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Coronavirus (COVID-19) Baseball Impact

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Just now, HOOTIE said:

SI obtained a copy of it. At least they claim they did.

We just disagree.

 

But you haven't seen it.  It's disingenuous to claim that you know the kinds of details you're claiming to.

We do.  I can agree to disagree.

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Just going off what Tom Verducci claims was in it.

Take it up with him.

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11 minutes ago, HOOTIE said:

Just going off what Tom Verducci claims was in it.

Take it up with him.

Share the link, I haven't seen it.

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4 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

Why do people hate those with money?

And then want to steal it from them?

Taxes, socialism 

The average salary is 4.4 mil

To play a kids game.

To work 3 hours a day.

The players are greedy, spoiled, little blake snells..

Dont play you stupid chumps.

Watch next year, when owners say, no to free agency.

This isn't coal miners actually working and risking their lives 12 hours a day 

It's a bunch of arragant babies, spitting sunflower seeds 3 hours a day, complaining that they can't play for 3 mil.

There no crying in bb.

If you think athletes work 3 hours a day, you are all sorts of misinformed.

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7 minutes ago, WaKe21334 said:

If you think athletes work 3 hours a day, you are all sorts of misinformed.

Yes, I get the training, pre game reps, BP, etc.

But its not exactly 12 hours in a sweat shop, or working a farm.

 

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Lets see where this counter offer goes... If the union is set on having the season begin June 30th, this will be a make or break week for the 2020 MLB season.

I personally believe (not that it matters) that a deal gets done in the next week or so, i think the players/owners are human.. and they are hearing all the stories either through ESPN/other media source/family/friends about the long term affect a lost season would have on them. No one in this situation can think short term, and because of that, i do believe both sides will man up, negotiate, and get it done for the betterment of their futures, the games future and the players of tomorrow.

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The proposal is so bad, that's why they put it out on a Sunday. 

114 games costs the owners more, and gets them the same income as 82 games.

Starting post season late, makes it more risky.

Deferred payments?

Did Tony Clark go on a weekend drinking binge?

This offer is nothing serious.

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6 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

The proposal is so bad, that's why they put it out on a Sunday. 

114 games costs the owners more, and gets them the same income as 82 games.

Starting post season late, makes it more risky.

Deferred payments?

Did Tony Clark go on a weekend drinking binge?

This offer is nothing serious.

 

This was a counter offer to the owners equally ridiculous starting offer.

 

 

If the owners had started with a serious offer,  they might have received a serious counter offer.

And the owners have already started contracting minor league teams and jobs.  Both sides should be able to come together on an agreement for this season if they want.  The real fight is going to be about changing when the players can become free agents and the rules around that. 

That fight happens when the CBA expires after the 2021 season.  The owners seem to be gauging if the players can stick together or not.

 

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13 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

Yes, I get the training, pre game reps, BP, etc.

But its not exactly 12 hours in a sweat shop, or working a farm.

 

It is extremely ball breaking work. From the diets, there is a reason only a handful of people can make it to that level. The fact that you are downplaying players importance is mind boggling.

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Posted (edited)

Important note, in this counteroffer, the Union has displayed more good faith by offering salary deferrals for the playoffs for two years than the owners have displayed throughout these negotiations.

While some owners have done their right thing by their employees, others have furloughed or laid off thousands of minor leaguers and employees, some major leaguers like David Price have offered to pay them out of their own pocket.

The onus is on the owners to offer some sort of compromise on their part.

Edited by JE7HorseGod
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So under this proposal, players considered to be "high risk" have the option to opt out and not play. That makes sense. It also says any other players can opt out, not be paid, but still get service time. That sucks for leagues that already drafted. I wonder how many players there are that would be considered high risk? I know David Dahl is one that I had read about due to having his spleen removed. 

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15 hours ago, HOOTIE said:

Yes, I get the training, pre game reps, BP, etc.

But its not exactly 12 hours in a sweat shop, or working a farm.

So, what exactly is your point? If that's your baseline than any amount of money they make over an average american salary will likely be too much, on your terms at least. 

I don't get the hate for the players in all this, or people calling them big babies because they don't just take whatever the ownership group gives them and play ball. 

Do people realize that money is going into the hands of the owners instead? Ticket prices aren't going back down, beer prices, nachos, etc. If that money isn't going to the players it's going to the owners. 

I don't blame them 1 iota for this situation, nor will I have any animosity towards the players union or players if this season doesn't happen. The ownership group wants to scream losses but won't open the books to show it? They want to negotiate in good faith and the players union take them at their words, but they've not done anything to earn that. 

I want there to be baseball, but this isn't on the players for not just taking whatever dollars they can get and playing. 

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On 5/29/2020 at 10:02 PM, SuperJoint said:

Yeah I've made posts like this and been roasted for it - you likely will receive the same. 

In any case - I agree. Can't help it - been watching MLB for 40 years and agree. 

It's amazing that so many feel so sorry for the players. They are being treated so bad, lol. They always hate on the guy who has the money, owners. They want to spend the owners money, like its theirs. It's not yours folks, it's the owners. And they can choose to run their business as they see fit. 

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1 minute ago, HOOTIE said:

they can choose to run their business as they see fit. 

They can, and right now they're veering towards running it into the ground.

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43 minutes ago, sngehl01 said:

So, what exactly is your point? If that's your baseline than any amount of money they make over an average american salary will likely be too much, on your terms at least. 

I don't get the hate for the players in all this, or people calling them big babies because they don't just take whatever the ownership group gives them and play ball. 

Do people realize that money is going into the hands of the owners instead? Ticket prices aren't going back down, beer prices, nachos, etc. If that money isn't going to the players it's going to the owners. 

I don't blame them 1 iota for this situation, nor will I have any animosity towards the players union or players if this season doesn't happen. The ownership group wants to scream losses but won't open the books to show it? They want to negotiate in good faith and the players union take them at their words, but they've not done anything to earn that. 

I want there to be baseball, but this isn't on the players for not just taking whatever dollars they can get and playing. 

But the owners are losing everything that goes into the gate receipts which is used to partially pay players salaries 

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The Nationals owner announced he was going to cut minor league stipends to $300 a week from $400.

The players, led by Sean Doolittle, responded and said they would pay the difference out of their own pocket.

Ted Lerner, the Nats owner, is worth 4.3 billion dollars.

The entire Nats payroll this year for their 26 major league players is 161 million dollars, of which they have been guaranteed 4% if the season is cancelled, or 6,440,000 total, or an average of 262k per player.

This ultimately resulted in the Lerner's being shamed into shelling out the additional $100 per week.

Yet some are talking about the players not showing good faith.

Hilarious.

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20 minutes ago, Triple Short Of a Cycle said:

But the owners are losing everything that goes into the gate receipts which is used to partially pay players salaries 

Why bring honest dialogue into play?

The only thing the pariahs scream is, show us your books.

 

 

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Just now, HOOTIE said:

Why bring honest dialogue into play?

The only thing the pariahs scream is, show us your books.

 

 

What "honest dialogue?"

Obviously there will be losses with no attendance.  Everyone agrees on that.

How much?  How much is left from TV deals?

"We won't tell you.  Take our word for it on how much you'll make.  Operate in good faith."  LOL.

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3 minutes ago, JE7HorseGod said:

What "honest dialogue?"

Obviously there will be losses with no attendance.  Everyone agrees on that.

How much?  How much is left from TV deals?

"We won't tell you.  Take our word for it on how much you'll make.  Operate in good faith."  LOL.

So then base it on a %. Whatever the % of losses from the gate factor that into a players salary and I agree with you that these teams books should have been public knowledge years ago

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Just now, Triple Short Of a Cycle said:

So then base it on a %. Whatever the % of losses from the gate factor that into a players salary and I agree with you that these teams books should have been public knowledge years ago

I actually think revenue share COULD be a reasonable ask, IF owners are transparent about revenues.  Other leagues do it.  The Union hates the concept, which I do think is an antiquated stance and could be holding the game back.

But it's an insane ask if they don't open their books.  No one in their right mind would agree to it without transparency.

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This isn't a court of law.

What makes you think the owners have to prove things to the players, showing books?

Why would one owner, want his business known to the other 29?

If I had a business, I'm not showing my books to the competition.

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Just now, HOOTIE said:

This isn't a court of law.

What makes you think the owners have to prove things to the players, showing books?

Why would one owner, want his business known to the other 29?

If I had a business, I'm not showing my books to the competition.

Dude, the owners are already transparent with one another on these financials.  They participate in a 48% local revenue share.

They just aren't with anyone else.  Including the people they have asked to participate in a revenue share model, the players.

That's why this is nuts, and they're being unreasonable.

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