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Coronavirus (COVID-19) Baseball Impact

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7 hours ago, Thenewwildone8 said:

Lol it’s not a fatal disease for the vast majority of people. They’re hot going to pass up millions of dollars for a vaccine they don’t need. 

 

Yeah in this age of FaceTime, like all of us they’d rather not play baseball for millions of dollars for 4 months and FaceTiming their family instead 😂😂.

 

i suspect that not seeing their family is going to play somewhere between 0 and 0.1% factors. 

 

I've been in my house with my kids for over 3 weeks now.  I'd pay half of Bryce Harper's salary for a 4 month break.

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2 hours ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

 

Yeah nit picky.  That is exactly HOW epidemics are stopped.  The virus doesn't fall from the sky like rain.  It doesn't spring up from the ground like weeds.  

 

Stop giving Satan ideas for next year.

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14 minutes ago, 89Topps said:

 

I've been in my house with my kids for over 3 weeks now.  I'd pay half of Bryce Harper's salary for a 4 month break.

Exactly man, I feel your pain.

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3 hours ago, UberRebel said:

I’m not wearing a mask and neither are the Target employees at the check out line. Not sure where you shop, but there’s no plexiglass in my town when I pay for groceries

I hope those workers stay well then.  I don't live in a hard hit state as of yet but still all grocery checkout personnel wear masks and gloves and plexiglass has been going up there and in convenience stores.

2 hours ago, desert86 said:

You still have constantly posting negative thoughts to get you by. Everyone else will enjoy whatever season the system graces us with. 

He wasn't posting negative thoughts to "get by" (what does that even mean???).  He was simply being pragmatic and not believing in unicorns.  Geesh,  some of you people get freaked out if someone doesn't give you rainbows and roses visions of baseball back in a few weeks.  Well some of us don't live in that dream-colored world and we have the right to keep our feet on the ground without being called negative all the time.

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7 hours ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

I hope those workers stay well then.  I don't live in a hard hit state as of yet but still all grocery checkout personnel wear masks and gloves and plexiglass has been going up there and in convenience stores.

He wasn't posting negative thoughts to "get by" (what does that even mean???).  He was simply being pragmatic and not believing in unicorns.  Geesh,  some of you people get freaked out if someone doesn't give you rainbows and roses visions of baseball back in a few weeks.  Well some of us don't live in that dream-colored world and we have the right to keep our feet on the ground without being called negative all the time.

If you think a pragmatic, feet on the ground,  non dream-colored world is no baseball until 2021 I'd truly hate to see what your negative thoughts are.  You are hiding your negativity behind the term realism.  Realistically everyone in the baseball world is trying to get some sort of season out of 2020, but you refuse to see it.

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57 minutes ago, desert86 said:

If you think a pragmatic, feet on the ground,  non dream-colored world is no baseball until 2021 I'd truly hate to see what your negative thoughts are.  You are hiding your negativity behind the term realism.  Realistically everyone in the baseball world is trying to get some sort of season out of 2020, but you refuse to see it.

Not speaking for @The Big Bat Theory, but I think psychologically, it's easier to expect the very worst case scenario and not get your hopes up.  Then if anything positive happens you will be pleasantly surprised.  

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1 minute ago, El_Chingon said:

Not speaking for @The Big Bat Theory, but I think psychologically, it's easier to expect the very worst case scenario and not get your hopes up.  Then if anything positive happens you will be pleasantly surprised.  

And that's a fine approach to take on an individual level.  However he's painting the picture of people expecting a 2020 season as seeing unicorns and rainbows and his own view as realism and not negativity.  In reality people are working on having a 2020 season.  In reality players and owners want to make money on the 2020 season.  It's fine not to believe it will happen and be pleasantly surprised when it does, but don't paint that as reality.

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13 minutes ago, El_Chingon said:

Not speaking for @The Big Bat Theory, but I think psychologically, it's easier to expect the very worst case scenario and not get your hopes up.  Then if anything positive happens you will be pleasantly surprised.  

This thread has gotten pretty deep for a forum designed for fantasy baseball, lol.

My personal outlook is to try and be comfortable with the idea that the future is ambiguous and unknown to any of us.  I find trying to prognosticate based on an emotional baseline, whether overtly "positive" or "negative" to counterproductive.  All we can really do is try to make a plan based on facts we do have, and try and adapt when that plan is junked up by unknowable variables.

Take the virus.  No one accurately predicted this stuff would happen six months ago.  Even if you did, what can you do now?  Just seek to understand ways you can protect yourself and your family, and roll with it.

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22 minutes ago, JE7HorseGod said:

This thread has gotten pretty deep for a forum designed for fantasy baseball, lol.

My personal outlook is to try and be comfortable with the idea that the future is ambiguous and unknown to any of us.  I find trying to prognosticate based on an emotional baseline, whether overtly "positive" or "negative" to counterproductive.  All we can really do is try to make a plan based on facts we do have, and try and adapt when that plan is junked up by unknowable variables.

Take the virus.  No one accurately predicted this stuff would happen six months ago.  Even if you did, what can you do now?  Just seek to understand ways you can protect yourself and your family, and roll with it.

Agreed.  We watched Cast Away last night and here is the transcribed quote from the ending, completely in line with your viewpoint:

I had power over *nothing*. And that's when this feeling came over me like a warm blanket. I knew, somehow, that I had to stay alive. Somehow. I had to keep breathing. Even though there was no reason to hope. And all my logic said that I would never see this place again. So that's what I did. I stayed alive. I kept breathing. And one day my logic was proven all wrong because the tide came in, and gave me a sail. And now, here I am. I'm back. In Memphis, talking to you. I have ice in my glass... And I've lost her all over again. I'm so sad that I don't have Kelly. But I'm so grateful that she was with me on that island. And I know what I have to do now. I gotta keep breathing. Because tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?”

So my application from this quote was that essentially we as a collective society have to "keep breathing."  Maybe the social distancing will work.  Maybe "the tide" will bring in some magic drug or vaccine to fix everything.  But maybe not.  We are in a place where we don't know what will happen.  Maybe it will get much worse before it gets better.  Living with the ambiguity is the hardest part.  The whole mindset of taking it one day at a time, in the midst of ambiguity and uncertainty.

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2 hours ago, desert86 said:

And that's a fine approach to take on an individual level.  However he's painting the picture of people expecting a 2020 season as seeing unicorns and rainbows and his own view as realism and not negativity.  In reality people are working on having a 2020 season.  In reality players and owners want to make money on the 2020 season.  It's fine not to believe it will happen and be pleasantly surprised when it does, but don't paint that as reality.

This 1000%. Seems literally everyone from MLB baseball to the doctors who study this stuff believe there will be some sort of baseball this year, in some capacity. Why is it the person who disagrees with them is somehow cemented in reality, while those of us who are listening and seem to think things look promising, even if it’s June or July and a 100 game season, are painted as “believing in unicorns”? That’s absolute BS and deserves to be called out every time. 

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4 hours ago, desert86 said:

If you think a pragmatic, feet on the ground,  non dream-colored world is no baseball until 2021 I'd truly hate to see what your negative thoughts are.  You are hiding your negativity behind the term realism.  Realistically everyone in the baseball world is trying to get some sort of season out of 2020, but you refuse to see it.


Maybe you have or have not heard of sports writer Bill Simmons website the ringer. He’s pretty much a die hard and their staff seems full of people that are fun and want sports to happen too. Here are a couple articles you guys can read and then go bash them for being realistic. 
 

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2020/4/7/21212151/mlb-arizona-bubble-coronavirus-plan

 

https://www.theringer.com/coronavirus/2020/4/7/21212680/mlb-nba-ufc-premier-league-proposals-coronavirus-pandemic

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Add Fangraphs' Ben Clemens to the list of people whose livelihood depends on baseball happening, but who's skeptical of the plan as it currently stands.

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From CBS 
📰 What you need to know
1. MLB's Arizona plan is far from foolproof
image
One of the most interesting sports news items to come across the wire -- okay, one of the only sports news items to come across the wire -- over the past couple of days is MLB's rumored contingency plan that would have the league play all games in Arizona to start the season while the current health crisis clears up.
In case you're not caught up, here's a rundown of the idea that's reportedly being discussed between the league and the MLBPA:
  • The league is targeting a May or June start date
  • All players and essential personnel would live in relative isolation at Arizona hotels, only traveling to and from the stadium as to minimize risk of exposure
  • Games would be played in front of no fans
  • An electronic strike zone may be utilized so plate umpires can practice social distancing
  • Players may be forced to sit apart from each other in the stands as opposed to being gathered in the dugout
Arizona is not presently considered a "hot spot" for COVID-19 and the state is home to Chase Field (home of the Diamondbacks) and several Spring Training facilities located within relatively close proximity to one another, so there would be plenty of options for venues. Maybe it's a viable option, but it's not one without major concerns -- some of which players are already speaking out against.
My trusted baseball guy R.J. Anderson brought up some logistical hurdles that would come with the "Arizona plan" as it's presently being reported.
  • Testing: The most glaring issue is testing. Will testing be more widespread and available by the time the league hopes to jump into action? Does the league plan on testing players and personnel every day? If every team tests each player on the 26-man roster daily, then that would mean MLB is using over 20,000 tests a month. And that's just considering players and not other essential personnel. If resources are still somewhat limited, the league burning through that many tests may not look great
  • Weather: As previously mentioned, Arizona is a hotbed for baseball venues with Chase Field and Spring Training facilities. But it's also just hot, period. The home of the Diamondbacks is the only one of those venues with climate control, meaning the league may be asking players to compete in extreme desert heat. That could be especially concerning if the league wants to play frequent double-headers to make up for lost time
  • Injuries: Injuries are going to happen no matter what, but players may be more at risk given the uncharted waters. The league would need to make sure that players would have proper medical attention and possibly work out a plan for non-essential surgeries
  • The minors: What happens to minor league players? Do they just stay at home not play? Do they wait for a call to perhaps join the team at a later date? Without the normal insurance of roster call-ups, MLB could expand rosters to allow for additional reinforcements in the case of injury or illness, but there's increased risk with an increased number of players
  • Families: Are players just expected to be away from their families for months while they're holed up in an Arizona hotel? That seems pretty messed up. However, if the league allows players to bring their families with them, there will need to be more resources secured so that everyone can be safe and comfortable
All of these questions and concerns are extremely valid and, honestly, this doesn't seem like the most fleshed-out plan at the moment. It's a bold and ambitious idea, but is it too desperate? Is there enough sensibility behind it? And is it safe? We all are desperate for sports right now, but nobody wants to see a rushed return turn into concerning results.
For what it's worth, MLB released a statement on the reported plan yesterday and it doesn't seem like they're nearing any sort of decision just yet.
  • MLB: "MLB has been actively considering numerous contingency plans that would allow play to commence once the public health situation has improved to the point that it is safe to do so. While we have discussed the idea of staging games at one location as one potential option, we have not settled on that option or developed a detailed plan...The health and safety of our employees, players, fans and the public at large are paramount, and we are not ready at this time to endorse any particular format for staging games in light of the rapidly changing public health situation caused by the coronavirus."
If the league does manage to work out a contingency plan that makes sense and they're the first sport to return from shutdown, it'll undoubtedly be a very odd experience to behold. And I'm not just talking about the stuff on the field, either. Seeing America fully embrace and salivate over this weird, distorted version of apocalyptic compound baseball might actually be weirder than all sports 
      image
                                       
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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, tucker26 said:


Maybe you have or have not heard of sports writer Bill Simmons website the ringer. He’s pretty much a die hard and their staff seems full of people that are fun and want sports to happen too. Here are a couple articles you guys can read and then go bash them for being realistic. 
 

https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2020/4/7/21212151/mlb-arizona-bubble-coronavirus-plan

 

https://www.theringer.com/coronavirus/2020/4/7/21212680/mlb-nba-ufc-premier-league-proposals-coronavirus-pandemic

 

5 minutes ago, tonycpsu said:

Add Fangraphs' Ben Clemens to the list of people whose livelihood depends on baseball happening, but who's skeptical of the plan as it currently stands.

Being skeptical is fine. But there’s enough thoughts on both sides that painting people who listen to others are believing in “unicorns and rainbows” is a BS thing to say with absolutely no standing. That’s the point. Simmons and Clemens are no experts. If Dr. Fauci appears to see some version of the plan plausible, meaning he believes some baseball could happen, forgive me if I listen to that.

Edited by Backdoor Slider
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3 minutes ago, Backdoor Slider said:

Being skeptical is fine. But there’s enough thoughts on both sides that painting people who listen to others are believing in “unicorns and rainbows” is a BS thing to say with absolutely no standing. That’s the point.

 

That's *your* point, maybe.  You and several others here seem to want to prolong this conversation about who's sufficiently optimistic, pessimistic, or realistic instead of simply accepting that we all have different views of what's feasible.  I was merely sharing a link from someone who might not be an expert on epidemiology, but is far more qualified to talk about baseball.  I happen to think some version of baseball could probably work once we're well over the hump and have sufficient testing in place, but I'm not here to participate in this particular pissing match.

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JMO, but if I were a professional groundskeeper, or other blue collar type worker around baseball, I'd think I'd draw a little bit of umbrage at having a sportswriter decide for me that me going to work is "heartlessly rapacious."

I get that it is coming from a well intentioned place.  But personal choice still matters, and if public health officials deem it safe, this seems like a lot of white knighting.

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5 minutes ago, tonycpsu said:

 

That's *your* point, maybe.  You and several others here seem to want to prolong this conversation about who's sufficiently optimistic, pessimistic, or realistic instead of simply accepting that we all have different views of what's feasible. 

 

11 hours ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

He wasn't posting negative thoughts to "get by" (what does that even mean???).  He was simply being pragmatic and not believing in unicorns.  Geesh,  some of you people get freaked out if someone doesn't give you rainbows and roses visions of baseball back in a few weeks.  Well some of us don't live in that dream-colored world and we have the right to keep our feet on the ground without being called negative all the time.

Lol.

So a poster said “He was being pragmatic and not believing in unicorns,” and then went on some strawman about rainbows and roses if baseball isn’t back in a few weeks (not one person said that), then followed that those listening to plans are living in a “dream-colored world.” But I’m the one not accepting the reality that we all have different views. 
 

Ok, Tony. Have a good one. ✌🏼

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I didn't care for BBT's post, either, but you extending the derail by making the same point over multiple posts isn't helping.  The thread needs a lot less speculation about the mindset / positivity / negativity of other posters, and a lot more focus on the underlying issues.  Going meta leads us down very unproductive paths here.

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5 minutes ago, JE7HorseGod said:

JMO, but if I were a professional groundskeeper, or other blue collar type worker around baseball, I'd think I'd draw a little bit of umbrage at having a sportswriter decide for me that me going to work is "heartlessly rapacious."

I get that it is coming from a well intentioned place.  But personal choice still matters, and if public health officials deem it safe, this seems like a lot of white knighting.

Right? I'm not sure why the idea that most of America doesn't like having people in Washington or New York or LA make decisions for them is so tough for people to grasp. We have a number of professions that involve serious risk and people still do them.

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13 minutes ago, tonycpsu said:

I didn't care for BBT's post, either, but you extending the derail by making the same point over multiple posts isn't helping.  The thread needs a lot less speculation about the mindset / positivity / negativity of other posters, and a lot more focus on the underlying issues.  Going meta leads us down very unproductive paths here.

Agreed with this. In the last few pages this thread has turned into a cesspool of "you vs. I" rather than actual takes based on factual information. No need to further the issue.

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Some quotes from players/managers in The Athletic's article today:

“If doctors OK us playing, it would mean they know this plan really well,” Rockies third baseman Nolan Arenado said. “And that makes me more confident about it.”

“Some of this would most likely be almost impossible,” Indians manager Terry Francona said. “You can’t keep players six feet apart the entire day. They’re around trainers, for example. Someone might slide into a base.”

 

Reds catcher Tucker Barnhart suggested the Arizona plan could work as a stopgap, a way of beginning the year while hoping for improvement in each team’s hometown.

“I think it will be really hard to pull off,” Barnhart said. “First and foremost, I want to be clear that the safety of not only all involved in this situation, but those around the country and world should be the first thing we are all worried about.

“However, if that means we can be back playing ball earlier than first thought and eventually make it back to our regular home cities as things hopefully start to calm down, then I believe that it is something that I could absolutely get behind. I want to play.”

“I think we should do anything we can to get baseball back and into focus for the fans and world,” Braves pitcher Cole Hamels said. “Sports helps give people entertainment and something to look forward to, so they can get through tough times.”

“I think it is an interesting concept that brings hope to a dark situation in our country,” Athletics shortstop Marcus Semien said. “There are brilliant minds, including high-ranking medical officials, formulating this plan as we speak, but it is still a rough draft. The ideas are sound, and I am confident that our union will provide all of the information soundly as it comes in.”

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The six feet apart thing has to be relaxed for this to work. You can't have guys sitting in the stands cooking themselves or be worried about guys coming near each other on the field. The doctors and specialists will need to decide if the risk is low enough but the assumption is that there will be more relaxed restrictions in place by June in most parts of the country. If the experts and the government are comfortable relaxing social distancing for everyday life then they should have enough confidence to relax them for baseball, especially If everyone involved is being tested regularly and they are all living in an isolated location in a part of the country with a low amount of incidents. Whether the players and the union buy in is another story but it seems like they aren't totally shutting it down at this time.

 

 

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I want baseball as much as the rest of us do here, but this idea that MLB is talking about is just stupid...

I would rather just cancel the season than to risk anyone unnecessarily...

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9 hours ago, desert86 said:

And that's a fine approach to take on an individual level.  However he's painting the picture of people expecting a 2020 season as seeing unicorns and rainbows and his own view as realism and not negativity.  In reality people are working on having a 2020 season.  In reality players and owners want to make money on the 2020 season.  It's fine not to believe it will happen and be pleasantly surprised when it does, but don't paint that as reality.

agreed.

6 hours ago, Backdoor Slider said:

This 1000%. Seems literally everyone from MLB baseball to the doctors who study this stuff believe there will be some sort of baseball this year, in some capacity. Why is it the person who disagrees with them is somehow cemented in reality, while those of us who are listening and seem to think things look promising, even if it’s June or July and a 100 game season, are painted as “believing in unicorns”? That’s absolute BS and deserves to be called out every time. 

agreed. thank you. every time it will be called out.. it goes both ways..

6 hours ago, Backdoor Slider said:

 

Being skeptical is fine. But there’s enough thoughts on both sides that painting people who listen to others are believing in “unicorns and rainbows” is a BS thing to say with absolutely no standing. That’s the point. Simmons and Clemens are no experts. If Dr. Fauci appears to see some version of the plan plausible, meaning he believes some baseball could happen, forgive me if I listen to that.

I find this funny, because when Fauci speaks and says everyone needs to do this. this, and that.. the world sits.. listens.. and agrees.. but when Fauci sees promise in the return of baseball via this plan.. those same people now discredit him.. what a crock..

6 hours ago, tonycpsu said:

 

That's *your* point, maybe.  You and several others here seem to want to prolong this conversation about who's sufficiently optimistic, pessimistic, or realistic instead of simply accepting that we all have different views of what's feasible.  I was merely sharing a link from someone who might not be an expert on epidemiology, but is far more qualified to talk about baseball.  I happen to think some version of baseball could probably work once we're well over the hump and have sufficient testing in place, but I'm not here to participate in this particular pissing match.

It goes both ways man.. i do agree that people have gotten away from the convo (myself included).. but if my posts are going to be edited/removed for those same things you are allowing among others directed to those who are optimistic.. well.. thats just wrong.

5 hours ago, Backdoor Slider said:

 

Lol.

So a poster said “He was being pragmatic and not believing in unicorns,” and then went on some strawman about rainbows and roses if baseball isn’t back in a few weeks (not one person said that), then followed that those listening to plans are living in a “dream-colored world.” But I’m the one not accepting the reality that we all have different views. 
 

Ok, Tony. Have a good one. ✌🏼

thank you.

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9 minutes ago, jonninho said:

It goes both ways man.. i do agree that people have gotten away from the convo (myself included).. but if my posts are going to be edited/removed for those same things you are allowing among others directed to those who are optimistic.. well.. thats just wrong.

 

Actually, I didn't edit or remove BBT's post, or Backdoor Slider's, or anything else in this thread recently.  I simply shared my view that recent comments were trending more in the direction of disparaging other members and not discussing the underlying issue.

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