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The 7th Beatles

2020 Owner / Player Negotiations

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, duke of queens said:

16 teams is just absurd.

Yes it is...been saying that whether it was 50, 80 or anything in between.  What it amounts to is a glorified exhibition season where half the league makes the playoffs and all the contenders (barring some awful start, massive amount of stars opting out or a huge number of injuries) will be be able to coast into the post-season.  They get their expanded playoffs and TV revenue, but it makes the MLB like the NBA playoff-wise and that is not a good thing imo.

Edited by secretagentman
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Justinrlstn said:

wonder what this mean for minor leagues.

There is no minor league season that we know of.  Not official but it has been the assumption from both sides from the get go there won't be any.  It's going to be a nightmare enough to keep the MLB teams going during covid-19 let alone trying to play minor league ball.  In fact most if not all MLB organizations have already committed to paying their minor leaguers $400 per week until the end of what would have been their season.  Some even past that date.

But from the beginning it has been proposed that some of the top prospects on each team would probably go into a pool of players in reserve who will practice with the big league club so they could be ready to come in if injuries happen on the MLB roster.

Perhaps training camps may be an option too for a few other players but I don't see how they can play minor league seasons during a pandemic.

Edited by The Big Bat Theory
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4 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

There is no minor league season that we know of.  Not official but it has been the assumption from both sides from the get go there won't be any.  It's going to be a nightmare enough to keep the MLB teams going during covid-19 let alone trying to play minor league ball.  In fact most if not all MLB organizations have already committed to paying their minor leaguers $400 per week until the end of what would have been their season.  Some even past that date.

But from the beginning it has been proposed that some of the top prospects on each team would probably go into a pool of players in reserve who will practice with the big league club so they could be ready to come in if injuries happen on the MLB roster.

Perhaps training camps may be an option too for a few other players but I don't see how they can play minor league seasons during a pandemic.

Minor leagues games are not happening...it is a feta compli for all intents and purposes as the minor leagues do not have the resources to operate in these conditions as without fans, they get virtually no income.  MLB announced today it is giving another 1M to cover minor league player salaries. 

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, secretagentman said:

feta compli

Mmmm...delicious cheesy French malapropisms...

Edited by JE7HorseGod
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Yeah I should also add regards minor leaguers some could be part of the active roster coming out of the gate since early on it had been proposed to up the active roster this year because of the shortened re-spring training and possibility of more double headers.  Double headers don't seem to be a "thing" so far in this proposed deal but I could still see more than 26 players per roster to start a shortened season because of pitchers and having to baby their unstretched arms stuff because of shorter training time.

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Not gonna complain one bit about a 16 team postseason. I’ll be thrilled if they make it through the “season” without getting derailed by Covid-19. I’ll be even more thrilled if they make it through the postseason. And now as a Royals fan, suddenly a playoff berth is no longer an impossibility!
 

 

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29 minutes ago, secretagentman said:

Actually it is amazing what happens when common sense is forced upon people and both sides have a mutual interest to get something done.  If true, a 60 game deal (all of 10 more games) could have been had 2-3 weeks ago in all likelihood.  Imo, it appears the MLBPA finally woke up to the fact that 30-40% is better than zero and all the bad press.  In hindsight, you have to wonder why all the bickering and all the grief just for an extra 10 games.  I guess the players felt they could dictate terms to the owners and now they realize that their power to do some has limits.

We'll probably look at this as a dress rehearsal for the 2021-2022 offseason in hindsight.

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1 minute ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

Yeah I should also add regards minor leaguers some could be part of the active roster coming out of the gate since early on it had been proposed to up the active roster this year because of the shortened re-spring training and possibility of more double headers.  Double headers don't seem to be a "thing" so far in this proposed deal but I could still see more than 26 players per roster to start a shortened season because of pitchers and having to baby their unstretched arms stuff because of shorter training time.

Plus with no minor leagues, replacing injured players is going to be more of an issue if you do not have some sort of carry\reserve squad\extra roster spots.  You can't expect someone who has not played all year to step in and take over so they are going to have to do something I would think to carry enough reserve players that can cover all positions and a couple of extra pitchers at a min even if it is in some sort of non-active reserve squad that trains with the team.  No idea how they plan on handling that.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, meh2 said:

Not gonna complain one bit about a 16 team postseason. I’ll be thrilled if they make it through the “season” without getting derailed by Covid-19. I’ll be even more thrilled if they make it through the postseason. And now as a Royals fan, suddenly a playoff berth is no longer an impossibility!

Given even the re-building Royals have a chance I'd say the 16 team format is more a way to try and get back disgruntled fans to watch baseball again this season and next.

Yes the extra games for revenue but that could have gone into regular season games.  Expending the playoffs is more about re-capturing the fan base.

Edited by The Big Bat Theory
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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

 

Yes the extra games for revenue but that could have gone into regular season games.  Expending the playoffs is more about re-capturing the fan base.

I think it is primarily about capturing more TV revenue from the playoffs.  Yes it may stir some extra interest in the post-season, but that is sort of meaningless imo as it waters down the regular season so much.  If for example a first place team with 105 wins ends up having to play a 3 or 5 game series with an 8th seed for example that won 80 games and loses because of a couple of bad bounces or a pitcher or two having bad games (which happens all the time), it will piss off the fans of the 105 W team quite a bit I should think.  You have to have a happy balance between not making it so hard to make the playoffs it limits interest to a few teams and making so easy the regular season is an exhibition match like the NBA and the post season becomes to a great degree a function of luck.  Having more than half the league make the playoffs is tilted too much to the latter imo.

My 2 cents.

Edited by secretagentman

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39 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

There is no minor league season that we know of.  Not official but it has been the assumption from both sides from the get go there won't be any.  It's going to be a nightmare enough to keep the MLB teams going during covid-19 let alone trying to play minor league ball.  In fact most if not all MLB organizations have already committed to paying their minor leaguers $400 per week until the end of what would have been their season.  Some even past that date.

But from the beginning it has been proposed that some of the top prospects on each team would probably go into a pool of players in reserve who will practice with the big league club so they could be ready to come in if injuries happen on the MLB roster.

Perhaps training camps may be an option too for a few other players but I don't see how they can play minor league seasons during a pandemic.

 

If no minor league season, will it count against a minor league players service time? Or will this just be a mulligan (so jealous of secretagentman use of feta compli) 

I honestly thought this season was done once it was reported something along the lines of 6 owners okay with no season. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Justinrlstn said:

 

If no minor league season, will it count against a minor league players service time? Or will this just be a mulligan (so jealous of secretagentman use of feta compli) 

I honestly thought this season was done once it was reported something along the lines of 6 owners okay with no season. 

 

Wish I spelled it right lol...fait accompli

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1 hour ago, secretagentman said:

Wish I spelled it right lol...fait accompli

Pobody's nerfect.

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The negotiations if accepted have spring training to start on June 29th.  Also some REALLY GOOD NEWS about the proposal:

Quote

Joel Sherman of the New York Post reports that MLB's proposal includes the universal designated hitter not just for the 2020 season but the 2021 season, as well.

The MLBPA has been in favor of a universal DH since it would add another high-paid job to many rosters, so they are likely to be fine with this part of the proposal. With the CBA set to expire after the 2021 campaign, it's possible we have seen the last of the pitcher batting altogether. Sherman also notes that, in addition to the offer of full prorated salaries for 60 games for the players, there is also a $25 million postseason pool.

Source: Joel Sherman on Twitter                  Jun 17, 2020, 5:57 PM ET

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!  No more boring NL bottom of the line-up innings!  Maybe all of this stupid negotiations has been worth it in the end!

Time to go emo crazy to celebrate!  😃😁😜😻💥👍

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13 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

The negotiations if accepted have spring training to start on June 29th.  Also some REALLY GOOD NEWS about the proposal:

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!  No more boring NL bottom of the line-up innings!  Maybe all of this stupid negotiations has been worth it in the end!

Time to go emo crazy to celebrate!  😃😁😜😻💥👍

I hope it's the first step toward specialization. Let hitters hit and fielders field. I know it'll take decades or longer, but no one wants to watch an at bat from a backup catcher with a .589 OPS. Likewise, no one wants to watch a roided up slugger stumble around in left field.

If baseball actually cared about ratings and popularity, they'd slowly ease away from this everybody does everything nonsense. 

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41 minutes ago, The Big Bat Theory said:

The negotiations if accepted have spring training to start on June 29th.  Also some REALLY GOOD NEWS about the proposal:

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!  No more boring NL bottom of the line-up innings!  Maybe all of this stupid negotiations has been worth it in the end!

Time to go emo crazy to celebrate!  😃😁😜😻💥👍

It is no secret that the ONLY reason the NL has insisted on not having a DH all these years was because NL owners did not want to pay extra money to another hitter.  Basically, they are cheap.  All the nonsense being spewed about strategy for pitchers and when to take them out was just a smoke screen imo.  As much of a traditionalist as I am, NOBODY who looks at it objectively can want to see some 20-30M a year arm go out and swing a bat while hitting the temperature and risking an injury. 

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, ajs723 said:

I hope it's the first step toward specialization. Let hitters hit and fielders field. I know it'll take decades or longer, but no one wants to watch an at bat from a backup catcher with a .589 OPS. Likewise, no one wants to watch a roided up slugger stumble around in left field.

If baseball actually cared about ratings and popularity, they'd slowly ease away from this everybody does everything nonsense. 

So by that definition then, they should fill out about a couple of 100 spots and have lefty/righty specialists at each position...or even better, let's have 9 hitters who have never seen a mitt and 8 position players who have never seen a bat.  Add in maybe 15-20 pitchers with different pitch repertoires for every occasion.  Curve ball specialist...slider specialist...off speed specialist...flame thrower...lefty righty for each...Maybe a couple of extra Cs, one with a great arm, one who can call a good game for certain pitchers, etc.  And maybe we can have 4 or 5 managers and rotate them in based on opposition match-up stats. 

 

Seriously, while few want to see a pitcher hit imo, no one wants a team of DHs and Mark Bellangers either imo.

Edited by secretagentman
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5 hours ago, meh2 said:

Not gonna complain one bit about a 16 team postseason. I’ll be thrilled if they make it through the “season” without getting derailed by Covid-19. I’ll be even more thrilled if they make it through the postseason. And now as a Royals fan, suddenly a playoff berth is no longer an impossibility!
 

 

2020 World Series champs!😂

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2 hours ago, secretagentman said:

So by that definition then, they should fill out about a couple of 100 spots and have lefty/righty specialists at each position...or even better, let's have 9 hitters who have never seen a mitt and 8 position players who have never seen a bat.  Add in maybe 15-20 pitchers with different pitch repertoires for every occasion.  Curve ball specialist...slider specialist...off speed specialist...flame thrower...lefty righty for each...Maybe a couple of extra Cs, one with a great arm, one who can call a good game for certain pitchers, etc.  And maybe we can have 4 or 5 managers and rotate them in based on opposition match-up stats. 

 

Seriously, while few want to see a pitcher hit imo, no one wants a team of DHs and Mark Bellangers either imo.

Yeah, because who wants to see people who are the absolute best of the best at what they do when they watch sports. I wish Tom Brady had to play CB once a series. 

While I'm asking for the sport to make sense. Get rid of batting orders. Let the best hitters lead off every inning. Lakers are down three with 1 second left in game seven of the NBA finals. This is what why we watch sports... too bad it's Javale McGee's turn to shoot. Oh well. With two outs in the bottom of the tenth inning of game seven of the World Series, the Cubs won by getting out... some scrub whose name I can't remember. Shouldn't be this way, but I'm 50 years too early with this take.

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I want to say it was Michael Martinez who made the last out for Cleveland. Didn't check to make sure but Chicago baseball fans remember dumb tidbits.

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8 hours ago, secretagentman said:

Seriously, while few want to see a pitcher hit imo, no one wants a team of DHs and Mark Bellangers either imo.

I would, that sounds way more compelling then watching some hacker come up there once every three innings who can't hit above the Mendoza line but he's good at turning 2 at 2B.

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it’s not going to happen. Watch 

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