable and saving them for the playoffs kind of like "load management" for kawhi leanord in the NBA?

They are not bubble wrapping anyone.  Well beyond that point.  Stanton and Judge are pieces or glass.  Their body types are such that they lack flexibility as it is imo and they both seem to just be brittle and will pull a muscle breathing.  As to the others, they managed to get Hicks who is always hurt....Paxton who is always hurt...Sanchez who gets hurt a lot as well, etc.  The only fairly durable ones are Lamahieu, Voit (to a degree), Torres (this year not withstanding) and Urshella.  Gardner stays healthy most of the time as well.

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2 hours ago, secretagentman said:

Yeah if you want another selfish moron on your team and want to overpay to get him.  And as I noted, they are not going to win with or without another SP if their entire squad is on the IL and they have enough to win it all in theory already if they actually managed to get everyone on the field for an extended period of time.  Why should they massively overpay with their top pitching prospect and a MLB ready OF that should probably be starting for them every day as it is to get another SP that is such a selfish moron he risked his team mates season and health to go out on the town with his equally stupid buddy?

As far as getting pitching. Keeping Gray, ditching Larry or getting Clevinger were the only good choices the Yankees could have made pitching wise outside of getting Cole. . But you can’t just stop at Cole, especially when Severino goes down. Happ being a clubhouse cancer, Paxton having issues coming back from back surgery. How do you stand pat and let Clevinger get away because you’re unwilling to trade a guy that has no spot with the team unless injuries occur, and Deivi who even with a great outing is still not assured a 2nd start. Teams that want to win aren’t afraid of making a trade like that. If they were struggling for playoff contention, sure, keep Frazier. But Frazier isn’t going to be the reason why they stay in the playoff hunt. He’s a literal non-factor even with a depleted roster. You can argue in the last 2 weeks he’s hurt the team more than helped them. And anyone that disagrees I hope also believes Gardner and Ford are just as important to the team in 2020 because take out Frazier’s first 3 games and he’s worse than both Ford and Gardner.

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9 hours ago, Triple Short Of a Cycle said:

As far as getting pitching. Keeping Gray, ditching Larry or getting Clevinger were the only good choices the Yankees could have made pitching wise outside of getting Cole. . But you can’t just stop at Cole, especially when Severino goes down. Happ being a clubhouse cancer, Paxton having issues coming back from back surgery. How do you stand pat and let Clevinger get away because you’re unwilling to trade a guy that has no spot with the team unless injuries occur, and Deivi who even with a great outing is still not assured a 2nd start. Teams that want to win aren’t afraid of making a trade like that. If they were struggling for playoff contention, sure, keep Frazier. But Frazier isn’t going to be the reason why they stay in the playoff hunt. He’s a literal non-factor even with a depleted roster. You can argue in the last 2 weeks he’s hurt the team more than helped them. And anyone that disagrees I hope also believes Gardner and Ford are just as important to the team in 2020 because take out Frazier’s first 3 games and he’s worse than both Ford and Gardner.

Keeping Gray?...the man was clueless in NY.  You can argue that was coaching but that is difficult to believe.  More likely what is between his head.

As to expecting an OF\DH combo of Stanton, Hicks and Judge to stay healthy for any length of time at this point is like wishing for snow in August in NY.  Not a chance.  Not a question of whether they get hurt, but when and for how long.  Say what you will about Frazier, right now he is our best OF offensively and likely to be that for a couple more weeks min.  It is not his fault he has to bat 3rd or 4th instead of 6th or 7th where he should because they have a combo of role players and under-performing stiffs at multiple positions.

As to Ford, he is a backup 1b playing more than he should because Boone for whatever god unknown reason likes to get him ABs and sit one of Tauchman, Gardner, Hicks or Frazier with regularity.  He is over-managing instead of going with his best players every day as much as he can.

And again, why you would want a clubhouse problem and moron and trade away an MLB OF and your best pitching prospect for him is beyond me.  They are not going to go deep in the playoffs unless they stop fielding a AAA offense by and large, get everyone back and playing well.  And that is not going to happen anytime soon.  If it does and if they get some luck, they can win it all.  If it doesn't, one more pitcher is not likely to make a difference when they can't score and are playing 4 or 5 sub Mendoza line hitters every day.  And top playoff teams do not send out 4th or 5th starters in the players to go hang curves for the likes of .125 Sanchez to hit. 

The starting pitching has been by and large good over the current struggle period.  It is their so called stellar bullpen and horrible offense that is killing them.  That may correct itself and when it does, like many mediocre teams, the starting pitching may go slump as mediocre teams often run into the old when they hit they don't pitch, when they pitch they don't hit quagmire.  We shall see what happens, but trading away the farm to get a starting pitcher that may or may not help in the current environment and haphazard schedule would have been foolish imo and a panic move.

What Cashman should be doing for next season is figuring a way to unload Stanton (almost impossible) and Hicks and rebuild the OF with more reliable, consistent guys.  It is pretty clear you can not rely on either of them to stay on the field for more than a month or two of a season.  Judge is in the same boat, but they are not going to deal him. 

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There seems to be a sentiment that injuries are not predictable.  They certainly are.  Big muscular body types are injury prone.

Yandy Diaz just hit the DL.  No surprise there.

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10 hours ago, Triple Short Of a Cycle said:

As far as getting pitching. Keeping Gray, ditching Larry or getting Clevinger were the only good choices the Yankees could have made pitching wise outside of getting Cole. . But you can’t just stop at Cole, especially when Severino goes down. Happ being a clubhouse cancer, Paxton having issues coming back from back surgery. How do you stand pat and let Clevinger get away because you’re unwilling to trade a guy that has no spot with the team unless injuries occur, and Deivi who even with a great outing is still not assured a 2nd start. Teams that want to win aren’t afraid of making a trade like that. If they were struggling for playoff contention, sure, keep Frazier. But Frazier isn’t going to be the reason why they stay in the playoff hunt. He’s a literal non-factor even with a depleted roster. You can argue in the last 2 weeks he’s hurt the team more than helped them. And anyone that disagrees I hope also believes Gardner and Ford are just as important to the team in 2020 because take out Frazier’s first 3 games and he’s worse than both Ford and Gardner.

Wait.... so just remove 3 of his most productive games out of a 14 game sample? lol   Should I take out 3 of his 0 for 3 games and tell you what his stats would be without those then too?  Frazier has played very well.

Clevinger not worth the farm to the Yankees, not in this season of so many unknowns.  Look at the Rays rotation they have 2 guys Snell and Glasnow.  And Fleming they just brought along who is a nobody but pitched well for them so far.  Glasnow has a 4.24 ERA and Snell has averaged 4IP per start.  Give me Cole, Tanaka, Montgomery, Garcia, Happ over that any day.

Yankees have Garcia and Schmidt 2 very solid potential studs who are ML ready.As it is pitching isn't a big concern for them. Happ might be turning it around after his last start and new found motivation. Our bullpen of Otto, Britton, Green, Chapman, Loaisiga is solid.

This whole season has been a mess for baseball though.  If some teams want to gamble more than others then so be it. But Yankees sure don't need to overspend.

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Is there any chance they would ever consider moving Judge (if even possible)?  No one is taking that Stanton contract so your stuck with that and DJ is due for some money after this season.  I honestly have no idea what Judge would bring back in a trade but I would assume someone would be willing to take a chance on him with how good he plays when healthy.  .  

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12 hours ago, knifeparty said:

Is there any chance they would ever consider moving Judge (if even possible)?  No one is taking that Stanton contract so your stuck with that and DJ is due for some money after this season.  I honestly have no idea what Judge would bring back in a trade but I would assume someone would be willing to take a chance on him with how good he plays when healthy.  .  

It would mean selling low on the face of the franchise.

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15 hours ago, knifeparty said:

Is there any chance they would ever consider moving Judge (if even possible)?  No one is taking that Stanton contract so your stuck with that and DJ is due for some money after this season.  I honestly have no idea what Judge would bring back in a trade but I would assume someone would be willing to take a chance on him with how good he plays when healthy.  .  

Extremely unlikely.  Not only selling low, but as was noted, he is the face of the franchise from a marketing perspective with the Judge's chamber and all.  The fan backlash and marketing loss would be huge and in the end they would never get enough in return.  They more or less just have to hope he somehow finds a way to become less injury prone.    In the worst case they might unload him in his last year before free agency if they came to the determination they would not be re-signing him.

In the case of Hicks, his contract is decent so he could be moved.  But he has to stay on the field and produce decent for awhile to build back his value.  In the case of Stanton, his contract is horrible and they likely would have to eat a good portion of it to unload him for anything decent which is likely never going to happen, esp since he seems to not be able to stay on the field for more than a few weeks at a time.  It is what it is. 

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Andujar needs to be brought up and just see what he can do with regular ABs. He looked terrible before but so does more than half hour lineup.  We don't need to keep sending out Mike Tauchman, Mike Ford, and Thairo Estrada. Could put him at 3B and take Estrada out of the lineup. Anyway this makes absolutely no sense to not be playing him right now.

Edited by MrBrown

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Right now, this team is headed for implosion imo as not even Baltimore's pitching can save them.  Boone insists on running the likes on Mike Ford and Sanchez out there regularly.  In the former case only he knows why.  In the latter case it is because a low 100 hitting C who strikes out almost half the time is the best they have (are they regretting not re-signing Romine).  Add in Gardner, Hicks, Wade\Estrada (not regulars), Tauchman, Torres all of whom have not hit much all season.  "The next man up" this season has turned into the next Mendoza line hitter up and it has been augmented by a number of regulars just stinking up the joint.  You can't win when the only guys you have producing are Lamahieu, Voit and Urshella (and now he is hurt) with some occasional support from Frazier (when he is not rested so a 100 hitter can get some ABs).  Add in the bullpen not being sharp the past few weeks and some generally mediocre pitching overall and you get a team that if this continues will be a low seed in the playoffs and likely out in the first round imo.

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